From:
'Craig Chambers' soundtracks: Zoning, Deadly Care
>And the remake of Tyger and most of the compilations.
'Remake' or 'Re-issue'? If it is a remake, should I plop down the $15 for
the new one? I have the original Caroline releases on vinyl and CD. I am
one of the few (I think) who actually think this is a classic (at least the
instrumental parts). I think the build-up to the 'climax' of Edgar's guitar
in London is one of the most intense moments these guys have ever recorded.
If this was 'remade' I certainly want to hear it...
Craig C. (not Cordroy, the other one ;-)
Replies
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Date
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18756
Re: album owners' numbers
Owens James
Mon
11/1/1999
2 KB
18757
Re: album owners' numbers
Craig Chambers
Mon
11/1/1999
1 KB
18767
Re: album owners' numbers
Jared White
Mon
11/1/1999
2 KB
18768
Re: album owners' numbers
Michael W. Daniels
Mon
11/1/1999
1 KB
18774
Re: album owners' numbers
Owens James
Mon
11/1/1999
1 KB
From:
Owens James -----Original Message-----
> >From: Owens James
> > I found 2 places on the net, one selling
> >for $56, the other $62.
>
> But have you asked if they got it.
>
> Kees
>
From:
'Thomas' From: Gustavo Jobim
>
>Sorry to disturb you with this cross-posted msg, but this is a bit important.
>
>Can you recommend me a good software which can remove the hiss from LPs and
>cassetes? It would be even better if it was a freeware.
>
>thanks
>gfj.
>
>gfj.
>
>Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
>gustavfj@m...
>gustavfj@n...
Replies
Name/Email
Yahoo! ID
Date
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18755
SV: OT: Hiss removal software
Thomas
Mon
11/1/1999
2 KB
18762
Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
Gustavo Jobim
Mon
11/1/1999
1 KB
18764
Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
PNaunton@a...
Mon
11/1/1999
1 KB
18772
Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
Craig Chambers
Mon
11/1/1999
2 KB
18773
Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
Gustavo Jobim
Mon
11/1/1999
1 KB
18785
Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
Synthhtnys@xxx.xxx
Tue
11/2/1999
1 KB
18786
Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Tue
11/2/1999
1 KB
18788
Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Tue
11/2/1999
1 KB
18789
Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
Synthhtnys@xxx.xxx
Tue
11/2/1999
1 KB
From:
'Craig Chambers'
Date: Mon Nov 1, 1999 3:55
pm
Subject: Re: OT: Hiss removal software
>Anyway, that's just me defending the wonderful vinyl. It can still today
outperform CD by a wide margin, if played back on the right equipment.
Yeah, there is absolutely nothing like having to get up every 15 minutes (in
TD's case) and flip the vinyl over to hear the continuation of the
music...(just kidding, Thomas)
>These are of course matters of taste, and I'm not saying that my opinion is
the law, but I am yet to hear the CD player that can outperform my vinyl
player.
I think the demise of the LP was primarily driven by 2 things:
1) Convenience
2) Durability
I have no qualms that a 'pristine' analog source on the right equipment has
a much more superior sound. I think Gustavo's situation is that he is 16
(right?), does not have a lot of money, lives in Brazil (where it is about
as difficult to find decent music, as in Atlanta), and unfortunately, in his
passionately fervent attempt to collect the music of 'his' newly discovered
TD, he has to resort to picking up second (or third, or fourth)-hand copies
on vinyl. He probably does not have access to a $1000 turntable...
Hence, he was looking for an easy, affordable way of transferring his vinyl
to a digital medium, which will allow him to 'clean-up' some of the inherent
problems with 'used' vinyl. Gustavo, check out 'Cool Edit 96', which is
available from www.downloads.com as a limited shareware version. Full
upgrade is available for something like $29 US. This will do quite a bit by
way of cleaning up vinyl source, however, keep in mind, anytime you run a
source through a 'filter' of any kind, you will lose something. De-hissers
and De-clickers usually affect the high end and give you the sound as if you
are listening through a 'tin can'...so, use with caution. Sometimes a
little hiss is better than some funky harmonics hitting your ears.
From:
'Thomas'
Date: Mon Nov 1, 1999 5:11
pm
Subject: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
>From: 'Craig Chambers'
>
>I have no qualms that a 'pristine' analog source on the right equipment has
>a much more superior sound. I think Gustavo's situation is that he is 16
>(right?), does not have a lot of money, lives in Brazil (where it is about
>as difficult to find decent music, as in Atlanta), and unfortunately, in his
>passionately fervent attempt to collect the music of 'his' newly discovered
>TD, he has to resort to picking up second (or third, or fourth)-hand copies
>on vinyl. He probably does not have access to a $1000 turntable...
Craig,
you're right of course. Sometimes I don't think as far as I'd like to... Thanks
for pointing it out.
Gustavo,
sorry if I got a little bit carried away. I usually become pretty emotional
when it comes to my dear vinyl. Could you contact me offlist please?
I'll be at pinnacles@u...
Cheers
Thomas
Sweden
Replies
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Yahoo! ID
Date
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18762
Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
Gustavo Jobim
Mon
11/1/1999
1 KB
18764
Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
PNaunton@a...
Mon
11/1/1999
1 KB
18772
Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
Craig Chambers
Mon
11/1/1999
2 KB
18773
Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
Gustavo Jobim
Mon
11/1/1999
1 KB
18785
Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
Synthhtnys@xxx.xxx
Tue
11/2/1999
1 KB
18786
Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Tue
11/2/1999
1 KB
18788
Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Tue
11/2/1999
1 KB
18789
Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
Synthhtnys@xxx.xxx
Tue
11/2/1999
1 KB
18799
Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Tue
11/2/1999
1 KB
From:
Owens James
Date: Mon Nov 1, 1999 4:18
pm
Subject: RE: Re: album owners' numbers
Their is indeed a remake of Tyger. It includes a re-mix of the Tyger track
and a new track. As far as I know the other tracks are the same. Here's
the info from Dave Datta's short TD discography:
1992 Tyger
5.09 Tyger [1]
14.21 London
12.01 Alchemy Of The Heart
5.54 Smile
4.48 21st Century Common Man Part I
3.57 21st Century Common Man Part II
4.56 Vigour [2]
[1] This is a complete re-working of the song.
[2] New song for 1992 release, by Jerome Froese.
CD Relativity (1992) 88561-1055-2
If TDI ever re-issues Tyger, it will probably be this version. I am anxious
to hear this version myself, since 'Tyger' is the only track on the album
that I get tired of hearing. London is decent and the instumental part is
awesome! Alchemy of the Heart and 21st Century Common Man are great. Smile
is the best track on the disc though. Superb mix of vocals and music, nice
ethereal atmosphere almost worthy of Rubycon.
As I said, I've never heard the re-mix edition, so I'm quite anxious to do
so.
James
> -----Original Message-----
> From: 'Craig Chambers'
>
> >And the remake of Tyger and most of the compilations.
>
> 'Remake' or 'Re-issue'? If it is a remake, should I plop down the $15 for
> the new one? I have the original Caroline releases on vinyl and CD. I am
> one of the few (I think) who actually think this is a classic (at least
> the
> instrumental parts). I think the build-up to the 'climax' of Edgar's
> guitar
> in London is one of the most intense moments these guys have ever
> recorded.
> If this was 'remade' I certainly want to hear it...
>
From:
'Craig Chambers'
Date: Mon Nov 1, 1999 4:39
pm
Subject: Re: Re: album owners' numbers
Okay, so the song 'Tyger', not the complete album is remade...this makes a
bit more sense. So now I REALLY have to decide whether or not to spend the
cash, if you were to say the complete album was redone...
Craig
>From: Owens James
>
>Their is indeed a remake of Tyger. It includes a re-mix of the Tyger track
>and a new track. As far as I know the other tracks are the same. Here's
>the info from Dave Datta's short TD discography:
BTW, I too like 'Smile'...
From:
'twosheds'
Date: Mon Nov 1, 1999 6:12
pm
Subject: Re: Two TD lists?
Does this mean that the UWP list is dead? :-(
Scott
NP: Phish, Mansfield, MA 7/8/94
Replies
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Yahoo! ID
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18759
Re: Two TD lists?
Owens James
Mon
11/1/1999
1 KB
From:
Owens James
Date: Mon Nov 1, 1999 6:26
pm
Subject: RE: Re: Two TD lists?
yes
> -----Original Message-----
> From: twosheds [SMTP:twosheds@g...]
> Does this mean that the UWP list is dead? :-(
>
From:
Klaus Beschorner
Date: Mon Nov 1, 1999 6:22
pm
Subject: Time to say goodbye...
Friends,
nothing in this world is forever, especially not on the
internet. IBM has sold off it's internet business, so my
good old Email address of klaus@i... soon will be no
more.
Time to update your address books, you can now reach me as
klaus@c...
that is, caby like 'kay be' or 'kb', my initials, 'de' for
Germany. I hope to keep this domain for a long time.
For the TD fans among you, below is my new homepage address.
My leg's in a cast after a sports injury, but I'm getting
better. Maybe four more weeks...
all the best
klaus
--
Klaus.Beschorner........................work....+49-7033-45683
Drosselweg.6............................fax.....+49-7033-45631
D-71120.Grafenau........................Mobile.+49-171-7338969
Germany.................................home....+49-7033-45142
.....................................http://www.caby.de/music/
From:
Gustavo Jobim
Date: Mon Nov 1, 1999 7:40
pm
Subject: Re: OT: Hiss removal software
>>I think Gustavo's situation is that he is 16 (right?),
Actually, I went 17 last 29th.
>>does not have a lot of money,
Very true.
>> lives in Brazil (where it is about as difficult to find decent music, as
in Atlanta),
at least our beloved classic
electronic/progressive-instrumental-rock-à-la-Oldfield music - KS, KW, JMJ,
TD, JS, MO. the standard stores simply doesn't have that, or have some very
sparse - oxygene 7-13 for example is common, as well as mo's tb3 and XXV
some other new releases, and 4 of kw's albums which were rereleased last
year because they went here for the free jazz festival.
>> and unfortunately, in his
>passionately fervent attempt to collect the music of 'his' newly discovered
>TD,
Actually, I want to pass Wuivend Riet to CD...
>> he has to resort to picking up second (or third, or fourth)-hand copies
>on vinyl. He probably does not have access to a $1000 turntable...
Surely I don't.
>Hence, he was looking for an easy, affordable way of transferring his vinyl
>to a digital medium, which will allow him to 'clean-up' some of the inherent
>problems with 'used' vinyl. Gustavo, check out 'Cool Edit 96', which is
>available from www.downloads.com as a limited shareware version. Full
>upgrade is available for something like $29 US. This will do quite a bit by
>way of cleaning up vinyl source, however, keep in mind, anytime you run a
>source through a 'filter' of any kind, you will lose something. De-hissers
>and De-clickers usually affect the high end and give you the sound as if you
>are listening through a 'tin can'...so, use with caution. Sometimes a
>little hiss is better than some funky harmonics hitting your ears.
(C.Chambers)
I'm aware of this danger. Thanks you all for the help.
Well, maybe I don't use a de-hisser for wuivend riet; it's not as complex
as some TD albums.
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Gustavo Jobim
Date: Mon Nov 1, 1999 7:45
pm
Subject: Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
Hey, no problems at all.
I also like the vinyl sound better than the CD (of course, if the vinyl is
in good conditions).
My Jarre Live, for example, is in near mint conditions; It's like a brand
new cd.
>Gustavo,
>
>sorry if I got a little bit carried away. I usually become pretty
emotional when it comes to my dear vinyl. Could you contact me offlist please?
>
>I'll be at pinnacles@u...
>
>Cheers
>
>Thomas
>Sweden
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Klaus Beschorner
Date: Mon Nov 1, 1999 8:12
pm
Subject: ...oops, typo in the homepage address
Just a little typo, please use the homepage address
below (if you want to...)
cheers
klaus (now klaus@c...)
--
Klaus.Beschorner........................work....+49-7033-45683
Drosselweg.6............................fax.....+49-7033-45631
D-71120.Grafenau........................Mobile.+49-171-7338969
Germany.................................home....+49-7033-45142
............................................http://www.caby.de
Replies
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Yahoo! ID
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18881
Re: ...oops, typo in the homepage address
Joe Shoults
Thu
11/4/1999
2 KB
From:
PNaunton@a...
Date: Mon Nov 1, 1999 8:33
pm
Subject: Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
In a message dated 01-11-1999 10:29:17 AM EST, t.h.o.m.a.s@t... writes:
<< These are of course matters of taste, and I'm not saying that my opinion
is the law, but I am yet to hear the CD player that can outperform my vinyl
player.
Cheers,
Thomas
Sweden
>>
Oh, I don't know about that. I have a $9,000.00 Mark Levinson CD
Player which definitely sounds better than any $150.00 turntable with a
$35.00 Shure M91ED cartridge on it. Of course you DO really have to have
excellent speakers to hear that difference. Not to mention the investment in
quality cables and power conditioners.
Anything with 'Digi-' in it HAS to be cutting edge. (c;
Phil N.
From:
PNaunton@a...
Date: Mon Nov 1, 1999 8:39
pm
Subject: Re: OT: Hiss removal software
In a message dated 01-11-1999 10:48:48 AM EST, craigchambers@c...
writes:
<< I think the demise of the LP was primarily driven by 2 things:
1) Convenience
2) Durability >>
I think it was actually ten things:
1) Convenience
2) Convenience
3) Convenience
4) Convenience
5) Convenience
6) Convenience
7) Convenience
8) Convenience
9) Convenience
10) Convenience
Oh, and don't forget --
11) Convenience
Why should you have to exert any energy to enjoy the things you
love?
Phil N.
From:
'Jim Moore'
Date: Mon Nov 1, 1999 5:47
pm
Subject: Fw: E-News 167 (Nov 1 1999)
Haha... I bet Jerome is grimacing at this news (#6) ...
----- Original Message -----
From: 'GROOVE Unlimited'
> - - - - - - - - - - b e s t s a l e s t o p 1 0 ( w e e k
43 ) - -
> - - - - - - - -
>
> 1: Stearns, Michael - Ancient Leaves (CD)
> 2: Roedelius & Alquimia - Move & Resonate (CD)
> 3: Tangerine Dream - Mars Polaris (CD)
> 4: Free System Projekt - Pointless reminder (CD)
> 5: Stearns, Michael - Floating Whispers (CD)
> 6: Tangerine Dream - Zeit (CD)
> 7: Dweller at the Threshold - Generation-Transmission-Illumination
> 8: G.E.N.E. - Emotions (CD)
> 9: Waveshape - Live 96/97 (CD)
> 10: Froese, Edgar - Pinnacles (CD)
- jim
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
-
'The dream is always the same...' -- Joel, Risky Business
jimbo@v... -- Jim Moore, Atlanta, Georgia
Home Page: http://www.jimbo.vivid.net
Replies
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Yahoo! ID
Date
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18771
Re: Fw: E-News 167 (Nov 1 1999)
Owens James
Mon
11/1/1999
2 KB
18931
Re: Fw: E-News 167 (Nov 1 1999)
Marcel Engels
Sat
11/6/1999
1 KB
From:
'Jared White'
Date: Mon Nov 1, 1999 8:59
pm
Subject: RE: Re: album owners' numbers
> From: Owens James
>
> Their is indeed a remake of Tyger. It includes a re-mix of
> the Tyger track
> and a new track. As far as I know the other tracks are the
> same. Here's
> the info from Dave Datta's short TD discography:
>
> 1992 Tyger
>
> 5.09 Tyger [1]
> 14.21 London
> 12.01 Alchemy Of The Heart
> 5.54 Smile
> 4.48 21st Century Common Man Part I
> 3.57 21st Century Common Man Part II
> 4.56 Vigour [2]
>
> [1] This is a complete re-working of the song.
> [2] New song for 1992 release, by Jerome Froese.
>
> CD Relativity (1992) 88561-1055-2
Ah! So that's where 'Vigour' on 'The Best of Tangerine Dream: 'The Blue
Years'' comes from! I was wondering what that was all about. I thought
maybe it was an in-house pre-'Melrose' track that Edgar and Jerome
worked on before Jerome officially entered the band, but nope.
Thanks for inadvertently giving me this bit of information!
Take care,
Jared
__________________________________________
Jared White E-mail: jwhite@g...
GaelDesign: http://www.gaeldesign.com
iReview: http://www.gaeldesign.com/ireview
The Digital Fine Art Gallery:
http://www.gaeldesign.com/gallery
Distant Oaks: http://www.distantoaks.com
Personal Site: http://www.sonic.net/~jwhite
Try BeOS Today! http://www.be.com
From:
'Michael W. Daniels'
Date: Mon Nov 1, 1999 9:20
pm
Subject: RE: Re: album owners' numbers
At 12:59 PM 11/1/99 -0800, you wrote:
> > 5.09 Tyger [1]
> > 4.56 Vigour [2]
> >
> > [1] This is a complete re-working of the song.
> > [2] New song for 1992 release, by Jerome Froese.
Anybody know which version of Tyger is on the Sequel 1996 version? That's
what I have, and there's no Vigour on the CD...
Similarly, what's the version on the Dream Roots Collection?
--
Michael W. Daniels | '...I'm a doctor of history.'
daniels@l... | 'You mean you study it.'
Dept. of Linguistics | 'I mean I make it better.'
| -- Continuity Errors
From:
'Thomas'
Date: Mon Nov 1, 1999 10:47
pm
Subject: SV: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
>From: PNaunton@a...
>
>In a message dated 01-11-1999 10:29:17 AM EST, t.h.o.m.a.s@t... writes:
>
><< These are of course matters of taste, and I'm not saying that my opinion
>is the law, but I am yet to hear the CD player that can outperform my vinyl
>player.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Thomas
> Sweden
> >>
> Oh, I don't know about that. I have a $9,000.00 Mark Levinson CD
>Player which definitely sounds better than any $150.00 turntable with a
>$35.00 Shure M91ED cartridge on it. Of course you DO really have to have
>excellent speakers to hear that difference. Not to mention the investment in
>quality cables and power conditioners.
> Anything with 'Digi-' in it HAS to be cutting edge. (c;
>
>Phil N.
Phil,
I'm glad you like your CD! Really glad, but at $9000:- it HAS to be cutting
edge...
I've never compared my turntable to anything that expensive, the best one I
have tried it against was a Forsell Air Reference. It was a close call, but my
turntable had slightly better detail resolution, and high end was a bit
smoother (but the last criteria is of course a matter of taste). The two units
were compared over a pair of Infinity Gamma (or something like that), and
Classé amplification. All interconnects were Nordost Flatline.
Try your CD against say an SME Model 20 / SME V Gold / Clearaudio Gamma S
combination and maybe a Clearaudio phono stage which would probably end up at
about the same money. That would be a fair match.
Since my turntable only cost me about $2000:- I bet your CD would outperform
it. I wish I could afford one!
Have a great day!
Thomas
Sweden
From:
Gustavo Jobim
Date: Mon Nov 1, 1999 10:02
pm
Subject: LP versus CD was a long time ago Re: SV: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
Well, I'm very satisfied with my only CD player, which actually is the
cd-rom drive in my computer. I bought it for about 160 reais (would be
around 80 dollars today), but it now would cost around 40 dollars. My
turntable is very good, although it has no pre-amp. it cost 55 reais
(around 27.50 dollars).
And my only cassete player is my Aiwa walkman. TX-386.
:)
>From: 'Thomas'
>
>>From: PNaunton@a...
>>
>>In a message dated 01-11-1999 10:29:17 AM EST, t.h.o.m.a.s@t... writes:
>>
>><< These are of course matters of taste, and I'm not saying that my opinion
>>is the law, but I am yet to hear the CD player that can outperform my vinyl
>>player.
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Thomas
>> Sweden
>> >>
>> Oh, I don't know about that. I have a $9,000.00 Mark Levinson CD
>>Player which definitely sounds better than any $150.00 turntable with a
>>$35.00 Shure M91ED cartridge on it. Of course you DO really have to have
>>excellent speakers to hear that difference. Not to mention the investment
in
>>quality cables and power conditioners.
>> Anything with 'Digi-' in it HAS to be cutting edge. (c;
>>
>>Phil N.
>
>
>Phil,
>
>I'm glad you like your CD! Really glad, but at $9000:- it HAS to be
cutting edge...
>I've never compared my turntable to anything that expensive, the best one
I have tried it against was a Forsell Air Reference. It was a close call,
but my turntable had slightly better detail resolution, and high end was a
bit smoother (but the last criteria is of course a matter of taste). The
two units were compared over a pair of Infinity Gamma (or something like
that), and Classé amplification. All interconnects were Nordost Flatline.
>Try your CD against say an SME Model 20 / SME V Gold / Clearaudio Gamma S
combination and maybe a Clearaudio phono stage which would probably end up
at about the same money. That would be a fair match.
>Since my turntable only cost me about $2000:- I bet your CD would
outperform it. I wish I could afford one!
>
>Have a great day!
>
>Thomas
>Sweden
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
Replies
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Date
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18775
Re: LP versus CD was a long time ago Re: SV: SV:
Craig Chambers
Mon
11/1/1999
1 KB
18778
Re: LP versus CD was a long time ago Re: SV: SV:
Gustavo Jobim
Mon
11/1/1999
2 KB
From:
Owens James
Date: Mon Nov 1, 1999 10:13
pm
Subject: RE: Fw: E-News 167 (Nov 1 1999)
WOW. Marcel came in just behind Mars Polaris. Congratulations!
I'm amazed that discs as old as Zeit and Pinnacles still make it to the top
10 occasionally.
James
> -----Original Message-----
> From: 'Jim Moore'
>
> Haha... I bet Jerome is grimacing at this news (#6) ...
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: 'GROOVE Unlimited'
> > - - - - - - - - - - b e s t s a l e s t o p 1 0 ( w e e k
> 43 ) - -
> > - - - - - - - -
> >
> > 1: Stearns, Michael - Ancient Leaves (CD)
> > 2: Roedelius & Alquimia - Move & Resonate (CD)
> > 3: Tangerine Dream - Mars Polaris (CD)
> > 4: Free System Projekt - Pointless reminder (CD)
> > 5: Stearns, Michael - Floating Whispers (CD)
> > 6: Tangerine Dream - Zeit (CD)
> > 7: Dweller at the Threshold - Generation-Transmission-Illumination
> > 8: G.E.N.E. - Emotions (CD)
> > 9: Waveshape - Live 96/97 (CD)
> > 10: Froese, Edgar - Pinnacles (CD)
>
> - jim
>
From:
'Craig Chambers'
Date: Mon Nov 1, 1999 10:07
pm
Subject: Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
No offense guys, but this argument is akin to saying 'My $10,000 Rolex keeps
better time than your $8,000 Sothis'
I guess I have to stick to my $200 Seiko, for the time being....
Phil said:
>> Oh, I don't know about that. I have a $9,000.00 Mark Levinson CD
>>Player which definitely sounds better than any $150.00 turntable with a
>>$35.00 Shure M91ED cartridge on it. Of course you DO really have to have
>>excellent speakers to hear that difference. Not to mention the investment
in
>>quality cables and power conditioners.
>> Anything with 'Digi-' in it HAS to be cutting edge. (c;
Thomas said:
>I'm glad you like your CD! Really glad, but at $9000:- it HAS to be cutting
edge...
>I've never compared my turntable to anything that expensive, the best one I
have tried it against was a Forsell Air Reference. It was a close call, but
my turntable had slightly better detail resolution, and high end was a bit
smoother (but the last criteria is of course a matter of taste). The two
units were compared over a pair of Infinity Gamma (or something like that),
and Classé amplification. All interconnects were Nordost Flatline.
>Try your CD against say an SME Model 20 / SME V Gold / Clearaudio Gamma S
combination and maybe a Clearaudio phono stage which would probably end up
at about the same money. That would be a fair match.
>Since my turntable only cost me about $2000:- I bet your CD would
outperform it. I wish I could afford one!
From:
Gustavo Jobim No offense guys, but this argument is akin to saying 'My $10,000 Rolex keeps
>better time than your $8,000 Sothis'
>
>I guess I have to stick to my $200 Seiko, for the time being....
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Owens James -----Original Message-----
>
> Anybody know which version of Tyger is on the Sequel 1996 version? That's
>
> what I have, and there's no Vigour on the CD...
>
> Similarly, what's the version on the Dream Roots Collection?
>
From:
'Craig Chambers' From: Gustavo Jobim
>
>Well, I'm very satisfied with my only CD player, which actually is the
>cd-rom drive in my computer. I bought it for about 160 reais (would be
>around 80 dollars today), but it now would cost around 40 dollars. My
>turntable is very good, although it has no pre-amp. it cost 55 reais
>(around 27.50 dollars).
>And my only cassete player is my Aiwa walkman. TX-386.
>
Just gotta love this guy!
From:
Owens James
From:
'James Horecka, AIA'
From:
Gustavo Jobim >From: Gustavo Jobim
>>
>>Well, I'm very satisfied with my only CD player, which actually is the
>>cd-rom drive in my computer. I bought it for about 160 reais (would be
>>around 80 dollars today), but it now would cost around 40 dollars. My
>>turntable is very good, although it has no pre-amp. it cost 55 reais
>>(around 27.50 dollars).
>>And my only cassete player is my Aiwa walkman. TX-386.
>>
>Just gotta love this guy!
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Gustavo Jobim
From:
'Lawry Simm' Lawry, how could you forget this one? Does Song_Of_The_Whale_Pt1.mid
say
> anything to you? ;-)
> Antonio
Heh heh... you know, one day I might get around to finishing the other
half dozen I have started... and I feel the urge to tart up the old
ones I did... when I listen to them, I can hear many opportunities for
improvement... if only I didn't have to go to work all day! :-)
Lawry
lawrysimm@u...
ICQ # 23267226
Instant Messenger - lawrysimm
From:
James Joystick
From:
'Carl & Jacqui Kearney'
To:
Sent: Monday, November 01, 1999 11:19 PM
Subject: [tadream] Re: LP versus CD was a long time ago
> From: James Joystick
>
> I couldn't resist to drop my cent in this discussion...
>
> I edited a now defunct electronics publication and wrote technical audio
> articles back in 1992. Personally, I was a sound zealot in search of
> building the biggest sound system I could. Nowadays, it's sufficient to
> have at hand a fine Panasonic portable CD player to carry around, Sony
> (ironically titled 'Digital Reference') headphones, and Koss monitors
> attached to my Mac. None of them really expensive (OK, the headphanes are
> expensive and sound incredibly good).
>
> OK Guys the definative answer is it does not matter if you are listening
to cd or vinyl and it doesn't matter if your player cost $20.000 or $ 20.00
the point is if your speakers are crap it wont make any difference to the
sound. Forget the hardware buy good quality speakers. Hey you would not buy
a Jaguar xk220 and then put off road tyres on it would you!!
THIS AINT ROCK AND ROLL THIS IS GENOCIDE . ' Orch '
From:
'Alan Benson'
Subject: Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
Craig wrote:
> No offense guys, but this argument is akin to saying
> 'My $10,000 Rolex keeps better time than your $8,000
> Sothis'
>
> I guess I have to stick to my $200 Seiko, for the time being....
________________________________________________
Personally speaking, I have but just two just rules:
***********************************************************
Al's TD Rule Number One:
To collect and listen to all items ever
produced and composed (published
or unpublished) by: 'Tangerine Dream.'
Al's TD Rule Number Two:
To spend whatever I can possibly afford
on electronic stereo gear whenever I can.
***********************************************************
I freely admit that I'm at the lower end of
the spectrum of the high of high-end. But,
all the same I'm very proud of my system
and I will continue to upgrade it with separate
components on every level in every possible
detail for the rest of my life.
This is my stereo system as of November 1, 1999
(the short description list):
________________________________________________________
Addendum C
(stereo system configuration):
Al's stereo configuration reference system:
1) Amplifier (1)
McIntosh 2125
2) Pre-amplifier (1)
Music Reference RM-5 re-tubed (values)
RAM matched 6922's & fully upgraded to
Mark 'V' specs.
3) Speakers (2 sets)
a) Castle Pembroke II
(bass reflex).
b) Dynaco (with swivel brackets)
secondary bedroom system
4) Turntable (1)
Thorens TD 160
Stylus: Orofon M 15 E
Super (mm)
5) CD players (2)
a) Marantz SE-63
b) Dynaco CDV-1
7) CD transport (1)
Audio Alchemy Digital Drive System III
6) DA Converters (2)
a) Audio Alchemy Digital Decoding
Engine v. 3.0 with HDCD
b) Marantz 203 (bitstream)
7) Analogue cassette decks (3)
(I'm looking to add a fourth deck the Nak BX-300, btw!)
a) Teac V-670
b) Harmon-Kardon TD302
c) Nakamichi BX-2
8) FM Tuner (1)
McIntosh MR-78 (one of the best and last
analogue tuners that Mac ever made)
9) FM/AM Tuner (1)
Marantz model #115-B
10) Headphones (4 high-end models)
a) Stax Gamma Pros
b) Grado HP-2
c) Sennheiser 580 (the special Jubilee edition)
d) Beyerdynamic DT-990 Pro
11) Integrated amp (1)
Kenwood KA-5700
(used in secondary system)
12) TV/Monitor (2)
a) NAD MR-20 (Mr. TV!)
b) An old Commodore and still working!
13) VCR stereo recorder/player (1) (will be adding a second)
a) Mitsubishi HS-U51
14) Laser Disc players (2)
Pioneer CLD-97 (Their very best 'state of the art')
Pioneer CLD-1080
15) Headphone amps (3)
a) Audiophile Home HeadRoom
b) Stax (Pro)
c) Stax (normal)
16) Niles switching boxes (6)
L/R junction, speakers and tape controller, etc.
17) Specialized audio/video switcher (1)
Teac AV 300
18) Specialized power filters & line conditioners (3)
a) Audio Power // Super Power Pack V
b) Audio Power // Pack II
c) Specialized (Music Lovers Audio) four amp line filter
19) Specialized cables (all connects) -- One word: Tons!
20) To be added: Tascam Pro-CDR recorder (1)
21) To be added: (second) Stereo VCR player/recorder (1)
22) To be added: DVD player
'Only the very best for my TD!'
All low-end of the high-end (with some unique exceptions like
the McIntosh MR-78 FM Tuner ($2K), Pioneer CLD-97 Laser
Disc player ($2.5K), the NAD MR-20 color monitor ($800 from
the original sticker price the best 20' inch monitor ever made
and assembled and some simply refer to it as 'Mr. TV!'), and
finally the Tascam Pro CDR-recorder ($1.6K) to be added.
About $22K plus or minus in total cost.
So, as you can see I go the whole 'nine yards'
when it comes to: ~ Tangerine Dream ~
'They are, after all, simply the best!'
Re: D: Live Week 36 (Majordomo & Tadream
post). TD show, Berkeley, CA, 09/24/88.
*******************************************************
________________________________________________________
Well, that's it! I was just siting here working on my massive
TD e-mails OUT to all my contacts when the Tadream OneList
digest filled up and dropped into the bread basket (twenty-five
post), and thought to take a quick look see and what's what, etc.
Peace and harmony to all TD diehards and fans.
May we all enjoy what we do have, TD and otherwise... :-)
My TD Best Always,
-- Al
Berkeley, CA / USA
PS: Sorry that I didn't post my 'Collector's Corner' for the
incredible 'Ricochet!' At present, I only have nine entries
anyway. BTW, Thomas: 'It ROCKS!' was good enough
for me. As 'Sorcerer' was my first ever TD item (from the
VINYL), I promise to continue the 'TDIFC' tradition later
this week... ;-)
NP: 'SONY Topping Off Ceremony ~Tangerine Dream~ Live'
(from the CD single).
Here is a major excerpt posted in
the TDI HP guestbook yesterday
(10/31/99):
Dear Tangerine Dream,
'Yesterday I had the unique pleasure of listening to the
SONY Topping Off Ceremony CD single recorded in Berlin,
Germany (Potsdamer Platz), on September 2, 1998. This
is a truly wonderful and beautiful classical 'Tangerine Dream'
composition. Including the remixing of TD of old with sounds
that are so fresh and sweeping with there majestic flow and
ebb that put into a phrase simply take your breath away. Loved
every precious moment of it! (btw, the drums were also terrific).
Please, I ask you to make this available (including the video),
sometime in the very near future and given a wider release for
all your countless number of devoted fans. All we ask is that
you lead the way and we shall all follow your dream...'
________________________________________________
Hope they like that!
BTW, For everything that I expressed
above 'IMHO' for anyone that needs it. :-)
'till next time... -- Al
________________________________________________
__________________________________________
NetZero - Defenders of the Free World
Get your FREE Internet Access and Email at
http://www.netzero.net/download/index.html
Replies
Name/Email
Yahoo! ID
Date
Size
18787
Re: Re (x lots): SV: OT: Hiss removel software.
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Tue
11/2/1999
3 KB
From:
'Thomas'
From:
Synthhtnys@xxx.xxx
Date: Tue Nov 2, 1999 2:36
am
Subject: Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
In a message dated 11/1/99 10:15:13 PM !!!First Boot!!!,
craigchambers@c... writes:
<< No offense guys, but this argument is akin to saying 'My $10,000 Rolex
keeps
better time than your $8,000 Sothis'
I guess I have to stick to my $200 Seiko, for the time being.... >>
* Agreed. The argument for vinyl being better may have held true when
CD's first came out, but CD technology has come a long way since then.
Besides have you heard CD's through a good tube amp?
There's the best sound combination IMHO.
Poly
From:
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Date: Tue Nov 2, 1999 3:44
am
Subject: Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
In a message dated 01-11-1999 5:15:11 PM EST, craigchambers@c...
writes:
<< I guess I have to stick to my $200 Seiko, for the time being.... >>
If you want correct time get a Seiko. A Rolex is for something else.
If you want accuracy get a CD. If you want music, with a CD you'll
still be wanting.
Phil N.
From:
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Date: Tue Nov 2, 1999 3:44
am
Subject: Re: Re: Re (x lots): SV: OT: Hiss removel software.
In a message dated 01-11-1999 7:06:10 PM EST, albenson@n... writes:
<< Al's stereo configuration reference system:
1) Amplifier (1)
McIntosh 2125
2) Pre-amplifier (1)
Music Reference RM-5 re-tubed (values)
RAM matched 6922's & fully upgraded to
Mark 'V' specs.
3) Speakers (2 sets)
a) Castle Pembroke II
(bass reflex).
b) Dynaco (with swivel brackets)
secondary bedroom system
4) Turntable (1)
Thorens TD 160
Stylus: Orofon M 15 E
Super (mm)
5) CD players (2)
a) Marantz SE-63
b) Dynaco CDV-1
7) CD transport (1)
Audio Alchemy Digital Drive System III
6) DA Converters (2)
a) Audio Alchemy Digital Decoding
Engine v. 3.0 with HDCD
b) Marantz 203 (bitstream)
7) Analogue cassette decks (3)
(I'm looking to add a fourth deck the Nak BX-300, btw!)
a) Teac V-670
b) Harmon-Kardon TD302
c) Nakamichi BX-2
8) FM Tuner (1)
McIntosh MR-78 (one of the best and last
analogue tuners that Mac ever made)
9) FM/AM Tuner (1)
Marantz model #115-B
10) Headphones (4 high-end models)
a) Stax Gamma Pros
b) Grado HP-2
c) Sennheiser 580 (the special Jubilee edition)
d) Beyerdynamic DT-990 Pro
11) Integrated amp (1)
Kenwood KA-5700
(used in secondary system)
12) TV/Monitor (2)
a) NAD MR-20 (Mr. TV!)
b) An old Commodore and still working!
13) VCR stereo recorder/player (1) (will be adding a second)
a) Mitsubishi HS-U51
14) Laser Disc players (2)
Pioneer CLD-97 (Their very best 'state of the art')
Pioneer CLD-1080
15) Headphone amps (3)
a) Audiophile Home HeadRoom
b) Stax (Pro)
c) Stax (normal)
16) Niles switching boxes (6)
L/R junction, speakers and tape controller, etc.
17) Specialized audio/video switcher (1)
Teac AV 300
18) Specialized power filters & line conditioners (3)
a) Audio Power // Super Power Pack V
b) Audio Power // Pack II
c) Specialized (Music Lovers Audio) four amp line filter >>
This is some serious shit. But you should dump that Ortofon and get
a Sumiko Blue Point or even a Blue Point Special. Sumiko is right there with
you in Berkeley.
Phil N.
From:
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Date: Tue Nov 2, 1999 3:44
am
Subject: Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
In a message dated 01-11-1999 9:36:46 PM EST, Synthhtnys@a... writes:
<< I guess I have to stick to my $200 Seiko, for the time being.... >>
* Agreed. The argument for vinyl being better may have held true when
CD's first came out, but CD technology has come a long way since then.
Besides have you heard CD's through a good tube amp?
There's the best sound combination IMHO.
Poly >>
Disagreed!! Where it has come a long way, the CD has not come
nearly far enough. If you have ever heard a 24 bit / 96k audio DVD, you would
NEVER be satisfied with a CD ever again. No Comparison! The CD system is
fundamentally flawed. Always has been. Always will be.
Phil N.
From:
Synthhtnys@xxx.xxx
Date: Tue Nov 2, 1999 8:29
am
Subject: Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
In a message dated 11/2/99 3:44:41 AM !!!First Boot!!!, PNaunton@a...
writes:
<< The CD system is
fundamentally flawed. Always has been. Always will be.
Phil N. >>
*So is vinyl as a medium.
Poly
From:
jonathan.teague@b...
Date: Tue Nov 2, 1999 5:18
pm
Subject: Digital Gothic
Anyone like to express an opinion on the Digital Gothic book. I've just ordered
it any want to know what to expect.
Also, anyone know any suppliers (UK if poss) for '30 years of dreaming',
'Mysterious
semblance' and 'Voices in the dunes'?
TIA, Jon.
Replies
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Yahoo! ID
Date
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18793
Re: Digital Gothic
craig.cordrey@xxxx.xxx
Tue
11/2/1999
3 KB
18802
Re: Digital Gothic
Craig Chambers
Tue
11/2/1999
1 KB
18834
Re: Digital Gothic
twosheds
Wed
11/3/1999
2 KB
18849
Re: Digital Gothic
Jared White
Thu
11/4/1999
1 KB
28366
Re: Digital Gothic
Dennis Nigbur
Fri
8/10/2001
3 KB
28397
Re: Digital Gothic
Deb H-J
Fri
8/10/2001
2 KB
28390
Re: Digital Gothic
Phil White
Fri
8/10/2001
3 KB
28420
Re: Digital Gothic
Tony Walsh
Fri
8/10/2001
2 KB
28438
Re: Digital Gothic
Dennis Nigbur
Sun
8/12/2001
4 KB
From:
'Alan Benson' In a message dated 01-11-1999 7:06:10 PM EST, albenson@n... writes:
<< Al's stereo configuration reference system:
> This is some serious shit. But you should dump that Ortofon and
> get a Sumiko Blue Point or even a Blue Point Special. Sumiko is
> right there with you in Berkeley.
>
> Phil N.
___________________________________________________
Dear Phil,
Yes! I know I've been there several times already. ;-)
I just listed the major (pricey) upgrades with equipment
and not audiophile accessories, etc. I'm still pondering
and torn between the Sumiko entries and the top of the
line Grado's (always had a fondness for them). The 'coin
flip' to decide later after the legal battle is over and I'll have
more $$$ than I've ever dreamed possible...
Wish my dad (Cecil) was still alive sometimes. After breezing
through Stanford (in three years, btw!), he went to work as an
Electrical Engineer for General Electric for the next forty-three
years. I owe dad my love of electronics, as I grew up surrounded
by vacuum tunes (valves for you Brits), and transistors -- literally
everywhere! As a very young boy he built me from scratch my first
crystal diode AM radio in less than an hour! I was in airwave heaven!
Being an audiophile is a very serious and dedicated hobby. One for
which I have pursed with constant vigor throughout my entire life.
All I can say is to find ~Tangerine Dream~ was sooo very special
to me, as now -- I really have something to play!
My Best Regards,
-- Al
Berzerkeley, CA / USA
****************************
PS: Re: The front-end additions of:
> 20) To be added: Tascam Pro-CDR recorder (1)
> 21) To be added: (second) Stereo VCR player/recorder (1)
> 22) To be added: DVD player
NP: 'Encore' (Coldwater Canyon) by Tangerine Dream.
Does it kick arse or what? LOL
I just ~love~ being a lifelong TD diehard!!!
___________________________________________
__________________________________________
NetZero - Defenders of the Free World
Get your FREE Internet Access and Email at
http://www.netzero.net/download/index.html
From:
Nigbur D From: 'Thomas'
>
> For the record, I'm 28 years of age, and it has taken me 15 years of
> saving up to afford the system I'm listening to, and I'm very proud of it.
> But I didn't exactely save up for such a long time to be able to brag
> about how costly my turntable is, I just like music that's it! And in my
> opinion vinyl has a lot more to offer when it comes to experiencing the
> music. And the incredible thing is I can buy records for almost no
> money...
>
I agree with you there. I can see no way in which the listening experience
would be curbed by using vinyl instead of a CD...it just depends on the
quality of the equipment. While a bad turntable might be apt to scratch LPs
and sound sub-standard, a bad CD player might equally well create an overly
'digital', staggering sound rather than a nicely flowing piece. The big
advantage about CDs, however, is that they are soo much easier to look
after...
From:
craig.cordrey@xxxx.xxx
Date: Tue Nov 2, 1999 12:02
pm
Subject: Re: Digital Gothic
>From: jonathan.teague@b...
>
>Anyone like to express an opinion on the Digital Gothic book. I've just
ordered
>it any want to know what to expect.
>Also, anyone know any suppliers (UK if poss) for '30 years of dreaming',
'Mysterious
>semblance' and 'Voices in the dunes'?
Digitial Gothic lives up to its sub-title by being critical of the majority of
TD's output. Coupled with the flowery prose, I found it quite a difficult book
to read - it offers little insight into the band beyond what is generally known
among this community (i.e. it doesn't tell us why Ed and Chris had such a
seemingly acrimonious split). The discography was useful, although I guess
it'll be well out of date by now.
30 Years of Dreaming, written by K.E. of this list (didn't want to embarress
myself by trying to spell your last name, Kent), is apparently only available
through CDS (C&D Services) of Dundee. However, due to lack of interest they
have not printed a run. I believe Thomas Bertillson was looking for some people
to make some noise about this to try and get the book issued.
I believe you can only get Mysterious Semblance direct from Scott 'twosheds'
Plumer. I'll have to get round to that, some time. Do you accept items other
than cash/cheque, Scott?
Finally, Voices in the Dunes is, I believe, rarer than hen's teeth, never
having been re-issued. The authors have supposedly been revising the tome for a
couple of years now, but there is nothing forthcoming yet.
Hope this helps, and doesn't conflict to much with what everyone else is going
to say.
Craig C. (the first one (Cordr_E_y), not Chambers)
NP : Pickford - Maelstrom - Isn't Cathedral one of the most beautiful pieces of
music you've ever heard?
--------------------------------------------------------------
Craig R. J. Cordrey craig.cordrey@g...
Senior Software Engineer 01383 828187
Alenia Marconi Systems
Integrated Systems Division
Donibristle, Fife, Scotland
--------------------------------------------------------------
From:
'Poulton, Larry'
From:
Mats Nordlinder - its a stonker!!
From:
'Poulton, Larry'
It´s a WHAT ??
Mats, Sweden
aha !!! maybe the opposite of 'Stinker' !!
Poulton, Larry wrote:
> - its a stonker!!
Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing original
messages in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed from this list), send
a blank e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
_____________________________________________________________________
CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE
The contents of this e-mail are confidential to the ordinary user of
the e-mail address to which it was addressed and may also be
privileged. If you are not the addressee of this e-mail you may not
copy, forward, disclose or otherwise use it or any part of it in any
form whatsoever. If you have received this e-mail in error please
e-mail the sender by replying to this message.
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www.nortonrose.com
______________________________________________________________________
From:
Mats Nordlinder The rich English (Cockney?) language does it again!
>
> refrain from the coloquialisms...
From:
craig.cordrey@xxxx.xxx
Date: Tue Nov 2, 1999 11:46
am
Subject: Tadream Chat
As a newly re-enrolled home PC owner, now with internet access, could some kind
soul send me (privately) details of how to join the chat that some of you have
on Friday and Saturday nights?
Info aimed toward a five-year-old would be most appreciated, along with likely
times (in the UK).
Cheers,
--------------------------------------------------------------
Craig R. J. Cordrey craig.cordrey@g...
Senior Software Engineer 01383 828187
Alenia Marconi Systems
Integrated Systems Division
Donibristle, Fife, Scotland
--------------------------------------------------------------
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Tadream Chat
Morgan Feldon
Sun
4/7/2002
3 KB
From:
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Date: Tue Nov 2, 1999 3:21
pm
Subject: Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
In a message dated 02-11-1999 3:29:47 AM EST, Synthhtnys@a... writes:
<< << The CD system is
fundamentally flawed. Always has been. Always will be.
Phil N. >>
*So is vinyl as a medium.
Poly >>
Not so much. Unless you are of the opinion that less is more.
Phil N.
From:
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Date: Tue Nov 2, 1999 3:21
pm
Subject: His removal (from the TD list due to off topic rambling) software.
In a message dated 02-11-1999 5:33:26 AM EST, albenson@n... writes:
<< As a very young boy he built me from scratch my first
crystal diode AM radio in less than an hour! >>
My Dad did that for our family in Postwar London, too. He called it a
cat's whisker. I thought it really was part of the cat. I was really amazed
to be listening to the BBC through that tiny jumble of bits and pieces. I
thought it was real 'magic.'
Phil N.
From:
Owens James -----Original Message-----
> From: 'Poulton, Larry'
>
> The rich English (Cockney?) language does it again!
>
> A 'stonker' is a superlative meaning outstanding or fantastic....
>
> Bearing in mind the international composition of this list, I will try and
> refrain from the coloquialisms...
>
> Larry
>
From:
'Craig Chambers'
>Craig C. (the first one (Cordr_E_y), not Chambers)
oops!
>NP : Pickford - Maelstrom - Isn't Cathedral one of the most beautiful
pieces of
>music you've ever heard?
Yes! This whole disc is pretty heavy.
Craig C. (the other one, not Cordr_E_y) :-)
NP: Yes-Endless Dreams (New York 94)
From:
'Craig Chambers' The big
>advantage about CDs, however, is that they are soo much easier to look
>after...
And a whole lot easier to play in your car! Okay, I am done with this
one...
From:
'Greg' From: Nigbur D
> I agree with you there. I can see no way in which the listening experience
> would be curbed by using vinyl instead of a CD...it just depends on the
> quality of the equipment. While a bad turntable might be apt to scratch
LPs
> and sound sub-standard, a bad CD player might equally well create an
overly
> 'digital', staggering sound rather than a nicely flowing piece. The big
> advantage about CDs, however, is that they are soo much easier to look
> after...
My JVC CD boombox actually managed to 'etch' some new grooves in a couple
of my CDs which I wasn't too happy about. My system is a combo PC speaker/
RCA Audio Theater/small Panasonic silver lid portable. I'm surprised how far
PC
speakers have come although my Cambridge Soundworks system is fairly old.
I have nothing but praise for the Panasonic portable.. it goes everywhere
and
is dropped quite often but keeps on working. Now don't get me started on
Lennox...
The only LP I ever remember owning was a copy of the Chicago Bears song
'Shuffling Crew' for my Sears stereo (R.I.P.) and don't ask me how I got
it, ask my father!
NP: Pink Floyd 'Mudmen'
Greg H.
From:
'Craig Chambers' NP: Pink Floyd 'Mudmen'
Gilmour's finest IMO! Man, I love this song...that bluesy guitar solo is
awesome...you guys listen to some good stuff!
From:
'Jared White'
From:
'Jared White' .
Have fun,
Jared
__________________________________________
Jared White E-mail: jwhite@g...
GaelDesign: http://www.gaeldesign.com
iReview: http://www.gaeldesign.com/ireview
The Digital Fine Art Gallery:
http://www.gaeldesign.com/gallery
Distant Oaks: http://www.distantoaks.com
Personal Site: http://www.sonic.net/~jwhite
Try BeOS Today! http://www.be.com
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Re: New Band, Old School
Heiko Heerßen
Wed
11/3/1999
2 KB
18820
Re: New Band, Old School
craig.cordrey@xxxx.xxx
Wed
11/3/1999
1 KB
From:
AslanFan1@xxx.xxx
Date: Tue Nov 2, 1999 8:35
pm
Subject: Vinyl
While it may be true that vinyl is warmer and more authentic than
cds, there's a factor nobody has mentioned that makes CDs a better choice for
TD... Surface noise. Everytime you play an album, it gets a little more
scratched and scored, and TD's music allows for no pops, clicks and other
stuff.
I used to have most of TD on vinyl and in one fell swoop, I converted because
of Tangram. It's so beautiful and dynamic, and any rumble or clicks just
wrecks the experience for me. Hence, I'm all digital now. And whoever said
that Sony Heahphones rock was right. The MDRV600 headphones are the best
investment you can make in fidelity for the money. They're amazing for $70.
Now let me just say that the new Dream Theater, NOTE, not TANGERINE DREAM, is
the best thing I've heard 1999. Seventy plus minutes of genius. Metropolis
Pt.2--Scenes From a Memory--if you've got the tolerance for heavy execution
of astounding technical musicianship, it's without peers.
Replies
Name/Email
Yahoo! ID
Date
Size
18846
Re: Vinyl
James Joystick
Thu
11/4/1999
4 KB
18905
Re: Vinyl
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Fri
11/5/1999
1 KB
From:
Synthhtnys@xxx.xxx
Date: Tue Nov 2, 1999 9:10
pm
Subject: Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
In a message dated 11/2/99 3:25:47 PM !!!First Boot!!!, PNaunton@a...
writes:
<<
*So is vinyl as a medium.
Poly >>
Not so much. Unless you are of the opinion that less is more.
Phil N. >>
* Can't (POP) think(SSSS) of any (click) of any (click) of any (click)
Flaws (Hum) ? I (Screech)Think Vinyl (tik)vinyl (tik)vinyl(tik)Vinyl
Adds more(v v v v v ) to the (kkkk)music.
more or less.
Poly
From:
Vic Rek
From:
'Jared White' From: Synthhtnys@a...
>
> In a message dated 11/2/99 3:25:47 PM !!!First Boot!!!,
> PNaunton@a...
> writes:
>
> <<
> *So is vinyl as a medium.
> Poly >>
>
> Not so much. Unless you are of the opinion that
> less is more.
>
> Phil N. >>
>
> * Can't (POP) think(SSSS) of any (click) of any (click) of any (click)
> Flaws (Hum) ? I (Screech)Think Vinyl (tik)vinyl (tik)vinyl(tik)Vinyl
> Adds more(v v v v v ) to the (kkkk)music.
> more or less.
> Poly
Ha -- good one! You and I might both get flamed for this, but I agree
with you. Any medium that *adds* anything to the original signal is
fundamentally flawed. And that means LPs. CDs may not always capture
*everything* that's in the original signal, but they sure as heckfire
don't add anomalies!
Regards,
Jared
__________________________________________
Jared White E-mail: jwhite@g...
GaelDesign: http://www.gaeldesign.com
iReview: http://www.gaeldesign.com/ireview
The Digital Fine Art Gallery:
http://www.gaeldesign.com/gallery
Distant Oaks: http://www.distantoaks.com
Personal Site: http://www.sonic.net/~jwhite
Try BeOS Today! http://www.be.com
From:
Synthhtnys@xxx.xxx
Date: Wed Nov 3, 1999 12:26
am
Subject: D:Soundtrack [Sorcerer]
Sorcerer is an old favorite of mine. Unlike some other soundtrack
work by TD, The Movie is superb. If there are any TD fans out there
who haven't seen it, I highly recommend it. This has to be one of their
darkest albums ever. Look at the picture on the back! Peter Baumann
is SCARY!!! AAAUUGH! (Edgar kind of looks like a muppet.)
Overall, Sorcerer feels like several thumbnail sketches as opposed
to a 'finished work' . I sense that many of these pieces were made
'on the fly'. I.E. they generated the mood quickly and went on to the
next one. Not that this is a bad thing. I like the rawness of it. This album
holds many fond memories as it was the second TD album I bought.
I got it when it came out, and remember taking it to my bedroom,
turning off all the lights, and burning some errrr... incense, yeah, that's
it, incense. There's legends of leftover music... anyone aware of boots
with this music? Something? Anything?
I certainly prefer my electronic music with longer tracks, but TD
does a good job here with expressing a lot in a short amount of time.
Main title is disturbing and dark, like the intro's to both Rubycon parts.
Search is one of my favorites and, I don't have it here with me, but if
memory serves it is a theme that's revisited on Encores.
The Call has a melancholy sound to it. Love those mellotron horns.
Creation is my favorite on the album. There's a great moment in the
movie where they are trying to fix these ancient trucks to haul some
dynamite through the Brazilian rainforests. This music fits perfectly,
Though I understand that they hadn't seen any footage when they were making
the music. Creation drips of rainforest mystery.
Vengeance has an almost military quality to the sequence and melodies.
The Journey is more detached, like the scenes in the movie where
you're looking down on the rainforest from above. I really like how
Chris F. got those polyrhythms with the sequencer.
Grind. This one has it all, classic driving sequence, grand themes on
mellotron, and an almost psychic interplay between them as they take
turns with melodies.
Rain Forest. Creepy Synthesizer mixed with treated acoustic sounds
This sounds to me like the piece William Friedken was listening to as
he wrote the liner notes.
Abyss. Kind of sounds like Early TD here... Zeit maybe? Until about
1:20 when what seems like a sequence, but I'm sure is Edgar
playing the Mellotron cello sounds by hand. More creepy washes
of sound, then Chris's Moog takes over. I really like the chord pattern
in the strings. Then all hell breaks loose and we fall away into blackness.
The mountain road. This one could go on for a long time as far as I'm
concerned. As it is I think it's the shortest TD piece ever (1:54)
Here TD proves you can say A LOT in a short amount of time.
Impressions of Sorcerer. This is a piece where Edgars guitar works
really well IMHO. I don't always like the guitar.
Betrayal. Fantastic way to end the movie and album. With the patented
TD phasing mellotron string sound
Next week : My all time favorite TD album, (and most played album
in my collection. Along with K.S. Mirage) expect much drooling from
me....
Poly
Replies
Name/Email
Yahoo! ID
Date
Size
18814
Re: D:Soundtrack [Sorcerer]
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Wed
11/3/1999
1 KB
18860
D:Soundtrack [Sorcerer]
Steven Le Vine
Thu
11/4/1999
3 KB
18880
D:Soundtrack [Sorcerer]
craig.cordrey@g...
Thu
11/4/1999
2 KB
18917
D:Soundtrack [Sorcerer]
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Sat
11/6/1999
2 KB
18932
Re: D:Soundtrack [Sorcerer]
Marcel Engels
Sat
11/6/1999
2 KB
18936
D:Soundtrack [Sorcerer]
Lawry Simm
Sat
11/6/1999
5 KB
18937
Re: D:Soundtrack [Sorcerer]
Lawry Simm
Sat
11/6/1999
2 KB
From:
'Carlos M. Villa' >I have seen it physically in a used CD store in Little Rock AR for $45.
>>Should have bought it, but I haven't really had the spare cash to do that.
>
>Great price. If I were you I would buy 3 copies.
I just saw it at for $43.36.
Carlos
From:
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Date: Wed Nov 3, 1999 5:59
am
Subject: Re: D:Soundtrack [Sorcerer]
In a message dated 02-11-1999 10:32:33 AM EST, poultonl@n... writes:
<< From: 'Poulton, Larry'
The rich English (Cockney?) language does it again!
A 'stonker' is a superlative meaning outstanding or fantastic....
Bearing in mind the international composition of this list, I will try and
refrain from the coloquialisms...
Larry >>
stonk•er (stong‚kƒr) v.t. Australian Informal.1. to hit hard; knock
unconscious. 2. to defeat decisively. 3. to baffle; confuse. [1910–15; orig.
uncert] Copyright © 1966-1994 by Random House Inc., All Rights Reserved.
Phil N.
From:
PNaunton@a...
Date: Wed Nov 3, 1999 5:59
am
Subject: Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
In a message dated 02-11-1999 5:08:58 PM EST, jwhite@s... writes:
<< CDs may not always capture
*everything* that's in the original signal, but they sure as heckfire
don't add anomalies!
Regards,
Jared
>>
You obviously know nothing about the data reconstruction techniques
used on the CD playback system, or the production of non-linear phasing
anomolies rampant in CD playback systems. The time slicing errors of digital
jitter (both recording _and_ playback), and the additive masking of an
artificial noise floor to make CDs sound more natural are two more added
anomolies present in the 'perfect music medium.'
Compared to current digital techniques the CD is a dinosaur of primitive
technology. It's twenty years old for cripes sake, and they have been trying
to put bandaids on the process since the very beginning so it would work
properly. The stereo LP only lasted fifteen years before it was obsolete.
Time to move on.
Phil Naunton
From:
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Date: Wed Nov 3, 1999 5:59
am
Subject: Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
In a message dated 02-11-1999 4:11:34 PM EST, Synthhtnys@a... writes:
<< * Can't (POP) think(SSSS) of any (click) of any (click) of any (click)
Flaws (Hum) ? I (Screech)Think Vinyl (tik)vinyl (tik)vinyl(tik)Vinyl
Adds more(v v v v v ) to the (kkkk)music.
more or less.
Poly >>
Obviously an extreme of careless vinyl management. Where I will admit
that my wife's Cher record collection sounds like the above example. Mine are
no noisier now than when they were brand new. Some are actually quieter.
The trials of a music collector are many and potentially
disappointing on the whole, but, with a little research and much anal
diligence, a collection of six thousand LPs (which is what I have)(OK, so
some of them are not Tangerine Dream recordings.) can be extremely rewarding.
A friend of mine, who has eight or nine thousand CDs, recently
contemplated suicide and murder when Sony announced the arrival to the
marketplace of their non-backward compatable Super Audio Compact Disc Player.
Hey! We can all start collecting from 'Ground Zero' just one more
time.
Phil N.
From:
'Heiko Heerßen' Wow, I can't believe what I just found. Via a forum on a synth Web site,
> I linked to this guy's site, and starting checking out his band's sound
> clips, and I was shocked at what I heard! Folks, these guys are using
> new virtual analog synths, samplers, and even regular ol' Korg digital
> synths to produce new music very much in the vein of Tangerine Dream,
> JMJ, Klaus Schulze, and more. But, more importantly, they sound like
> they have their own distinct style -- they aren't just another TD
> wannabe. Very good sound design and interesting ideas! Check them out --
> they call themselves 'Pyramid Peak' -- at
> .
Jared,
right you are. Do yourself a favour and buy their latest release (called 'Ocean
drive').
Brilliant stuff throughout the disc.
Heiko
From:
Synthhtnys@xxx.xxx
Date: Wed Nov 3, 1999 7:47
am
Subject: Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
In a message dated 11/3/99 6:00:13 AM !!!First Boot!!!, PNaunton@a...
writes:
<< a collection of six thousand LPs can be extremely rewarding.>>>
snip.
A friend of mine, who has eight or nine thousand CDs, recently
contemplated suicide and murder when Sony announced the arrival to the
marketplace of their non-backward compatable Super Audio Compact Disc Player.
Hey! We can all start collecting from 'Ground Zero' just one more
time.>>
*That, my friend is the music industries greed, not a validation of vinyl.
The music industry promised that the rather high initial price of CD's would
eventually drop once they had recouped the money spent on R&D.
Of course, this never happened. I have bought more copies of the same
vinyl records (when and if they became unplayable) than I ever have
CD's, in fact I've never bought the same copy of an album on CD.
Never had to. If the sound doesn't work for you, check into a tube amp.
They sound WONDERFUL. Oh, and by the way, I took good care of my records
BUT the physical act of a needle dragging over the surface of the record
does in fact degrade the sound over time.
Sometimes, when you are watching an old movie, you'll notice some
dirt on the film, a hair maybe, It doesn't necessarily take away from
the movie if you are really absorbed in it, but it doesn't help much either.
Be honest, is your defense of vinyl in any way connected to the size
of your collection?
Poly
From:
'Greg' From: Synthhtnys@a...
> Sometimes, when you are watching an old movie, you'll notice some
> dirt on the film, a hair maybe, It doesn't necessarily take away from
> the movie if you are really absorbed in it, but it doesn't help much
either.
> Be honest, is your defense of vinyl in any way connected to the size
> of your collection?
>
> Poly
At least that dust and dirt dosn't destroy the picture. The nature of DVD
is concerning as it is realistically a more sensitive media than CD. I
wont buy into DVD to watch movies and such.. I just don't trust it as a
long term investment unless I don't use the media. The reason they don't
sell these things in protective plug-in carts. is that more often than not,
the media not last as long. Sure VCRs are obselete but I know that the
media is more durable to rough keep than DVD. I can throw those tapes
around without worry--sure the picture will fade but it wont scramble and
skip.
Greg H.
NP: Air 'Premiers Symptomes'
From:
craig.cordrey@xxxx.xxx
Date: Wed Nov 3, 1999 8:43
am
Subject: Re: New Band, Old School
>From: 'Jared White'
>
> Check them out -- they call themselves 'Pyramid Peak' -- at
>.
>
I have heard many good things about this band, although have not heard the
music myself. Some may be interested to know that they are due to play at
Huizen, Holland next March as part of Alfa Centauri 7.
--------------------------------------------------------------
Craig R. J. Cordrey craig.cordrey@g...
Senior Software Engineer 01383 828187
Alenia Marconi Systems
Integrated Systems Division
Donibristle, Fife, Scotland
--------------------------------------------------------------
From:
'Greg' From: PNaunton@a...
> Compared to current digital techniques the CD is a dinosaur of primitive
> technology. It's twenty years old for cripes sake, and they have been
trying
> to put bandaids on the process since the very beginning so it would work
> properly. The stereo LP only lasted fifteen years before it was obsolete.
> Time to move on.
>
> Phil Naunton
We don't need a medium an absolute lame audio upgrade maybe
.03% of everyone will even notice! So what if it's old.. the last thing
I want to see is some new format like something called CD-24 or CD-XtRa
or some other rediculous name. I think 70 minutes at 44 khz is fine for me.
Of course the music industry has to design a new medium more suited for
pirate protection and I'm sure they'll make an absoulte big deal that it's
24-bit 48 khz .. so what! Most TD CD's are just hissy because they're old!
I'm sure most of you will agree that TD's latest recordings aren't as high
quality
as they can be.. but I've heard some music recorded so wonderfully and
capturing
the resonance of the sound. A good but probably unknown example would be
Acoustic Alchemy's 'Against the Grain' The guitar and piano playing just
moves
through you and the sense that the reproduction is what the musicians were
feeling
themselves.
NP: Martin Galway: Helikopter Jag ST (SID)
Greg H.
From:
Klaus Beschorner
From:
'Joe Shoults'
From:
Christian Villazón
From:
'Thomas'
From:
'Craig Chambers' What a spin this whole discussion took. Wow!
>
>We all have our own frames of reference. I hope that all you who
like CDs are having as much fun as I am playing my LPs.
>
>Thomas
>Sweden
>
>>Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing original
messages in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed from this list), send
a blank e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
>Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
>
From:
Attila Gyory wrote:
> Hello everybody,
> I'd like to ask to you something about using the
> music of TANGERINE DREAM
> in the TV. Is it possible to use, considering the
> laws, the music of TD in
> the TV programs?. Here there is a channel, which
> uses the music of TD for
> everything (presentations, advertisements, news,
> EVERYTHING).This channel
> uses music from Livemiles, Le Parc, Optical Race,
> Melrose and others.I think
> They get a new album and use it in whatever silly
> program. I do not like
> this situation (of course this is my PERSONAL
> opinion), I really hate it.
> What about you? Is it possible to do something to
> avoid this situation?
>
> Best Regards
> Christian Villazón
> christian@u...
From:
'Thomas'
From:
Steve Whiteley * Can't (POP) think(SSSS) of any (click) of any (click) of any (click)
>Flaws (Hum) ? I (Screech)Think Vinyl (tik)vinyl (tik)vinyl(tik)Vinyl
>Adds more(v v v v v ) to the (kkkk)music.
>more or less.
>Poly
He He, Too funny. I saved some vinyl, almost all is TD, haven't play them in
over 13 years. Not owning a record player helps. I've got ready to sell them
to you all a couple of times, but the old album covers blow away the CD
sleeves.
Are there cheap virtual analog amps to add the groove harmonics back?
From:
Gustavo Jobim By the other hand, we would be much better served if the CD format used a
>higher sampling rate (48 kHz instead of 44.1 kHz), more resolution
>(24-bit instead of 16-bit), lossless compression to allow for more music
>in each disc, etc. Instead, what we have presented as an 'improvement' is
>DVD plus MP3 -- two 'lossy' formats, that is, formats that noticeably
>degrade sound quality by means of 'perceptual' compression algorythms.
p.s.Gee, all this huge thread just because I wanted a hiss remover to
record a CD of my Wuivend Riet vinyl... Internet is fun!
p.p.s. Bought pergamon today - yay!
p.p.p.s. Already recorded Wuivend Riet, without removing hiss... There
wasn't so much noise, anyway. The cd has WR, and La cage/Eros Machine and
M.F.S. from Jarre.
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
'Jared White' From: 'Joe Shoults'
> 4) my PC sounds as good as than any audiophile-level equipment I've ever
> heard. But then, I believe that there is very little appreciable
difference
> between CD quality and 128kbit .mp3 quality...(at 1/10th the size!)
Uh, I hate having to do this to you, but I'm sorry to say that's completely
false. *192Kbps* is far below CD quality, and 128Kbps is actually
unacceptable as an audiophile listening medium. Try listening to an MP3 of
Towards the Evening Star on Goblin's Club, and compare it to an extracted
WAV. Listen carefully to the high end, but especially the 3D phase
information and harmonics. The WAV sounds full, 3 dimensional, enveloping --
the MP3 sounds, well, flat. My brother made a compilation CD for himself of
TD MP3s, and then he decided to do the same thing with uncompressed WAVs --
and the difference was astounding. We listened to the MP3'ed CD on several
stereo systems here (and they are by no means high-end), and then later we
checked out the WAV version, and there was NO comparison. We've done lots of
WAV vs. MP3 tests here -- even blind tests -- and there were obvious
differences, even using 192Kbps.
Sorry to sound so passionate, but I'm probably as passionate about
CD-quality audio being far superior to MP3 as vinyl lovers are that vinyl is
superior to CD (using the right equipment, etc.).
In other words, MP3 is NOT what it's cracked up to be! :)
Regards,
Jared
From:
'Jared White'
To:
Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 10:12 AM
Subject: Re: [tadream] Re: LP versus CD was a long time ago
> Well, some cds are 24-bit.
>
> >By the other hand, we would be much better served if the CD format used a
> >higher sampling rate (48 kHz instead of 44.1 kHz), more resolution
> >(24-bit instead of 16-bit), lossless compression to allow for more music
> >in each disc, etc. Instead, what we have presented as an 'improvement' is
> >DVD plus MP3 -- two 'lossy' formats, that is, formats that noticeably
> >degrade sound quality by means of 'perceptual' compression algorythms.
I don't know who posted the original text above (below yours, Gustavo) --
I'm not at my usual computer right now -- but that's crazy. DVDs can contain
regular ol' 48khz, 16-bit, PCM audio. Dolby digital is an *option*, and MP3
isn't even used with DVDs (at least not Region 1 DVDs)!
As for what you said, Gustavo, you're partially correct. Many people are
*recording* using 24-bit audio, but that gets converted to 16-bit when it
goes on the CD. This isn't really negative though, as, depending on which
software you use, the 16-bit CD version can sound at least as good, if not
BETTER than the original 24-bit audio. Don't ask me how they do it, but I've
heard it with my own ears! (My band's latest album was recorded at 24-bit,
and converted to 16-bit in the final mastering process, and there seemed to
be no degradation in quality -- in fact, I really do think the 16-bit
version sounded better!)
Hope that clears up a few things,
Regards,
Jared
From:
'Jared White' From: PNaunton@a...
>
> You obviously know nothing about the data reconstruction
techniques
> used on the CD playback system, or the production of non-linear phasing
> anomolies rampant in CD playback systems. The time slicing errors of
digital
> jitter (both recording _and_ playback), and the additive masking of an
> artificial noise floor to make CDs sound more natural are two more added
> anomolies present in the 'perfect music medium.'
Can you actually hear all that? I sure haven't noticed it yet. Obviously,
I've heard CDs sound quite different depending on which CD player/D/A
converters were used, but that's to be expected.
I think this discussion is getting a bit too hot for me. Time for me to sign
out!
Regards,
Jared
From:
'twosheds' I believe you can only get Mysterious Semblance direct from Scott
'twosheds'
>Plumer. I'll have to get round to that, some time. Do you accept items
other
>than cash/cheque, Scott?
Nope, but at the moment, Mysterious Semblance is out of print. The wonderful
systems guys at my former place of employment dusted all my files, including
my book, at the beginning of my last day, when they terminated my account.
Luckily, I have one final copy, which I will use to rebuild it and make it
better than ever.
But speaking of Digital Gothic, I reviewed it for the next issue of
Progression. Even as a collector of TD minutiae, I still learned a lot from
it. I agree with Craig that he does get a bit heavy on the technical musical
terminology, and he DEFINITELY has his biases, but overall I found it very
informative. Just try not to get too pissed off when he trashes your
favorite album. He pretty much only likes Alpha - Atem.
Scott
From:
'twosheds'
From:
'Craig Chambers' Has anybody here thought about how much the music we listen to affect us?
>I was wondering if anybody else had made such discoveries too.
I know I would not have made it through college without TD and KS backing me
up during my long nights of studying. Problem was, you could always count
on your money's worth with KS...TD required a lot more interuptions to
change out the music...
From:
'Carl & Jacqui Kearney'
To:
Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 4:15 PM
Subject: [tadream] Without music
> From: 'Thomas'
>
> Has anybody here thought about how much the music we listen to affect us?
>
> I was wondering if anybody else had made such discoveries too.
Hi Thomas Its a proven fact that music increases productivity in all walks
of life. A similar experiment was carried out at a few local schools about
twelve months ago and went roughly as follows :- Four schools took part
each supplying 50 pupils ,an exam paper consisting of 100 questions ranging
from Mathematics to general knowledge was set for each group and the same
time aloud for completing the tasks. One group was played classical music
,one light opera ,one Oasis and the final group had no music at all. The
results were sorted as follows highest pass rate,quickest time to complete
all tasks set. The outstanding winner was the group that was played Oasis
the losers the one played no music at all,the other two were some where in
between. Myself it depends on my frame of mind what I listen to but I
definitely produce more work when listening to up tempo music weather it be
Rush or similar or some thing like WAB or Dream mixes on the disc man. Hey
the Japanese were doing it for years in their factories before the rest of
the world caught on.
Long winded I know sorry Best regards ' Orch '
From:
'Carl & Jacqui Kearney'
To:
Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 8:05 PM
Subject: Re: SV: [tadream] OT: Hiss removal software
> > From: PNaunton@a...
> >
> > You obviously know nothing about the data reconstruction
> techniques
> > used on the CD playback system, or the production of non-linear phasing
> > anomolies rampant in CD playback systems. The time slicing errors of
> digital
> > jitter (both recording _and_ playback), and the additive masking of an
> > artificial noise floor to make CDs sound more natural are two more added
> > anomolies present in the 'perfect music medium.'
WHAT THE -U-K IS THIS ALL ABOUT BOOOOMM !! ( head exploding )
From:
Gustavo Jobim << I guess I have to stick to my $200 Seiko, for the time being.... >>
>
> * Agreed. The argument for vinyl being better may have held true when
> CD's first came out, but CD technology has come a long way since then.
> Besides have you heard CD's through a good tube amp?
> There's the best sound combination IMHO.
> Poly >>
>
> Disagreed!! Where it has come a long way, the CD has not come
>nearly far enough. If you have ever heard a 24 bit / 96k audio DVD, you
would
>NEVER be satisfied with a CD ever again. No Comparison! The CD system is
>fundamentally flawed. Always has been. Always will be.
>
>Phil N.
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Gustavo Jobim << The CD system is
> fundamentally flawed. Always has been. Always will be.
>
> Phil N. >>
>
>*So is vinyl as a medium.
>Poly
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Gustavo Jobim some of them are not Tangerine Dream recordings.) (..........)
(Phil N.)
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Gustavo Jobim advantage about CDs, however, is that they are soo much easier to look
>after...
Thomas
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Gustavo Jobim
From:
Gustavo Jobim << CDs may not always capture
> *everything* that's in the original signal, but they sure as heckfire
> don't add anomalies!
Regards,
> Jared
>Compared to current digital techniques the CD is a dinosaur of primitive
>technology. It's twenty years old for cripes sake
>Phil Naunton
Hay!
CD is 20 yrs old?
Well, at least the commercial CD we are used to is around 13 years old...
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
'Ken Mitchell' A friend of mine, who has eight or nine thousand CDs, recently
>contemplated suicide and murder when Sony announced the arrival to >the
>marketplace of their non-backward compatable Super Audio Compact Disc
>Player.
> Hey! We can all start collecting from 'Ground Zero' just one more
>time.
>
>Phil N.
>
I don't think this right . SACD from Sony/Phillips is backward compatible
which is why the Hi Fi pundits have got their money on it
to trounce it's main competitor DVD Audio which definitely isn't backward
compatible.
DVD Audio, I think are still settling on a standard but favourite looks like
24/96. IE each second of music is sampled 96000 times and can be assigned a
24 bit word length. This is compared with standard CD's 16/44.
DVD Audio does have the capacity headroom for surround sound (are you ready
for the 6 channel mix of Rubycon ?).
For those of you still waving the vinyl flag you have my admiration
and sympathy. My admiration for perseverence but by sympathy for what your
missing. Good old Red Book CD has been better than vinyl for at least 4
years.
Ken
(a former vinyl Ludditte now enjoying a crackle free existence)
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Re: SACD and DVD Audio
Jared White
Thu
11/4/1999
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Re: SACD and DVD Audio
John Marchington
Thu
11/4/1999
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18858
Re: SACD and DVD Audio
Gustavo Jobim
Thu
11/4/1999
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From:
James Joystick ... about the data reconstruction techniques
>used on the CD playback system, or the production of non-linear phasing
>anomolies rampant in CD playback systems. The time slicing errors of digital
>jitter (both recording _and_ playback), and the additive masking of an
>artificial noise floor to make CDs sound more natural are two more added
>anomolies present in the 'perfect music medium.'
That's all true. The phase error could be avoided by using a higher
sampling frequency (48 kHz?), and the need for adding dither noise could
be circumvented by the adoption of a greater resolution (24-bit?).
But it's maybe too late for such minor revision of the CD format,
although some companies are indeed trying that.
>a collection of six thousand LPs (which is what I have)(OK, so
>some of them are not Tangerine Dream recordings.) can be extremely rewarding.
A six hundred collection of CDs (which is what I have, and it's large for
Brazilian standards) can also be extremely rewarding...
> A friend of mine, who has eight or nine thousand CDs, recently
>contemplated suicide and murder when Sony announced the arrival to the
>marketplace of their non-backward compatable Super Audio Compact Disc Player.
The solution for him is simple: don't buy the format. It will not thrive,
anyway. The conventional CD installed base is too large to allow for a
non-backward compatible variation.
AslanFan1:
>TD's music allows for no pops, clicks and other stuff.
And it does not have much acoustic clues as to be judged if it is
sounding 'realistically' or not in a given moment. Some of TD records,
though, sound noticeably unbalanced, overbright and lacking bass (Optical
Race, Canyon Dreams are examples).
>And whoever said
>that Sony Heahphones rock was right. The MDRV600 headphones are the best
>investment you can make in fidelity for the money.
It was me. In fact, I am using my fourth generation of MDRs (professional
Sony headphones) since '89 (I blew up the previous ones feeding them with
too much deep bass and strange noises), and they're certainly worth every
cent I paid for them. My current model is the MDR-CD550, purchased in '97
for about $80.
Greg:
>but I've heard some music recorded so wonderfully andcapturing
>the resonance of the sound. A good but probably unknown example would be
>Acoustic Alchemy's 'Against the Grain'
Acoustic Alchemy always had that marvelous care with the recording
quality, which qualifies any of their records as serious sound sources
for testing hi-fi gear. In that category I would put also some (not all)
of classical and jazz CDs by Telarc, and little else.
It is a fact that the CD format has some serious limitations, but the
enormous majority of recorded music in any medium does not make full use
of its available capabilities.
jjoy
NP - Ryuichi Sakamoto, 'Love Is The Devil'
From:
'Craig Chambers'
>and I would add some more:
>
>5.size
which leads me to wonder:
To the guy (Phil N.?) who has 6000 lps...where in the hell do you keep them
all? I
have probably 4000 CDs and can't get a handle on those!
Craig C (3rd?)
From:
'Jared White'
>
> I don't think this right . SACD from Sony/Phillips is backward compatible
> which is why the Hi Fi pundits have got their money on it
> to trounce it's main competitor DVD Audio which definitely isn't backward
> compatible.
Actually, it's even better than that. Any SACD or DVD Audio player worth its
salt can play CDs. It's the *CD players* that can't play SACD or DVD Audio
discs. *However*, some SACDs can be made with a CD-compatible layer that
most CD players would be able to play (although, of course, it would only be
CD quality).
The good news is whatever format wins in the end, the players will be able
to play CDs as well -- and as either format is way better than CDs, WE CAN'T
LOSE!!! :)
Take care,
Jared
From:
'Jared White'
>
> But speaking of Digital Gothic,
He pretty much only likes Alpha - Atem.
All I can say is: ?
:)
Jared
From:
James Joystick I don't know who posted the original text above (below yours, Gustavo) --
>I'm not at my usual computer right now -- but that's crazy. DVDs can contain
>regular ol' 48khz, 16-bit, PCM audio. Dolby digital is an *option*, and MP3
>isn't even used with DVDs (at least not Region 1 DVDs)!
Sorry, the misinformation was mine. DVDs can indeed contain a variety of
high-resolution digital sound content. But the point I tried to make was
that we seem to be about to drown in a sea of mediocre digital
perceptual-compressed music.
MP3 sound at 128 kbps -- or, for that matter, even 192 or in some cases
256 kbps -- is not by any means 'CD-quality'. The low-level treble is
always seriously distorted and there is a 'pumping' effect in which the
bass annoyingly modulates the residual hiss of the recording. And the
complaints about the soundstage distortion are true also...These are just
the most audible artifacts created by the compression, a necessary
compromise between quality and file size.
I'm tired of this discussion, but I'm also tired of guys saying that MP3
has the same quality of CDs or even superior...
jjoy
NP - Philip Glass and Uakti, 'Aguas da Amazonia' (fantastic sounds!)
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twosheds
Thu
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From:
Gustavo Jobim In other words, MP3 is NOT what it's cracked up to be! :)
>
>Regards,
>
>Jared
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Gustavo Jobim
From:
Gustavo Jobim Problem was, you could always count
>on your money's worth with KS...TD required a lot more interuptions to
>change out the music...
>
>(Craig Chambers)
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Gustavo Jobim > Well, some cds are 24-bit.
>>
>> >By the other hand, we would be much better served if the CD format used a
>> >higher sampling rate (48 kHz instead of 44.1 kHz), more resolution
>> >(24-bit instead of 16-bit), lossless compression to allow for more music
>> >in each disc, etc. Instead, what we have presented as an 'improvement' is
>> >DVD plus MP3 -- two 'lossy' formats, that is, formats that noticeably
>> >degrade sound quality by means of 'perceptual' compression algorythms.
>
>I don't know who posted the original text above (below yours, Gustavo) --
(Jared)
I posted only the first sentence - 'Well, some cds are 24-bit.'
Sometimes I forget to say who posted what.
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Gustavo Jobim Speaking of software, how about some recommendations for some software to
>convert analog recordings to digital? I'd like to transfer some tapes to
>CD-R's, but don't know which program to get.
>
>Scott
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
'John Marchington'
To:
Sent: Thursday, 4 November 1999 12:41
Subject: [tadream] SACD and DVD Audio
>
>
> >A friend of mine, who has eight or nine thousand CDs, recently
> >contemplated suicide and murder when Sony announced the arrival to >the
> >marketplace of their non-backward compatable Super Audio Compact Disc
> >Player.
> > Hey! We can all start collecting from 'Ground Zero' just one
more
> >time.
> >
> >Phil N.
> >
>
> I don't think this right . SACD from Sony/Phillips is backward compatible
> which is why the Hi Fi pundits have got their money on it
> to trounce it's main competitor DVD Audio which definitely isn't backward
> compatible.
>
> DVD Audio, I think are still settling on a standard but favourite looks
like
> 24/96. IE each second of music is sampled 96000 times and can be assigned
a
> 24 bit word length. This is compared with standard CD's 16/44.
>
> DVD Audio does have the capacity headroom for surround sound (are you
ready
> for the 6 channel mix of Rubycon ?).
>
> For those of you still waving the vinyl flag you have my admiration
> and sympathy. My admiration for perseverence but by sympathy for what your
> missing. Good old Red Book CD has been better than vinyl for at least 4
> years.
>
> Ken
> (a former vinyl Ludditte now enjoying a crackle free existence)
>
> > Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing original
messages in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed from this list), send
a blank e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
> Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
>
>
From:
Gustavo Jobim
From:
Gustavo Jobim > I don't think this right . SACD from Sony/Phillips is backward compatible
>> which is why the Hi Fi pundits have got their money on it
>> to trounce it's main competitor DVD Audio which definitely isn't backward
>> compatible.
>
>Actually, it's even better than that. Any SACD or DVD Audio player worth its
>salt can play CDs. It's the *CD players* that can't play SACD or DVD Audio
>discs. *However*, some SACDs can be made with a CD-compatible layer that
>most CD players would be able to play (although, of course, it would only be
>CD quality).
>
>The good news is whatever format wins in the end, the players will be able
>to play CDs as well -- and as either format is way better than CDs, WE CAN'T
>LOSE!!! :)
>
>Take care,
>
>Jared
TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed from this list), send a blank e-mail to
tadream-unsubscribe@o...
Heck, I don't wanna subscribe!!!
p.s. now eating cheese and peas!
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Gustavo Jobim MP3 sound at 128 kbps -- or, for that matter, even 192 or in some cases
>256 kbps -- is not by any means 'CD-quality'. The low-level treble is
>always seriously distorted and there is a 'pumping' effect in which the
>bass annoyingly modulates the residual hiss of the recording. And the
>complaints about the soundstage distortion are true also...These are just
>the most audible artifacts created by the compression, a necessary
>compromise between quality and file size.
>jjoy
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
'Steven Le Vine' LP vs. CD &
Components 'stuff' I can ramble a little:)
But, I plan to take 'Synthhtnys' up on his recommendation.
Anyway, I am in the metamorphous stage with this CD. I am beginning
to appreciate some of the cuts ( Search & Vengeance for the moment).
However, as will no doubt come up when we discuss other soundtracks, I
do not like all the cuts. I just heard The Journey & some of it
reminded me of Radiohead (kewl!), yet I did not really like the
complete song.
I do not like Main Title or Rain Forest. The 'cricket type noise' is
very annoying like Ambient Monkeys (that 'pan' is for another time :).
The Abyss on the other hand is pretty good it sounds alot like TD
during that particular era (The haunting spaciness & peculiar
sounds).
Impressions of Sorcerer has good guitar, but I do not really like the
whole song.
Sidebar: Years ago b4 I became the 'BIG TD FAN' I am today, I
remember someone telling me that TD never used guitar or percussion,
they used the Synths to make the sounds. I guess he was wrong.
Anyway, overall the CD for now is OK a good start to a long
illustrious career of soundtrack making.
IMHO, some of the soundtracks are some of the best TD music I have
heard & take minor offense that others feel 'a whole week' is too
much time. But, I understand how others think, look at the lack of
response to Sorcerer.
To close, something we all can relate to:
I played some of Live Miles for a Jamaican friend who says 'music is
her life'.
When I asked her what she thought, she said 'that's not music'.
AHHHHHH, some things never change. :)
Gotta go, Voyager is on & it looks to be good.
Now back to: 8-track is better than mini discs.
siberkat
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Lawry Simm
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From:
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Date: Thu Nov 4, 1999 2:36
am
Subject: Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
In a message dated 03-11-1999 2:48:00 AM EST, Synthhtnys@a... writes:
<< Be honest, is your defense of vinyl in any way connected to the size
of your collection?
Poly >>
Absolutely! But, I do have to add that I am not enamored of vinyl
particularly, it is deficient in many ways. My point from the beginning of
this thread (admittedly poorly stated) is that CDs are disappointing as a
substitute. Vinyl is DEAD as an archival technology, but CDs are equally
unacceptable as an archival technology themselves. When the better medium
comes along they will not be Mastering the music from CDs any more than they
will be using Mini-Discs. Of course they WON'T be using LPs either. (c;
It's Tangerine season again!!
Phil N.
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Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
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Thu
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Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
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11/5/1999
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tom george
Sat
11/6/1999
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From:
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Date: Thu Nov 4, 1999 2:36
am
Subject: Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
In a message dated 03-11-1999 3:47:52 AM EST, designx@c... writes:
<< I can throw those tapes
around without worry--sure the picture will fade but it wont scramble and
skip.
Greg H. >>
Why would you want to throw them around??
Rumor has it that the DVD was originally supposed to have a
protective case around it similar to that of the Mini-Disc, but the Fathers
of the industry thought that this approach would be just one more thing to
make us consumers stay away. They decided, therefore, to package the
extremely fragile things like CDs and risk the potential damage problem.
Because of this we now have a virtually unrentable medium. Of course those
Fathers never liked the rental industry anyway. Another nail in the rental
coffin wouldn't hurt.
Phil N.
From:
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Date: Thu Nov 4, 1999 2:36
am
Subject: Re: OT: CD vs. LP
In a message dated 03-11-1999 4:50:05 AM EST, shoults@s... writes:
<< But then, I believe that there is very little appreciable difference
between CD quality and 128kbit .mp3 quality...(at 1/10th the size!) >>
I am unfamiliar with the techno-babble re. MP3. Does it use
perceptual encoding and data compression techniques like DVD-VIDEO and
Mini-Disc?
Inquiring minds want to know.
Phil N.
From:
'Craig Chambers' I'm sorry, I think I didn't understand this sentence. Language problem,
maybe?
>
>>Problem was, you could always count
>>on your money's worth with KS...TD required a lot more interuptions to
>>change out the music...
Sorry...what I was trying to say was that my perception in those days while
I was in college, was that I could spend money on Klaus Schulze and expect
to get a whole lot more music per disc/tape than the same amount of money
would buy from TD. Average KS cd's tend to time out around the 70-80 minute
mark, whereas, TD tends to time out around 45 minutes.
BTW, this is not a scientific average...this is just my perception.
From:
'John Marchington'
To: tadream moderated mailing list at onelist
Sent: Wednesday, 3 November 1999 10:30
Subject: [tadream] CD vs. LP
> From: Klaus Beschorner
>
>
> Wow,
>
> our first serious off-topic discussion on the new list.
>
> In the past two days, it has crossed the border from real
> technical info to 'perceived info'. Next escalation step
> is religious warfare, so we'd better quench it now.
>
> Before we do, I'll offload my 2p: in terms of sound quality,
> mastering is everything, and second. LP, CD, DVD are all
> perfectly able to store the whole audible audio range.
> Vinyl is no match for CD/DVD in terms of durability.
>
> klaus
> --
>
> Klaus.Beschorner........................work....+49-7033-45683
> Drosselweg.6............................fax.....+49-7033-45631
> D-71120.Grafenau........................Mobile.+49-171-7338969
> Germany.................................home....+49-7033-45142
> ............................................http://www.caby.de
>
> > Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing original
messages in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed from this list), send
a blank e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
> Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
>
>
From:
'Greg' From: 'Steven Le Vine'
> Now back to: 8-track is better than mini discs.
Which means 8-track is better than anything out there now.
My father used to sell that stuff--even had his own Motorola
8-Track car stereo and home system... ahh how many
times he used to put on that quadrophonic race car demo........
N.P. Kraftwerk: Showroom Dummies CD
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18909
Re: 8-Track :)
Erik Sanborn
Fri
11/5/1999
1 KB
From:
Christopher Robbin
From:
'Joe Shoults'
From:
'Poulton, Larry'
Date: Thu Nov 4, 1999 10:18
am
Subject: RE: Re: Logos
I was there - at the later show. At the time of booking the tickets I was
unaware of a earlier show. It must have been decided quite late. If I had
known, I would have gone to both 8-)......I cant comment on the earlier
show, but LOGOS sounds very much as I remember the later show.
NP. (in my head)- LOGOS
Larry
-----Original Message-----
From: Christopher Robbin [mailto:kohntarkosz@y...]
Sent: 04 November 1999 08:32
To: tadream@o...
Subject: [tadream] Re: Logos
From: Christopher Robbin
OK, someone commented that the 'Thank you for
being patient' at the start of Logos was due to
the second show starting late, which was the
result of the early show running late. So, then,
does this mean Logos is taken from the late show?
The reason I'm asking is because I have the early
show on tape, and I have always assumed this was
the Logos show (my copy starts just as the
announcer says 'Tan-gerine DREAM!', exactly as it
is on the album). I know the early show has lots
of stuff that didn't make it onto the album
itself (including the first two encores, as well
as at least one bit that turned up on Poland),
was the late show the same?
=====
May you never thirst!
The Scuba Diver Presently Known As Chris
Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing original
messages in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed from this list), send
a blank e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
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From:
'Thomas' From: 'Simon Slator'
>
>I've only just bought a copy of 'Epsilon', after finding it at on a website,
selling for £5.99. The CD itself isn't out of print - www.musik-box.com in
Germany sell copies for around DM 19 (with shipping to the UK, it works out
around £11) and, as I've also found out, it's readily available in Switzerland
too. I was quite impressed with the album - it's best when you listen to it
subconsciously, when your mind's pre-occupied with something else. The vinyl
itself is in pristine condition, if a little uneven - but still, I like to
backup albums like that to a CDR. It's just a shame that the vinyl of Virgin's
LPs were just so..... crap! Although the times on the LP total up to 34:15, I
put a copy onto MiniDisc - and it only totalled around 33:10. Strange.
Did anyone but me go for this? I did, and guess what?! Nothing! Not so much as
an email response yet. Strange...
If anybody does hit jackpot - please let me know!
Thomas
Sweden
From:
Gustavo Jobim
Date: Thu Nov 4, 1999 11:39
am
Subject: Re: Without music
Ah yes, completely true. Take Moondawn for example: 27 minutes and 25
minutes. Rubycon: 17 minutes - 17 minutes. There's another old KS album (I
think it is Irrlicht, not sure) that has a 30-minute side.
Klaus Schulze does too much music. Take that 2 CD long music, for example
(what was the name?) and that 'Nuff Said 1 CD long track that ends one of
the boxes of the Ultimate Edition.
>>I'm sorry, I think I didn't understand this sentence. Language problem,
>maybe?
>>
>>>Problem was, you could always count
>>>on your money's worth with KS...TD required a lot more interuptions to
>>>change out the music... (C.Chambers)
>
>Sorry...what I was trying to say was that my perception in those days while
>I was in college, was that I could spend money on Klaus Schulze and expect
>to get a whole lot more music per disc/tape than the same amount of money
>would buy from TD. Average KS cd's tend to time out around the 70-80 minute
>mark, whereas, TD tends to time out around 45 minutes.
>
>BTW, this is not a scientific average...this is just my perception. (Craig
Chambers)
>--------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ----------------------------
>
> GRAB THE GATOR!
No, I don't want 'the gator' !!!!
p.s. gfj now playing quichotte part 2
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
'Heiko Heerßen'
Date: Thu Nov 4, 1999 12:03
pm
Subject: KS & TD
Gustavo Jobim wrote:
> ...Klaus Schulze does too much music...
What?!
I think what makes Klaus Schulze so special ARE those long, floating pieces.
> Take that 2 CD long music, for example (what was the name?)
It's called 'Picasso geht spazieren' (Picasso goes for a walk)
> and that 'Nuff Said 1 CD long track that ends one of the boxes of the
Ultimate Edition.
O.K., here I have to agree with you that after 30+ minutes it's becoming a
little bit boring.
Even TD played songs up to 55 minutes during their live shows in 1978 (with
Steve Joliffe and Klaus Krieger). I would love to hear one of those songs on a
official CD though I highly doubt that.
Just imagine TD would release 50 CDs with unreleased (live) material for a
reasonable price (like the Klaus Schulze editions). That would be the greates
EM release of the decade, I shit you not.
Heiko
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Re: KS & TD
Gustavo Jobim
Thu
11/4/1999
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18874
Re: KS & TD
Heiko Heerßen
Thu
11/4/1999
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Re: KS & TD
Gustavo Jobim
Thu
11/4/1999
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Re: KS & TD
Craig Chambers
Thu
11/4/1999
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From:
Gustavo Jobim
Date: Thu Nov 4, 1999 12:03
pm
Subject: Re: KS & TD
Yeah, sorry I mean that KS does a large quantity of music.
>> ...Klaus Schulze does too much music...
>
>What?!
>I think what makes Klaus Schulze so special ARE those long, floating pieces.
>
>> Take that 2 CD long music, for example (what was the name?)
>
>It's called 'Picasso geht spazieren' (Picasso goes for a walk)
Ah yes.
>> and that 'Nuff Said 1 CD long track that ends one of the boxes of the
Ultimate Edition.
>
>O.K., here I have to agree with you that after 30+ minutes it's becoming a
little bit boring.
I didn't say that, just was taking an example. The only music I've ever
heard from KS is parts of Moondawn (HAVE TO buy this!! :)
>Heiko
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
'Heiko Heerßen'
Date: Thu Nov 4, 1999 12:19
pm
Subject: Re: KS & TD
Gustavo Jobim wrote:
> I didn't say that, just was taking an example. The only music I've ever
> heard from KS is parts of Moondawn (HAVE TO buy this!! :)
Yes, also get your hands on 'Mirage' (1977) and 'Timewind' (1975) and you have
some real EM classics.
Heiko
From:
Gustavo Jobim
Date: Thu Nov 4, 1999 12:14
pm
Subject: Re: KS & TD
Yeah I know.
>Gustavo Jobim wrote:
>
>> I didn't say that, just was taking an example. The only music I've ever
>> heard from KS is parts of Moondawn (HAVE TO buy this!! :)
>
>Yes, also get your hands on 'Mirage' (1977) and 'Timewind' (1975) and you
have some real EM classics.
>
>Heiko
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
James Joystick
Date: Thu Jan 1, 1970 1:59
am
Subject: Re: OT: CD vs. LP
>I am unfamiliar with the techno-babble re. MP3. Does it use
>perceptual encoding and data compression techniques like DVD-VIDEO and
>Mini-Disc?
>Inquiring minds want to know.
>
>Phil N.
I hope this is my last off-topic post on this subject...
The very heart of MP3 is perceptual encoding, i.e. a method of
transforming sampled data into harmonic information and then eliminating
part of the sound content based on a software formula (psychoacoustic
model) that pretends to simulate human hearing. The software decides what
to throw away, based on a guess of what you won't be capable of hearing.
Perceptual compression methods are used also in DVD-Video and MiniDisc,
but the pioneer was the failed Philips trial to launch a digital cassette
ten years ago. One of the reasons for the failure was the refusal by
audiophiles to accept a format that fundamentally changes every recorded
sound. But the mass promoters of MP3 don't have such concerns. I'm not
against MP3, but it cannot be viewed as a direct substitute for CD --
maybe for cassete if much.
jjoy
NP - Photek, 'Ni Ten Ichi Ryu'
From:
Steven Feldman
Date: Thu Jan 1, 1970 4:59
am
Subject: 30 YEARS OF DREAMING and the Other TD Books
>Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 10:18:32 GMT
>Subject: Re: [tadream] Digital Gothic
>From: Tangerine Dream mailing list
>Really-From: jonathan.teague@b...
>
>Anyone like to express an opinion on the Digital Gothic book. I've just
>ordered it and want to know what to expect.
Verbose and turgid in places, but insightful all the way. Just be
thankful that *someone* has taken an intellectual tack in reviewing TD,
for once, instead of just the run-of-the-mill music hack pontification.
>Also, anyone know any suppliers (UK if poss) for '30 years of dreaming',
>'Mysterious semblance' and 'Voices in the dunes'?
30 YEARS OF DREAMING you can get direct from its author, who's a
subscriber to this list.
VOICES IN THE DUNES you can only get readily on eBAY, if you don't
mind spending $50-$80 for it (it cost $30 new). It's not auctioned
there every day, but I've seen at least three copies there in the past
five or six months.
As for MYSTERIOUS SEMBLANCE, it's temporarily out of print, as
its author said on this list recently.
For more info on TD books, go to my webpage about such at . . .
http://members.spree.com/molasar/tadream/tdpix/tdbooks/tdbooks.html
The text portions concerning 30 YEARS OF DREAMING are below:
BIBLIOGRAPHY OF BOOKS WRITTEN ABOUT TANGERINE DREAM
Esklidsen, Kent Borrefjaell. 30 Years of Dreaming: Tangerine Dream
1967-1997. Hjorring; Danmark: Kent Borrefjaell Eskildsen, 1997.
[. . .]
SOURCES:
[. . .]
30 YEARS OF DREAMING: TANGERINE DREAM 1967-1997 --
Kent Borrefjaell Eskildsen
Sandbakkevej 7
Gl. Vennebjerg
DK-9800 Hjorring, Danmark
Telephone: 98 96 85 50
E-mail: kent-nbe@p...
[. . .]
Steve Feldman (Me) -- 33 Brook Street; Brookline, MA 02445; 617-232-3876;
. Robert Carty -- 5478 S. 235 E. #E; Murray, UT 84107;
801-281-2157; http://www.california.com/~eameece/carty.htm. Peter Gulch/
Nightcrawlers -- 1493 Greenwood Ave.; Camden, NJ 08103; ; http://www.voicenet.com/~pgulch/special.html. SOME CURRENT E-MUSIC
FAVES: Tangerine Dream, Nightcrawlers, Robert Carty, Node, Ozrics, Serrie
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------+
| TD DISCOGRAPHY http://members.spree.com/molasar/tadream/tadream2.html |
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------+
From:
'Kevin Earley'
Date: Thu Nov 4, 1999 2:54
pm
Subject: Re: OT: CD vs. LP
Just a penultimate comment on CDs. (I am sure this thread will continue for a
while longer :) )
One of the most overlooked factors for the acceptance of CDs over Vinyl was the
increased availability of music on CDs. IIRC, CDs were approximately twice the
price of Vinyl and Cassettes, and that Cassettes were overtaking Vinyl in units
sold at the time. Cassettes are, of course, much more convenient than Vinyl.
But a curious thing began to happen. The range of music that became available
on CD exploded past whatever had previously been available on Vinyl and
Cassette. Not just the big labels, but a large quantity of music from smaller
labels began appearing. These labels could make a profit on small runs because
of the retail price of CDs. Consumers seemed to be willing to pay twice the
price for the quality and convenience of CDs, and to get music that wasn't
previously available.
A similar thing is going on with mp3's even as we speak. The range of music
that is available has exploded, because mp3's are an extremely convenient
method of trying out the music. If you like the 3mb download you can purchase
the CD. (or not, if you are satisified with the mp3.)
Any new standard - and there will continue to be new standards - will have to
address more than just sound quality if it is going to succeed (convenience is
already a given). I suspect that the majority of consumers do not have the
quality of audio equipment required to really hear any improvements over CDs.
Don't most people use Walkman's / Discman's, Car Stereos, and overgrown 'Boom
Boxes'? I doubt that my own stereo equipment would allow me to hear much
difference.
I would guess that DVD is gaining acceptance because a lot of consumers are
buying into large screen TVs and the whole 'home theatre' concept where DVDs
can outshine VHS tapes.
Just a thought (or two) :)
Kevin Earley
kearley@r...
np: UtD - The Demon Haunted World
From:
jon.schick@u...
Date: Thu Nov 4, 1999 3:24
pm
Subject: Re: Logos
This is news to me... did they play two shows in one night? That's
unusual for any band. Were they _that_ popular? At that time, I was just
a kid and not aware of them.
Jonathan
>OK, someone commented that the 'Thank you for
being patient' at the start of Logos was due to
the second show starting late, which was the
result of the early show running late. So, then,
does this mean Logos is taken from the late show?
The reason I'm asking is because I have the early
show on tape, and I have always assumed this was
the Logos show (my copy starts just as the
announcer says 'Tan-gerine DREAM!', exactly as it
is on the album). I know the early show has lots
of stuff that didn't make it onto the album
itself (including the first two encores, as well
as at least one bit that turned up on Poland),
was the late show the same?
From:
craig.cordrey@g...
Date: Thu Nov 4, 1999 2:34
pm
Subject: D:Soundtrack [Sorcerer]
A little pushed for time just now, so not my standard form review. A few
comments, however.
1) Why are we reviewing this before Stratosfear? Lawry said this was recorded
in 1976, but it _was_ released in 1977 and has far more in common with the
sound and feel of Encore than with either Rubycon/Ricochet or Stratosfear.
2) Whether its the short-form tracks or whatever, I see this as a low-point in
their Virgin years - perhaps fits well with the film but ofers me little as a
secluded listener. What it _does_ offer is a dark, dank atmosphere which, at
this particular moment, I could do without.
3) Why do we always have the same CD vs LP argument every six months? Who gives
a flying proverbial? I listen to CDs because they are more convenient - I don't
care about n-bit x-GHz recording/playback factors. I doubt they'd change my
perception of TD's labum by more than 5%!
Sorcerer : 3AS
--------------------------------------------------------------
Craig R. J. Cordrey craig.cordrey@g...
Senior Software Engineer 01383 828187
Alenia Marconi Systems
Integrated Systems Division
Donibristle, Fife, Scotland
--------------------------------------------------------------
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PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Sat
11/6/1999
2 KB
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Marcel Engels
Sat
11/6/1999
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Sat
11/6/1999
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Sat
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From:
'Joe Shoults'
Date: Thu Nov 4, 1999 4:01
pm
Subject: RE: ...oops, typo in the homepage address
thanks. correction made on http://tadream.copfer.com/showcase.htm page.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Klaus Beschorner [mailto:klaus@c...]
> Sent: Monday, November 01, 1999 3:13 PM
> To: klaus@i...
> Subject: [tadream] ...oops, typo in the homepage address
>
>
> From: Klaus Beschorner
>
>
> Just a little typo, please use the homepage address
> below (if you want to...)
>
> cheers
> klaus (now klaus@c...)
> --
>
> Klaus.Beschorner........................work....+49-7033-45683
> Drosselweg.6............................fax.....+49-7033-45631
> D-71120.Grafenau........................Mobile.+49-171-7338969
> Germany.................................home....+49-7033-45142
> ............................................http://www.caby.de
>
> > Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing
> original messages in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed
> from this list), send a blank e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
> Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
From:
Steven Feldman
Date: Thu Jan 1, 1970 4:59
am
Subject: Kent Eskildsen: Token Angle, Kenton Files, 30 YEARS OF DREAMING
Re 30 YEARS OF DREAMING: TANGERINE DREAM 1967-1997, if you're going
to contact Kent for a copy, go for a copy of his CD, TIMESCAPE, while
you're at it. Under the names Token Angle and Kenton Files, Kent
contributed to TANGERINE AMBIENCE II, if you're not sure what he can do.
Once again, here's his contact information.
Kent Borrefjaell Eskildsen
Sandbakkevej 7
Gl. Vennebjerg
DK-9800 Hjorring, Danmark
Telephone: 98 96 85 50
E-mail: kent-nbe@p...
-- Steven Feldman
Replies
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Re: Kent Eskildsen: Token Angle, Kenton Files, 30
Jens Peschke
Fri
11/5/1999
2 KB
From:
'Poulton, Larry'
Date: Thu Nov 4, 1999 4:47
pm
Subject: RE: Re: Logos
As I said, I attended the later show. My memory is bad, but I think we
waited about 30 minutes before the scheduled time. you are right - I think
this was extremely rare. Perhaps demand outstripped supply so much that the
extra concert was arranged. On a related matter , I do remember them playing
the same venue (Croydon Fairfield Halls - UK) at the beginning and end of
the tour. I think it was around 1983? That was nice.....!
And if you want a small 'cosy' venue - what about 'Sheppards Bush Empire -
(Tournado)'. I was amazed - it was like a small theatre/large pub - more so
because of the bar downstairs.....!! But it was LOUD!!
Anyone else have any interesting venues stories?
Larry
-----Original Message-----
From: jon.schick@u... [mailto:jon.schick@u...]
Sent: 04 November 1999 15:24
To: tadream@o...
Subject: [tadream] Re: Logos
From: jon.schick@u...
This is news to me... did they play two shows in one night? That's
unusual for any band. Were they _that_ popular? At that time, I was just
a kid and not aware of them.
Jonathan
>OK, someone commented that the 'Thank you for
being patient' at the start of Logos was due to
the second show starting late, which was the
result of the early show running late. So, then,
does this mean Logos is taken from the late show?
The reason I'm asking is because I have the early
show on tape, and I have always assumed this was
the Logos show (my copy starts just as the
announcer says 'Tan-gerine DREAM!', exactly as it
is on the album). I know the early show has lots
of stuff that didn't make it onto the album
itself (including the first two encores, as well
as at least one bit that turned up on Poland),
was the late show the same?
Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing original
messages in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed from this list), send
a blank e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
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From:
'twosheds'
Date: Thu Nov 4, 1999 6:05
pm
Subject: Re: Digest Number 264
>wow. no kiddin! I took off a few days to move and missed this whole
thread,
>but here's my 2 bits:
Move? You buy a house or what?
>6) There's just something nostalgic about vinyl. Kinda like using slide
>rules, horses and buggys, rotary phones, morse code, etc. ;-) But
>seriously, I still can't listen to Rush 2112 on CD, because as a kid, I got
>so used to a particular skip on my album that it just doesn't sound right
>without it!
On Beck's 'Odelay' album, I could detect some clicks and pops that I'd swear
were added to make it sound like vinyl. Odd, no? The thing I really miss
about vinyl is that the artwork is so much bigger, not to mention all the
cool stuff they used to do with vinyl: zippers (Rolling Stones' Sticky
Fingers), interchangable peep scenes (Led Zep's Physical Graffiti & III),
panties (Alice Cooper's School's Out), or the cutouts on Optical Race.
Scott
From:
Sean Montgomery
Date: Thu Nov 4, 1999 6:31
pm
Subject: More Off-Topic Vinyl Chit Chat
> On Beck's 'Odelay' album, I could detect some clicks and pops that I'd swear
> were added to make it sound like vinyl. Odd, no?
Not really. Dance music of all sorts, but particularly Hip Hop (which was
Beck's inspiration on Odelay) is heavily reliant on sampled sounds, and
most of its creators draw from their own vinyl collections for source
material. DJs still play vinyl too...I think it's partially tradition,
and partly because it allows for 'scratching' (playing with the turntable
manually, to warp the sound).
I think there's also a nostalgia element associated with vinyl crackle and
pop. It reminds me of listening to records when I was a kid. The fact
that it's largely gone forever is a little sad...I guess it's a reminder
that nothing is forever, we all die...blah blah blah. I still find it
weird to listen to some records from the 80s on CD and *not* hear pops in
certain places. They were practically an integral part of the
composition.
> The thing I really miss about vinyl is that the artwork is so much
> bigger, not to mention all the cool stuff they used to do with vinyl
Yeah, some of the gatefold covers were nice and all. But really, I don't
need all the bells and whistles with a record...I just want the music,
a few pictures to establish a mood, and and maybe some lyrics (if the
songs have words). If I want an 8x10 glossy of a band, I'll buy a poster.
Also, don't forget that the 'cutout' effect on Optical Race was duplicated
in the CD booklet (although it wasn't reversable).
SEAN MONTGOMERY Animator
T O P I X / Mad Dog
http://www.topix.com/~sean
From:
Sean Montgomery
Date: Thu Nov 4, 1999 7:18
pm
Subject: TDI Site Updated
Like the masochist I am, I dutifully check the TDI site every day for
updates, and today was rewarded. It seems that they have some 'Christmas
Specials' coming this weekend...and some 'special treats'. Check it out.
http://www.snafu.de/~tadream/mainmenu.html
SEAN MONTGOMERY Animator
T O P I X / Mad Dog
http://www.topix.com/~sean
From:
Sean Montgomery
Date: Thu Nov 4, 1999 7:20
pm
Subject: One More Thing
The TDI site also has info about the 'Great Wall of China' album,
including the cover, track listings, and sound clips.
SEAN MONTGOMERY Animator
T O P I X / Mad Dog
http://www.topix.com/~sean
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Greg
Thu
11/4/1999
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Fri
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Fri
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From:
'Craig Chambers'
Date: Thu Nov 4, 1999 8:30
pm
Subject: Re: KS & TD
>Yes, also get your hands on 'Mirage' (1977) and 'Timewind' (1975) and you
have some real EM classics.
But, though these are classics, the ultimate is 'X' double CD. This was, I
think, KS's pinnacle, combining the analog techniques he pioneered, with
some really beautiful melodies and classical strings...this, sir, is what
music is all about! This is absolutely 'the' classic album by Herr Schulze.
From:
'Greg'
Date: Thu Nov 4, 1999 9:28
pm
Subject: Re: One More Thing
> From: Sean Montgomery
>
>
> The TDI site also has info about the 'Great Wall of China' album,
> including the cover, track listings, and sound clips.
>
>
> SEAN MONTGOMERY Animator
The samples for 'Great Wall of China' album
and I must say I love this stuff. I like the entire 'Dream Mixes 2'
movement--gosh I love that album!
In Tiger Forest
A kind of break-beat ethnic like drumming over a kind of Indio-China
buzz ambience with that 80ish buzzy chord hit (from 'Lily on the Beach',
'Klemania', 'Optical Race') Rather simple except the drumming. The
samples are around 1:20 or so..
'Cradle of Prodigies'
Some ethno-voice samples.. break beat style drumming over (this is weird)
very simple sequences (analog sounding) some other high pitched
sound effects puncture.. low drone slow bass.. TM high-pitched melodic
vocings and string shrills as well as key played chimes working that with
the
sequences.
Best idea.. mix 'Digital Sister' drumming and the sequences and chimes
of 'Pixel Pirates' and that gives you a sense of this track.
Greg H.
NP: The samples.. well over and over actually..
From:
'Patrik *'
Date: Fri Nov 5, 1999 2:34
am
Subject: Re: Using TD Music in the TV
Hallo Christian,
I suggest you contact TDI. If they have to, they will take legal action. It
must be painful to hear TD music in situations which have no relation to the
musical content.
Like selling toothpaste with Dali-paintings :-(
Best regards
Patrik , Stockholm, Sweden.
From:
'Patrik *'
Date: Fri Nov 5, 1999 3:05
am
Subject: RE: Re: Logos
Hi people,
Well, The Empire ,Shepherds Bush November 30 1996.
Man, that was truly brilliant!The sampled Roland TR-808 beat inbetween songs
and during the pause between set 1 and 2 was really hypnotic. I´ll never
forget that evening!
Regards
Patrik, Stockholm, Suedois
From:
'Eric Rochon'
Date: Fri Nov 5, 1999 12:51
am
Subject: Groove unlimited info please
Hi everyone
Could anyone direct me to Groove website... I have lost the WWW... address
and since TD will have some new stuff shortly....
Thank's in advance!
Éric
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EMC Holland
Fri
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1 KB
From:
'Glenn Folkvord (JMJ FKN)'
Date: Fri Nov 5, 1999 1:42
am
Subject: SV: Groove unlimited info please
>From: 'Eric Rochon'
> Could anyone direct me to Groove website... I have lost the WWW... address
and since TD will have some new stuff shortly....
www.groove.nl
glenn
From:
'Jared White' From: 'Patrik *'
>
>
> Hi people,
>
> Well, The Empire ,Shepherds Bush November 30 1996.
>
> Man, that was truly brilliant!The sampled Roland TR-808 beat
> inbetween songs
> and during the pause between set 1 and 2 was really hypnotic.
> I´ll never
> forget that evening!
Hmm, was that part of the 'Tournado' '97 tour? I live in California,
USA, so I don't know. Could you maybe let me know what music they
played?
Thanks,
Jared
__________________________________________
Jared White E-mail: jwhite@g...
GaelDesign: http://www.gaeldesign.com
iReview: http://www.gaeldesign.com/ireview
The Digital Fine Art Gallery:
http://www.gaeldesign.com/gallery
Distant Oaks: http://www.distantoaks.com
Personal Site: http://www.sonic.net/~jwhite
Try BeOS Today! http://www.be.com
From:
'Thomas' From: 'Jared White'
>
>> From: 'Patrik *'
>>
>>
>> Hi people,
>>
>> Well, The Empire ,Shepherds Bush November 30 1996.
>>
>> Man, that was truly brilliant!The sampled Roland TR-808 beat
>> inbetween songs
>> and during the pause between set 1 and 2 was really hypnotic.
>> I´ll never
>> forget that evening!
>
>Hmm, was that part of the 'Tournado' '97 tour? I live in California,
>USA, so I don't know. Could you maybe let me know what music they
>played?
>
>Thanks,
>
>Jared
Hi Jared,
here's the info you require, hope you find it useful.
The Shepherds Bush concert was a single performance not part of any tour. I was
supposed to go myself, but ended up in financial trouble and couldn't.
According to Patrick in the previous message, and a few friends of mine it was
supposed to have been a very special night. I think there are a few bootlegs in
circulation if you care of such things.
Thomas
Helsingborg, Sweden
---------------------------------
Tangerine Dream Live in London on Saturday, Nov., 30th at the Shepherds Bush
Empire
The following is the official play list of the London concert:
Part 1: The Vintage Set Composers
00:00 Intro
04:40 Sundance Kid E. Froese / J. Froese
10:25 Hyperborea E. Froese / J. Schmoelling / C. Franke
15:35 Barbakane E. Froese / J. Schmoelling / C. Franke
20:30 Exit E. Froese / J. Schmoelling / C. Franke
25:15 Stratosfear 1995 E. Froese / P. Baumann / C. Franke
33:20 Dolphin Dance E. Froese / C. Franke
38:50 Melrose E. Froese / P. Haslinger / J. Froese
45:47 Streethawk E. Froese / J. Schmoelling / C. Franke
49:43 The Blue Bridge E. Froese / J. Froese
53:30 Oriental Haze E. Froese / J. Froese
58:30 End of part 1 - 15min. Pause
Part 2: The Modern Set Composers
2-3min. Pianopart CP-70
00:00 Nomad E. Froese / J. Froese
02:26 220 Volt E. Froese / J. Froese
10:33 Dreamtime E. Froese / J. Froese
15:23 Catwalk E. Froese / J. Froese
24:39 Firetongues E. Froese / J. Froese
31:50 Girls on Broadway E. Froese / J. Froese
37:21 Rising Haul in Silence E. Froese / J. Froese
45:18 Lamb with radar eyes E. Froese / J. Froese
52:53 Touchwood (The Forest Mix) E. Froese / J. Froese
60:33 Towards the evening star E. Froese / J. Froese
66:50 End of Part 2 / whole main set
Encores: Composers:
(08:13) Hamlet E. Froese / J. Froese
(05:15) Thief Yang and the Tangram Seal E. Froese / J. Froese
(06:15) Eleanor Rigby Lennon / McCartney
-----------------------------------------------
From:
'Alan Benson'
From:
Jon Johnson This is news to me... did they play two shows in one night? That's
unusual for any band. >
>Jonathan>
They were still hungry for adventure yet well seasoned at what they were
doing. I still like everything they've done and do, but there is a vision
or atmosphere in that particular period of Tangerine Dream that appears to
me as a fork or crossroads for them and 'us' as well. I don't necessarily
mean that negatively either. Some have expressed that it was the equipment.
I don't doubt that, but the people play the equipment too.
-Jon
>OK, someone commented that the 'Thank you for
being patient' at the start of Logos was due to
the second show starting late, which was the
result of the early show running late. So, then,
does this mean Logos is taken from the late show?
The reason I'm asking is because I have the early
show on tape, and I have always assumed this was
the Logos show (my copy starts just as the
announcer says 'Tan-gerine DREAM!', exactly as it
is on the album). I know the early show has lots
of stuff that didn't make it onto the album
itself (including the first two encores, as well
as at least one bit that turned up on Poland),
was the late show the same?
Visit the Official Jon Johnson Homepage at
http://www.mindspring.com/~mrj12/index.html
From:
'Alan Benson'
From:
EMC Holland From: 'Eric Rochon'
>
>Hi everyone
>
> Could anyone direct me to Groove website... I have lost the WWW...
address and since TD will have some new stuff shortly....
>
>Thank's in advance!
>
>Éric
http://www.groove.nl
sales@g...
All the best.
Kees
------------------------------------------------------
For Electronic Music: Groove Unlimited http://www.groove.nl
------------------------------------------------------
---> Exercise your face... Smile :-)
From:
'Paul Fellows'
From:
'koulos'
From:
craig.cordrey@xxxx.xxx
Date: Fri Nov 5, 1999 12:09
pm
Subject: Re: question
>From: 'koulos'
>
>cd title:tangerine dream
>
This is the second 'Disky' compilation release of TD material. The first, also
simply called Tangerine Dream, had all of Phaedra, Rubycon part one and
Stratosfear.
Disky are, I believe, a 'cheapy' subsidiary of Virgin (hence the VI catalogue
number), and so these are legitimate releases.
--------------------------------------------------------------
Craig R. J. Cordrey craig.cordrey@g...
Senior Software Engineer 01383 828187
Alenia Marconi Systems
Integrated Systems Division
Donibristle, Fife, Scotland
--------------------------------------------------------------
From:
Klaus Beschorner
From:
'tadream'
To: ; tangrerinedream
Sent: Friday, November 05, 1999 1:06 PM
Subject: [tadream] question
> From: 'koulos'
>
> i was at a new record shop today and as i was in the section i usualy find
TD i asced the ladie to show me were i can find them........
>
> and there among other was this next cd
>
> plesase if anyone knows more for it say so
>
> cd title:tangerine dream
> [yes it has no title other that the babd name.....quite a strange way to
start]
>
> track list:
> beach theame
> scrap yard
> love on a real train
> burning car
> the dream is always the same
> exit
> the big sleep in search of hades
> choronzon
> movements of a visionary
> cloudburst flight
> doctor destructo
> cinnamon road
> cherokee lane[live]
>
> and it says a the bottom
> © 1999 dusky communications europe b.v.
> VI 854382
>
> so if anyone knows more for this cd....if it a official release or
whatever say so.........
>
> koulos@b...
>
> p.s. as you may have understand i did buyed the cd ......
>
>
> [Attachments have been removed from this message]
>
> > Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing original
messages in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed from this list), send
a blank e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
> Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
From:
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Date: Fri Nov 5, 1999 2:27
pm
Subject: Re: Re: Vinyl
In a message dated 03-11-1999 7:07:04 PM EST, jjoy@u... writes:
<< The conventional CD installed base is too large to allow for a
non-backward compatible variation. >>
Are you under the impression that the industry has a conscience? I
have no such illusions.
Or maybe you are expecting a consumer revolt.
Phil N.
From:
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Date: Fri Nov 5, 1999 2:27
pm
Subject: Re: SV: OT: Hiss removal software
In a message dated 03-11-1999 3:02:13 PM EST, jwhite@s... writes:
<< > artificial noise floor to make CDs sound more natural are two more added
> anomolies present in the 'perfect music medium.'
Can you actually hear all that? I sure haven't noticed it yet. Obviously,
I've heard CDs sound quite different depending on which CD player/D/A
converters were used, but that's to be expected.
I think this discussion is getting a bit too hot for me. Time for me to sign
out!
Regards,
Jared
>>
It's my business (these machines and music), so I listen to this
stuff ten hours a day. There are some recordings and CD players that I can't
stay in the same room with while they are playing. They make my hair stand on
end. Too much sensitivity, I guess. When the sound is good, however, I know
almost before the first note is played. It is quite uncanny.
Phil N.
From:
Owens James -----Original Message-----
> > Well, The Empire ,Shepherds Bush November 30 1996.
> >
> > Man, that was truly brilliant!The sampled Roland TR-808 beat
> > inbetween songs
> > and during the pause between set 1 and 2 was really hypnotic.
> > I´ll never
> > forget that evening!
>
> Hmm, was that part of the 'Tournado' '97 tour? I live in California,
> USA, so I don't know. Could you maybe let me know what music they
> played?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jared
>
From:
Sean Montgomery
From:
'Erik Sanborn' Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 00:53:27 -0700
> From: 'Greg'
>> From: 'Steven Le Vine'
>
>> Now back to: 8-track is better than mini discs.
>
>Which means 8-track is better than anything out there now.
>My father used to sell that stuff--even had his own Motorola
>8-Track car stereo and home system... ahh how many
>times he used to put on that quadrophonic race car demo........
I still have a quadrophonic 8-track player/receiver.
Best usage of the 8-track format, IMHO. :-)
(muffled laughter in the background)
Cheers,
Erik
From:
Sean Montgomery The samples for 'Great Wall of China' album and I must say I love this
> stuff. I like the entire 'Dream Mixes 2' movement--gosh I love that
> album!
Thanks for the review of the clips, by the way. I can't get them to play
on any of our machines here at work.
And I just have to say...what a terrible cover design. What does this
image have to do with China? Now that TD has complete control over their
packaging, why do they slap on these dated fractal patterns, shaded balls
(Ambient Monkeys) and congealed anti-freeze crap (Tyranny of Beauty), when
they can be creating imagery that at least says something about the music,
and evokes something about it, rather than just looking 'computer-y'. For
a band that's always stressed putting 'the human element before
technology', many of the new designs are a step in the wrong direction.
The designs for Valentine Wheels and Sohoman reveal the Edgar can do some
cool stuff with Photoshop though. Maybe it's just the sheer volume of new
releases that is causing them to rush. And I wouldn't be surprised if
they change some of the covers later anyway (as in the case of Hollywood
Years and Ambient Monkeys).
SEAN MONTGOMERY Animator
T O P I X / Mad Dog
http://www.topix.com/~sean
From:
Owens James -----Original Message-----
> From: 'Graham Coutts'
>
> I was searching for a better online supplier here in the UK and came
> across these guys..
>
> http://www.101cd.com/ogrp01.asp?artist=TANGERINE_DREAM
>
> a certain soundtrack is being offered with a release date of 12/31/99 so
> ever the optomist I've exercised my plastic! Worth a gamble for £12!
>
> Are there really plans to release it to more than a few hundred?
>
Replies
Name/Email
Yahoo! ID
Date
Size
18915
Re: The Keep
Steven Feldman
Sat
11/6/1999
1 KB
19137
Re: The Keep
goozer@xxxxxxx.xxx
Tue
11/16/1999
3 KB
19146
Re: The Keep
Greg
Tue
11/16/1999
1 KB
19148
Re: The Keep
DJS
Tue
11/16/1999
2 KB
20664
Re: The Keep
twosheds
Tue
2/1/2000
1 KB
23659
The Keep
rbrown4856@a...
Wed
8/16/2000
1 KB
23661
The Fantasy Merchants KEEP CD
Steven Feldman
Wed
8/16/2000
3 KB
23662
Re: The Keep
Antonio Nunes
Wed
8/16/2000
2 KB
33657
The Keep
Morgan Feldon
Tue
4/30/2002
2 KB
From:
'Jared White' From: Sean Montgomery
> And I just have to say...what a terrible cover design. What does this
> image have to do with China? Now that TD has complete control over their
> packaging, why do they slap on these dated fractal patterns, shaded balls
> (Ambient Monkeys) and congealed anti-freeze crap (Tyranny of Beauty), when
> they can be creating imagery that at least says something about the music,
> and evokes something about it, rather than just looking 'computer-y'. For
> a band that's always stressed putting 'the human element before
> technology', many of the new designs are a step in the wrong direction.
> The designs for Valentine Wheels and Sohoman reveal the Edgar can do some
> cool stuff with Photoshop though. Maybe it's just the sheer volume of new
> releases that is causing them to rush. And I wouldn't be surprised if
> they change some of the covers later anyway (as in the case of Hollywood
> Years and Ambient Monkeys).
Yeah, you're right -- that cover is just horrible. I also think you're right
in that they've probably just been cranking out covers for some of this
stuff 'cause they just don't have the time to spend to doing real quality
work. One would think they'd hire someone to design covers for them -- they
must have the money!
I have to say, though, that some of the TDI covers have been wonderful.
TimeSquare and Mars Polaris are both *gorgeous*, and Quinoa Extended is
pretty nice as well.
Anyway, maybe we can just hope that the final release in February will be a
new design, and current one on the TDI site is temporary! :)
Regards,
Jared
From:
Gustavo Jobim
From:
'Jens Peschke'
> Re 30 YEARS OF DREAMING: TANGERINE DREAM 1967-1997, if you're going
> to contact Kent for a copy,
Mmh. AFAIK it is only available from the Scottish C&D services and *only* if
there are
enough interested persons for a proper printing of the book... That's what
Kent told me.
>go for a copy of his CD, TIMESCAPE, while
> you're at it. Under the names Token Angle and Kenton Files,
FYI: Kenton Files are KENt Eskildsen and TONy Anderson...
However, rumour has it their new release will be 'Navigator - Northern
ConSequence',
that's Kenton Files with certain Kubusschnitt blokes ... ;-)
Best Regards
Jens
Navigator: http://home.htp-tel.de/jpeschke/Navigator.html
Kubusschnitt: http://home.htp-tel.de/jpeschke/kubusschnitt.html
wEiRd: http://home.htp-tel.de/jpeschke/wEirD.htm
From:
Steven Feldman
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
When you try to snort a book up your nose instead of actually reading it,
you get a mess like Mann's 'The Keep.' -- F. Paul Wilson, April 29, 1999
From:
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Date: Sat Nov 6, 1999 4:54
am
Subject: Re: The CD vs. LP thingie...
In a message dated 03-11-1999 7:32:49 PM EST, craigchambers@c...
writes:
<< which leads me to wonder:
To the guy (Phil N.?) who has 6000 lps...where in the hell do you keep them
all? >>
I have a special storage room in my Tardis for antiquities.
Phil N.
From:
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Date: Sat Nov 6, 1999 4:54
am
Subject: D:Soundtrack [Sorcerer]
'Sorcerer'
1977
MCA Records
MCL 1646 (LP)
At the time of release I thought that this was great. A soundtrack.
It gave some unneeded validity to my liking for this kind of music. Wow! a
whole film utilizing music from Tangerine Dream. I went out and purchased the
LP as soon as it hit the record racks, took it home and played it for weeks
and weeks. I was so into it. For some reason, though, I totally missed the
film on the big screen. (Screens were really big in those days b- like twenty
or thirty feet high.) It would have been nice to see that BIG music on the
BIG screen, but that is water under the bridge. I finally saw it on cable
about five years ago for the first time, and found the sound editing to be a
bit choppy, but, Oh, well.
The LP still sounds fresh and resilient. Very spontaneous (as much
as sequencers _can_ be at least). Very primitive and primordial. Matches the
theme of the film very well, I think. The film is quite dark in character and
so is the music, but I don't find it overwhelmingly so. It is an odd concept,
but the way that the action and the music balance the darkness actually
alleviate the pressure quite successfully. The filming hands the mood to the
music and the music hands it back so that the feeling does not get
excessively depressing.
I think that, although the film actually fails in its attempted
thematic endeavor in this case, the production values succeeded and have been
copied in more successful and subsequent venues.
I am likely biased in that, however.
Good music. 'Abyss' is wonderful, and 'Impressions of Sorcerer,'
with its Froese earthy lead guitar, has definite Stonker capabilities.
Nice job guys!! Or is this primarily Froese? The thought keeps
returning.
Phil N.
Replies
Name/Email
Yahoo! ID
Date
Size
18932
Re: D:Soundtrack [Sorcerer]
Marcel Engels
Sat
11/6/1999
2 KB
18936
D:Soundtrack [Sorcerer]
Lawry Simm
Sat
11/6/1999
5 KB
18937
Re: D:Soundtrack [Sorcerer]
Lawry Simm
Sat
11/6/1999
2 KB
From:
'Steven Le Vine' From: Steven Feldman
>
> Froth, froth, froth, sputter, shlurp. Look what you've started,
> now! THE KEEP, THE KEEP, must . . . have . . . the . . . KEEEEEEEEP!
>
> -- Steven Feldman
From:
'tom george' From: 'Simon Slator'
i think i do Simon as i am sure many others do.
.... and who here owns every TaDream album in existance? One thing's for sure -
I don't. I only own between 16-20 of them!
>
Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com
From:
'tom george' Anyway, that's just me defending the wonderful vinyl. It can still today
outperform CD by a wide margin, if played back on the right equipment.
>
>These are of course matters of taste, and I'm not saying that my opinion is
the law, but I am yet to hear the CD player that can outperform my vinyl player.
>
>Cheers,
>
>Thomas
>Sweden
>
Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com
From:
'tom george' Finally, Voices in the Dunes is, I believe, rarer than hen's teeth, never
>having been re-issued. The authors have supposedly been revising the tome for a
>couple of years now, but there is nothing forthcoming yet.
>Craig R. J. Cordrey
Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com
From:
'Alan Benson'
From:
'tom george' From: 'Joe Shoults'
i still do.
. BTW, some people used
>to get migraine headaches from listening to CDs when they first came out...
Original Message-----
>From: Klaus Beschorner [mailto:klaus@c...]
please Klaus,
are you telling me that you have never dropped a cd or scratched one
some other way and then all of a sudden they won't play anymore cause they skip
so badly that it is no longer distinguishable music. at least if that happens
with an lp it is not a total loss. i have a double cd of Pink Floyd 'Pulse'
that i let my kids play a couple of times and now neither disc will play all
the way thru. yeah some durability. indestructable my a$&.
>Vinyl is no match for CD/DVD in terms of durability.
Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com
From:
Klaus Beschorner
From:
Klaus Beschorner
Date: Sat Nov 6, 1999 12:02
pm
Subject: TD Matrioschka
Hi,
anybody seen this thing ? It's a russian 'mother doll' or
doll-in-a-doll. Five dolls in total, the outer three are
Edgar, Chris and Peter. Unfortunately I can't make out
who #4 and #5 are, except for beards and glasses all the
faces look alike. My best bet for #5 is Paul.
cheers
klaus
--
Klaus.Beschorner........................work....+49-7033-45683
Drosselweg.6............................fax.....+49-7033-45631
D-71120.Grafenau........................Mobile.+49-171-7338969
Germany.................................home....+49-7033-45142
............................................http://www.caby.de
From:
Gustavo Jobim
From:
'Jared White' From: Gustavo Jobim
>
> What's Great Wall of China?!?!?!?!?!
> gfj np Quichotte part 1 - that nice one note repetition in the last
> sequence. I love this part!
New soundtrack from TD -- go to TDI's Web site at www.tdi-music-mall.de to
find out more. Judging from the soundclips, it's pretty nice. But the cover
stinks. :)
How's that for a synopsis of the past several days of discussions on the
subject? ;)
Regards,
Jared
From:
EMC Holland From: 'Paul Fellows'
>
>Can anyone out there help me;
>
>I need the catalogue number (CD version) and track times of the following TD
>compilation album:
>
>>From Dawn 'Til Dusk
>
>Does anyone own this album and if so, could they send me the above details.
>This would complete my detailed TD discography, which can be found at:
Try this:
http://www.groove.nl/cd/29880.html
All the best.
Kees
------------------------------------------------------
For Electronic Music: Groove Unlimited http://www.groove.nl
------------------------------------------------------
---> Exercise your face... Smile :-)
From:
'Lawry Simm'
From:
'Lawry Simm'
From:
'Marcel Engels' From: Owens James
>
> WOW. Marcel came in just behind Mars Polaris. Congratulations!
>
> I'm amazed that discs as old as Zeit and Pinnacles still make it
> to the top
> 10 occasionally.
:-) Thanks!
Marcel
Music-page :http://home.wxs.nl/~m1engels
Email :fsp@w...
From:
'Marcel Engels' From: 'Poulton, Larry'
>
> Oberhiem heaven!!
Hmmm is it Oberheim heaven?
There is heavily use of Moog and Mellotron on that album.
> Its VERY dark, very moody and very apt. I love the contrast between the
> heavy tracks (Main title) vs the lighter ones (Mountain road). As a
> soundtrack debut - its a stonker!!
>
> Great EF guitar as well.....
That I agree! :-)
very very short review from me.
I like the album very much. It's very dark, especially how it opens.
It doesn't sound like a soundtrack album to me (thankfully).
I also think that most of the tracks are just excerpts of longer tracks
that had never gotten onto this record.
Not as good as Rubycon/Phaedra or Stratosfear but almost.
3.5AS (almost a 4)
Marcel
Music-page :http://home.wxs.nl/~m1engels
Email :fsp@w...
From:
Owens James -----Original Message-----
> From: 'tom george'
>
> please Klaus,
> are you telling me that you have never dropped a cd or scratched
> one some other way and then all of a sudden they won't play anymore cause
> they skip so badly that it is no longer distinguishable music. at least if
> that happens with an lp it is not a total loss. i have a double cd of Pink
> Floyd 'Pulse' that i let my kids play a couple of times and now neither
> disc will play all the way thru. yeah some durability. indestructable my
> a$&.
>
> >Vinyl is no match for CD/DVD in terms of durability.
>
HERE, HERE
Replies
Name/Email
Yahoo! ID
Date
Size
18941
Re: scratches in CDs. (was:CD vs LP)
tom george
Sun
11/7/1999
3 KB
18947
Re: scratches in CDs. (was:CD vs LP)
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Sun
11/7/1999
1 KB
18951
Re: scratches in CDs. (was:CD vs LP)
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Sun
11/7/1999
3 KB
19088
Re: scratches in CDs. (was:CD vs LP)
tom george
Sun
11/14/1999
2 KB
19091
Re: scratches in CDs. (was:CD vs LP)
PNaunton@a...
Sun
11/14/1999
2 KB
19092
Re: scratches in CDs. (was:CD vs LP)
tom george
Sun
11/14/1999
2 KB
From:
Gustavo Jobim From: Gustavo Jobim
>>
>> What's Great Wall of China?!?!?!?!?!
>From: 'Jared White'
>
>New soundtrack from TD -- go to TDI's Web site at www.tdi-music-mall.de to
>find out more. Judging from the soundclips, it's pretty nice. But the cover
>stinks. :)
>
>How's that for a synopsis of the past several days of discussions on the
>subject? ;)
>
>Regards,
>
>Jared
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Gustavo Jobim
>James
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
'Lawry Simm'
From:
'Lawry Simm' 1) Why are we reviewing this before Stratosfear? Lawry said this was
recorded
>in 1976, but it _was_ released in 1977 and has far more in common
with the
>sound and feel of Encore than with either Rubycon/Ricochet or
Stratosfear.
The plan is to review things by recording date as to more accurately
chart TD's development, wherever possible. Hence the inclusion of
Green Desert in between Atem and Phaedra, and really is more for when
we get to the early eighties when many soundtracks were not released
for a good few years after the film came out. I refer you to messages
under the subject heading 'Discussion Weeks (Provisional Schedule) for
full details of my proposed order of discussion (still open for
debate).
As this choice came upon us before being debated, the choice was mine
and I'm sticking to it! :-) Anyway, it's too late now... the fat
lady is singing as far as Sorcerer is concerned.
Lawry.
lawrysimm@u...
ICQ # 23267226
Instant Messenger - lawrysimm
From:
'Lawry Simm' Did Quichotte have a different cover?
>pre-thanks.
> gfj np quichotte part 2 (pergamon)
It was IMHO the best TD album cover ever. It's a picture of a
Tangerine (actually probably an orange) with a jack plug in it wearing
a set of headphones. It has to be seen to be believed, but I love it.
Just wish I had a JPG of it to send you... maybe Stephan Bischoff's TD
website has it, but I don't have the URL sorry.
Regards,
Lawry
lawrysimm@u... (old)
lawrysimm@s... (new)
lawry.simm@f... (new)
ICQ # 23267226
Instant Messenger - lawrysimm
Replies
Name/Email
Yahoo! ID
Date
Size
18942
Re: Pergamon Cover
tom george
Sun
11/7/1999
2 KB
18950
Re: Pergamon Cover
Gustavo Jobim
Sun
11/7/1999
1 KB
From:
Gustavo Jobim
From:
'Tony Walsh'
To:
Sent: Thursday, November 04, 1999 10:18 AM
Subject: RE: [tadream] Re: Logos
> From: 'Poulton, Larry'
>
> I was there - at the later show. At the time of booking the tickets I was
> unaware of a earlier show. It must have been decided quite late. If I had
> known, I would have gone to both 8-)......I cant comment on the earlier
> show, but LOGOS sounds very much as I remember the later show.
>
> NP. (in my head)- LOGOS
>
> Larry
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Christopher Robbin [mailto:kohntarkosz@y...]
> Sent: 04 November 1999 08:32
> To: tadream@o...
> Subject: [tadream] Re: Logos
>
>
> From: Christopher Robbin
>
>
> OK, someone commented that the 'Thank you for
> being patient' at the start of Logos was due to
> the second show starting late, which was the
> result of the early show running late. So, then,
> does this mean Logos is taken from the late show?
> The reason I'm asking is because I have the early
> show on tape, and I have always assumed this was
> the Logos show (my copy starts just as the
> announcer says 'Tan-gerine DREAM!', exactly as it
> is on the album). I know the early show has lots
> of stuff that didn't make it onto the album
> itself (including the first two encores, as well
> as at least one bit that turned up on Poland),
> was the late show the same?
>
> =====
> May you never thirst!
> The Scuba Diver Presently Known As Chris
> Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing original
> messages in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed from this list),
send
> a blank e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
> Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
>
>
> _____________________________________________________________________
> CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE
>
> The contents of this e-mail are confidential to the ordinary user of
> the e-mail address to which it was addressed and may also be
> privileged. If you are not the addressee of this e-mail you may not
> copy, forward, disclose or otherwise use it or any part of it in any
> form whatsoever. If you have received this e-mail in error please
> e-mail the sender by replying to this message.
>
> A list of the partners of Norton Rose, Solicitors, can be inspected at
> www.nortonrose.com
> ______________________________________________________________________
>
> > Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing original
messages in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed from this list), send
a blank e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
> Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
>
From:
'tom george' From: Owens James
>
>I attempted to refrain from entering this discussion, but I had to point out
>something. I've had CDs scratched so bad they were basically unplayable.
>The beautiful thing about that is that if you use a little car wax
>(NON-abrasive) and just the right amount of pressure, you can wipe all but
>the deppest grooves right out of the plastic. Unless the groove goes
>through the polycarbonate pretective layer you should be able to polish them
>out. There's absolutely no way to restore scratched vinyl.
Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com
From:
'tom george' From: 'Lawry Simm'
>It was IMHO the best TD album cover ever. It's a picture of a
>Tangerine (actually probably an orange) with a jack plug in it wearing
>a set of headphones. It has to be seen to be believed, but I love it.
>Just wish I had a JPG of it to send you... maybe Stephan Bischoff's TD
>website has it, but I don't have the URL sorry.
>
>Regards,
>Lawry
>
>lawrysimm@u... (old)
>lawrysimm@s... (new)
>lawry.simm@f... (new)
>ICQ # 23267226
>Instant Messenger - lawrysimm
>
>>Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing original messages
in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed from this list), send a blank
e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
>Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
>
>
Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com
From:
AslanFan1@a...
Date: Sun Nov 7, 1999 4:05
am
Subject: Steve Jolliffe CD on Ebay
For TD fans interested in Jolliffe's solo work (who was a member of TD for
the Cyclone experiment), I just listed his 'Alien' CD on Ebay. It's beginning
at $3.99. Take it for a trial if you're interested! The number is 195590591.
From:
'Jeffrey Au Yeung' <220Volt@i...>
Date: Sun Nov 7, 1999 4:48
am
Subject: Re: D:Studio [STRATOSFEAR]
Stratosfear is the most 'Daliesque' Tangerine Dream record.
Jeffrey
From:
'Jeffrey Au Yeung' <220Volt@i...>
Date: Sun Nov 7, 1999 4:48
am
Subject: D; Soundtrack [Sorcerer].
Last bit of addition regarding this great classic soundtrack...
Alan Benson (Hi!) talked about the UK edition of the CD, and I think some
info should be added...
I only have the UK MCLD 19159 (45:10) and the US MCAD-10482 (44:22) CDs, but
not the German CD. The sound quality of the UK CD seems to be (much)
superior to the US one: a bit of hiss, but much clearer sound and treble.
Also one big difference regarding the track 'Grind': the UK CD has the
complete track, whereas the US CD obviously omits the first 6 or 7 seconds!
Unless somebody will tell me I've got a mispress...8-)
Will appreicate any comment reg. the German CD....Vic? Joel?
Lastly a little story about how I got the LP....it was about my 5th or so TD
vinyl LP...my elder brother had a friend who ran a record store, and one
evening they had some beer at the shop. The other day my brother (still
excited) told me to get a TD record. The only hint was, the cover had 'a car
or truck'. He told me several guys (non-TD/rock music fans) listening to the
record & got a real high...there was one track esp.cool. Meanwhile I did not
notice any other TD soundtrack other than Thief, so I went to some shops -
about 7 or 8 - then I finally got one copy. I came back home and was
searching for the cool track by a quick 30 second scan of each track...upto
Impressions Of the Sorcerer I still hadn't found that, as I knew my
brother's taste...so I finally knew it was Betrayal...8-)
Jeffrey
From:
Synthhtnys@a...
Date: Sun Nov 7, 1999 8:06
am
Subject: D:Studio [Stratosfear]
If you don't like this album you may as well delete this message as
this is very likely the most-played album in my life. (With Schulzes
'Mirage' coming in a close second.) I've never grown tired of Stratosfear.
I feel it is the absolute height of the Baumann era. There is a sense
of dynamics in this album that the others just don't have. It had the effect
of an atom bomb on the way I perceived how music COULD be. I remember walking
in the woods shortly after getting the album and suddenly hearing every sound
as a kind of music. From that point on
I wanted nothing more than to get a synthesizer and write music.
Replies
Name/Email
Yahoo! ID
Date
Size
18959
D:Studio [Stratosfear]
Klaus Beschorner
Mon
11/8/1999
3 KB
18960
Re: D:Studio [Stratosfear]
Poulton, Larry
Mon
11/8/1999
3 KB
18962
Re: D:Studio [Stratosfear]
Heiko Heerßen
Mon
11/8/1999
2 KB
18968
D:Studio [Stratosfear]
James Joystick
Mon
11/8/1999
5 KB
19001
Re: D:Studio [Stratosfear]
Jared White
Tue
11/9/1999
3 KB
19013
Re: D:Studio [Stratosfear]
Nigbur D
Wed
11/10/1999
2 KB
19065
D:Studio [Stratosfear]
Quarlie@a...
Sat
11/13/1999
7 KB
19076
Re: D:Studio [Stratosfear]
AOutland@xxx.xxx
Sat
11/13/1999
5 KB
19079
Re: D:Studio [Stratosfear]
Vic Rek
Sat
11/13/1999
2 KB
From:
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Date: Sun Nov 7, 1999 3:18
pm
Subject: Re: scratches in CDs. (was:CD vs LP)
In a message dated 06-11-1999 3:54:58 PM EST, james.e.owens@b... writes:
<< There's absolutely no way to restore scratched vinyl.
James >>
There are a couple of impulse noise reduction devices available;
one from a company (Esoteric Audio) in Illinois in the US, to this day. So,
you may not be able to restore a scratch, but you don't have to hear it. I
don't own one of these machines, but I have used one. It really works.
I _have_ done surgery under a modestly powered stereo microscope to
perform repairs on some minor vinyl damage as well, with some success ......
and a few failures. It doesn't get rid of the noise but it can cure groove
lock and skipping.
Phil N.
From:
Rainer Rutka
From:
'Paul Fellows'
about something completely unrelated, and while I was poking about on the
server he pointed me to:
http://www.groove.nl/cd/
I discovered some new picture sleeves that I didn't know about, as well as
some new releases. I wonder how this company managed to get hold of colour
scans of sleeves that haven't been released yet, and aren't even announced
on the TDI pages.... anyway, for those of you who are interested, I have
updated the pages of my discography mentioned at the bottom of this message:
http://perso.club-internet.fr/pfellows/catalogthumbs/cataloguepage_6.htm
(not all of the updates are current news by the way, but I'm sure some of
the stuff will be of interest to a few of you out there....)
Paul Fellows
220 Volt Live
Oasis
Canyon Dreams
Luminous Visions
The Dream Mixes
Tyranny of Beauty
Turn of the Tides
Rockoon
Tangents
Twilight Folder
Star Trooper
Antique Dreams
The Keep
Dawn 'Til Dusk
Soundmill Navigator
Swap List
Great Wall of China
From:
Gustavo Jobim >Did Quichotte have a different cover?
>>pre-thanks.
>> gfj np quichotte part 2 (pergamon)
>
>It was IMHO the best TD album cover ever. It's a picture of a
>Tangerine (actually probably an orange) with a jack plug in it wearing
>a set of headphones. It has to be seen to be believed, but I love it.
>Just wish I had a JPG of it to send you... maybe Stephan Bischoff's TD
>website has it, but I don't have the URL sorry.
>
>Regards,
>Lawry
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Date: Sun Nov 7, 1999 11:32
pm
Subject: Re: scratches in CDs. (was:CD vs LP)
In a message dated 06-11-1999 9:36:22 PM EST, eloy-usa@a... writes:
<< i would never put a cd into a car environment because of the dust and heat
and cold and everyone i ever saw with a cd player in their car; their cds
looked like they had been thrown across the concrete. i do have a cd changer
in my car but i only use a few doubles i have in it. i will stick with home
made cassettes for the road. anyway i will try your car wax fix but i bet it
is a temporary fix at best an i would hate to get any wax in my cd player. i
have never had an album degrade from playing it for two reasons. i don't play
them over and over again. i usually make a tape of it if it looks like
something i want to hear on a regular basis. >>
I don't have a car CD player. I use one of those Sony portables
that can play under water and a $20 output adapter to run it into the
cassette drive. It sounds better than any cassette I have made and the CD
length does not become an issue in transferring to a cassette which is often
too short. This is a real issue with KS recordings. If I never take the CD
out of the portable there is little chance of damage, particularly if I don't
leave it in the vehicle where it can get baked and/or frozen.
My wife thinks I'm crazy. I never play an LP twice in a single day.
It is a house rule. Replaying seems to cause insurmountable damage. The
pressure of the diamond stylus is incredible, although over a very tiny
surface area, but this is the area where the music is. The temperature at the
point of contact is supposed to reach a thousand degrees (which I personally
doubt, or it would vaporize) but nonetheless high temperature does seem to
make sense. Vinyl, being a quasi-liquid will definitely reform under constant
abuse like this. It only makes sense to let it rest awhile after this playing
torture. I admit that a day is overdoing it, but it is easier to keep track
of what is going on when there are a lot of records being played in
succession.
Phil N.
From:
Grant M Somerville
From:
Owens James -----Original Message-----
> From: 'Lawry Simm'
>
> >Did Quichotte have a different cover?
> >pre-thanks.
> > gfj np quichotte part 2 (pergamon)
>
> It was IMHO the best TD album cover ever. It's a picture of a
> Tangerine (actually probably an orange) with a jack plug in it wearing
> a set of headphones. It has to be seen to be believed, but I love it.
> Just wish I had a JPG of it to send you... maybe Stephan Bischoff's TD
> website has it, but I don't have the URL sorry.
>
From:
'Jeffrey Au Yeung' <220Volt@xxxxxxx.xxxx
Date: Mon Nov 8, 1999 2:22
am
Subject: Re: GWOC
I have the same problem with Grant - after 3 seconds or so it was 'net
congestion'....I could not watch the solar eclipse either....never
succeeded...
Jeffrey
----- Original Message -----
From: Grant M Somerville
To:
Cc:
Sent: Monday, November 08, 1999 9:14 AM
Subject: [tadream] GWOC
> From: Grant M Somerville
>
> Hello All,
>
> Is anybody else, using Realplayer, having trouble hearing GWOC samples
> at TDI?
>
>
> -- Kind Regards, Grant.
>
>
> Grant M Somerville
> Glasgow, Scotland.
>
> Looking for Live Music Recordings...try
>
> SOUNDCHECK
>
>
> [Attachments have been removed from this message]
>
> > Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing original
messages in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed from this list), send
a blank e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
> Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
>
>
From:
Owens James -----Original Message-----
> From: 'tom george'
>
> well James,
> i have always been obsessive as far as my collection goes. i have
> never to my recollection scratched an album. i have somewhere over 2000
> lps and around 600 or so cds. you can pull an album out that i bought back
> in the late 60's and you won't find a flaw on it. i am the same way with
> cds and unless someone else gets their hands on it they stay that way. on
> the same token i would never put a cd into a car environment because of
> the dust and heat and cold and everyone i ever saw with a cd player in
> their car; their cds looked like they had been thrown across the concrete.
> i do have a cd changer in my car but i only use a few doubles i have in
> it. i will stick with home made cassettes for the road. anyway i will try
> your car wax fix but i bet it is a temporary fix at best an i would hate
> to get any wax in my cd player. i have never had an album degrade from
> playing it for two reasons. i don't play them over and over again. i
> usually make a tape of it if it looks like some!
> thing i want to hear on a regular basis. 2. i have always had a good
> turntable and cartridge with a light weight and they don't dig deep enough
> in the groove to destrpy them. every medium requires a degree of care and
> proper handling. of course if you lend out your albums and cds to all your
> neighbors then you deserve what you end up hearing. tom
> On Sat, 6 Nov 1999 14:54:19 Owens James wrote:
> >From: Owens James
> >
> >I've had CDs scratched so bad they were basically unplayable.
> >The beautiful thing about that is that if you use a little car wax
> >(NON-abrasive) and just the right amount of pressure, you can wipe all
> but
> >the deppest grooves right out of the plastic. Unless the groove goes
> >through the polycarbonate pretective layer you should be able to polish
> them
> >out. There's absolutely no way to restore scratched vinyl.
>
Replies
Name/Email
Yahoo! ID
Date
Size
19089
Re: scratches in CDs.
tom george
Sun
11/14/1999
2 KB
From:
Owens James -----Original Message-----
> From: Grant M Somerville
>
> Hello All,
>
> Is anybody else, using Realplayer, having trouble hearing GWOC samples
> at TDI?
>
From:
'Simon Slator'
From:
'Michael A Jean'
Date: Mon Nov 8, 1999 1:22
pm
Subject: RE: GWOC
Yes...I get an error about compression or something...
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Grant M Somerville [mailto:Grant.Somerville@V...]
> Sent: Sunday, November 07, 1999 7:14 PM
> To: tadream@o...
> Cc: tangerinedream@o...
> Subject: [tadream] GWOC
>
>
> From: Grant M Somerville
>
> Hello All,
>
> Is anybody else, using Realplayer, having trouble hearing GWOC samples
> at TDI?
>
>
> -- Kind Regards, Grant.
>
>
> Grant M Somerville
> Glasgow, Scotland.
>
> Looking for Live Music Recordings...try
>
> SOUNDCHECK
>
>
> [Attachments have been removed from this message]
>
> > Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing
> original messages in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed
> from this list), send a blank e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
> Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
>
>
From:
Klaus Beschorner
Date: Mon Nov 8, 1999 12:57
pm
Subject: D:Studio [Stratosfear]
Time for a comment from my side. This was the album that got
me hooked to TD. I was 15 years old, and there was this
great radio show on Sunday nights where new albums would be
played all the way through. Does anybody remember Frank
Laufenbergs 'Pop Shop Spezial' on SWF3 ?
In the afternoon, a trailer for this show was on, and they
played what I (much later) found out to be the Stratosfear
promo single. I was electrified. Taped the full album late
at night, and must have played it hundreds of times on my
old portable cassette tape recorder. Two years later,
when I was able to abford a real stereo with turntable,
the first tape I bought was Rubycon, the first LPs
Stratosfear and Pink Floyds 'A nice pair'.
The track Stratosfear itself has always remained my all-time
favourite piece of music. Even above the original rests the
1986 live version, which I first heard in Cologne. This is
not released on any offical record, so in it's own is
reason enough to start collecting bootlegs.
As yet another shameless promotion of my new homepage, and
to have you all help to determine how well it actually is
connected, you can download an MP3-version of this
masterpiece from:
http://www.caby.de/Music
Okay, having justified this posting, here's the off-topic
content, I just couldn't resist ;-)
>Vinyl, being a quasi-liquid will definitely reform under
>constant abuse like this. It only makes sense to let it rest
>awhile after this playing torture.
Phil, this strongly reminds me of the guy who always
clapped his hands ;-)
Guy: (clap)
Doctor: Why do you keep clapping your hands ?
Guy: To shy the elephants away (clap)
Doctor: But there've never been any elephants around here!
Guy: See ? (clap) It works !
regards,
klaus
--
Klaus.Beschorner........................work....+49-7033-45683
Drosselweg.6............................fax.....+49-7033-45631
D-71120.Grafenau........................Mobile.+49-171-7338969
Germany.................................home....+49-7033-45142
............................................http://www.caby.de
From:
'Poulton, Larry'
Date: Mon Nov 8, 1999 12:58
pm
Subject: RE: D:Studio [Stratosfear]
Here we go.....
Synthhtnys@a... wrote:
>>I feel it is the absolute height of the Baumann era. There is a sense
>>of dynamics in this album that the others just don't have.
This IS my favourite album. I've been waiting for this week.....The fusion
of electronic and conventional (including electric guitar) is the epitome of
excellence. These guys were firing on all cylinders here. They managed to
plug right into my musical nerve centre. The dynamics are spot on and
illustrate that silence is an integral part of music - the punctuation if
you will.
Stratosfear - the track, swings between light and delicate, ethereal and
heavenly to hard and fast, incessant and unforgiving. Its a musical hot-pot.
The timbres, the sequencers, the syncopation, the dynamics, the the the
everything. My pulse is racing.......
The big sleep - creepy but very apt. An unconventional interpretation of
Hades - when you consider the dark tones employed in Legend. But somehow
this 'innocence' only adds to the sense of fire and brimstone.
3am at the border......luscious! I can feel the humidity, the dark
loneliness and sense the murky predator laden waters. What IS it that
happens during that crescendo??!!
Invisible limits - a tour de force. Bells and whistles, strings and
sequencers. Lead synths and tunes you can hum along to. This IS Tangerine
Dream!! Froese, Franke and Baumann ARE TD!!
My 'Groundhog day' would be this - listening to Stratosfear repeatedly, but
each time it was like the first time - a revelation.
>>I wanted nothing more than to get a synthesiser and write music.
me too.....
Lazza
_____________________________________________________________________
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______________________________________________________________________
From:
Sean Montgomery
Date: Mon Nov 8, 1999 4:17
pm
Subject: Re: Re: New Email address and TD homepage, SPECIAL DOWNLOAD OFFER
> Sean,
>
> good to know you liked it. How was the download speed ??
Sorry for the delay in my reply.... Download speed was *fast!* Thanks
again.
SEAN MONTGOMERY Animator
T O P I X / Mad Dog
http://www.topix.com/~sean
From:
'Heiko Heerßen'
Date: Mon Nov 8, 1999 5:07
pm
Subject: Re: D:Studio [Stratosfear]
Poulton, Larry wrote:
> This IS my favourite album. I've been waiting for this week.....The fusion
> of electronic and conventional (including electric guitar) is the epitome of
> excellence. These guys were firing on all cylinders here. They managed to
> plug right into my musical nerve centre. The dynamics are spot on and
> illustrate that silence is an integral part of music - the punctuation if
> you will.
> Stratosfear - the track, swings between light and delicate, ethereal and
> heavenly to hard and fast, incessant and unforgiving. Its a musical hot-pot.
> The timbres, the sequencers, the syncopation, the dynamics, the the the
> everything. My pulse is racing.......
> The big sleep - creepy but very apt. An unconventional interpretation of
> Hades - when you consider the dark tones employed in Legend. But somehow
> this 'innocence' only adds to the sense of fire and brimstone.
> 3am at the border......luscious! I can feel the humidity, the dark
> loneliness and sense the murky predator laden waters. What IS it that
> happens during that crescendo??!!
> Invisible limits - a tour de force. Bells and whistles, strings and
> sequencers. Lead synths and tunes you can hum along to. This IS Tangerine
> Dream!! Froese, Franke and Baumann ARE TD!!
I also wanted to post my review of 'Stratosfear'...but you said it ALL!
Heiko
From:
'Alan Benson'
Date: Mon Nov 8, 1999 5:19
pm
Subject: Re: New TD 'Monolight' sound clip posted!
Hi All!
My friend Tom over at the tangerinedream OneList has
just asked me to inform everybody here that there is a
brand new sound clip (mp3) of TD's 'Monolight' now
just posted.
> A copy of the TD song Monolight as played
> by tom807 is on mp3.com. The link is:
>
> http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/61/tom807.html
>
> Enjoy!!
____________________________________
It's well worth the visit!
I've got the digital CDR copy
and in a word it's: 'Fantastic!'
Best Regards,
-- Al
Berkeley, CA / USA
************************
PS: Running time 05:46.
All your asked to supply at
the_ mp3.com_ site is your
e-mail address, country &
postal code. ;-)
___________________
__________________________________________
NetZero - Defenders of the Free World
Get your FREE Internet Access and Email at
http://www.netzero.net/download/index.html
From:
'TDI - Martin K.'
Date: Mon Nov 8, 1999 5:35
pm
Subject: Re: TDI Music news
Hi!
WE'RE BACK AGAIN!
We apologize for neither having updated the TDI- site, nor having
sent any newsletters out in awhile.
Tangerine Dream were moving their Berlin studio to another
location and the office rooms at TDI Music were in dire need of
renovation, which kept us all busy for the time being. Now, with
these hardships behind us, we promise to keep you up- to- date
again regularly. And boy, do we have some special treats in store
for you!
1. Special Millennium X- Mas Collector's Packs
Since this year's X- Mas will be the last of the Millennium, we at TDI
MUSIC
decided that we would have to come up with some very special treat for your
giftbag:
Containing:
- a very special 'Great Wall of China' T- Shirt
- 'Great Wall of China' Original Soundtrack - fresh from the
studio, before it's in the shops!
plus......
a very special bonus gift:
- 'The Keep' 99 re-release - official version
This package will be a strictly limited number of copies, due to the nature of
our
agreement regarding 'The Keep'. This might be your last chance ever to get
hold of
an officially authorized version of this extremely wanted item.
THIS PACKAGE:
All together for:
US $ 180.00 (incl. shipping & handling)
ORDER NOW!
Please note that your orders for this item will not be shipped before
last
week of November!
The TDI crew wishes you a merry X- Mas and happy new Millennium!
TD's first work in 2000 will be the completion of the 'Soundmill
Navigator' project.
--------------------
2. The new TD studio complex will be featured in the U.S.
Keyboard magazine. Double issue Dec.99 / Jan. 2000 as studio
of the month, containing pictures and equipment listings.
--------------------
3. The 'What a blast' video is now available in the U.S.. Unapix is
just working on the DVD version with DOLBY DTS sound.
Planned release: First quarter 2000
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
4. GREAT WALL OF CHINA COMING FEB. 2000!
We are proud to announce that TD's newest soundtrack
recording for a documentary on the Chinese Wall, which is aptly
titled 'Great Wall of China', will be available in early February,
2000. The complete tracklisting and final coverartwork are now
available. All of you who can't wait can also preview excerpts
from two songs in Real Audio (click here).
Well... don´t say you haven´t been informed.
As always, you can turn on the nice and friendly TDI- crew in case you need
any
further information.
All the best,
Martin Kay.
TDI- Music- Support.
Tel:-49-30-23620995
Fax:-49-30-23620996
Visit our Website at:
http://www.tdi-music-mall.de
Have a nice day!
From:
Sean Montgomery
Date: Mon Nov 8, 1999 5:32
pm
Subject: The Keep available in TD Holiday Booster
I don't think anyone's commented on this yet, which is somewhat
surprising! TDI has just launched another 'Booster' package to suck money
from our wallets. This one has an interesting twist! Of course it offers
the new 'Great Wall of China' album, and a T-Shirt...but in addition,
they're throwing in 'The Keep!' Yes, kiddies, the very one. It has a new
(ugly) cover, and is touted as the 'Original Motion Picture Soundtrack'.
No word on whether the track listing is the same as the one distributed
during their tour, but I would imagine that it is. Here's the official
wording:
' This package will be a strictly limited number of copies, due to the
nature of our agreement regarding 'The Keep'. This might be your last
chance ever to get hold of an officially authorized version of this
extremely wanted item.'
Only $180 U.S., people. Go to it! ;-)
SEAN MONTGOMERY Animator
T O P I X / Mad Dog
http://www.topix.com/~sean
Replies
Name/Email
Yahoo! ID
Date
Size
18970
Re: The Keep available in TD Holiday Booster
Jens Peschke
Mon
11/8/1999
2 KB
18973
Re: The Keep available in TD Holiday Booster
John Gentile
Tue
11/9/1999
2 KB
18974
Re: The Keep available in TD Holiday Booster
Gustavo Jobim
Tue
11/9/1999
1 KB
18981
Re: The Keep available in TD Holiday Booster
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Tue
11/9/1999
1 KB
18985
Re: The Keep available in TD Holiday Booster
Heiko Heerßen
Tue
11/9/1999
1 KB
18991
Re: The Keep available in TD Holiday Booster
Steve Jenkins
Tue
11/9/1999
1 KB
18992
Re: The Keep available in TD Holiday Booster
Totta Rydqvist
Tue
11/9/1999
2 KB
18993
Re: The Keep available in TD Holiday Booster
TOMX01@a...
Tue
11/9/1999
1 KB
18995
Re: The Keep available in TD Holiday Booster
Radu Velicescu
Tue
11/9/1999
2 KB
From:
Gustavo Jobim
Date: Mon Nov 8, 1999 6:45
pm
Subject: the Green Desert covers
Hello!
I've been to that page http://infobase.acomedia.it/nicola/td_official.html
with the covers...
Is that Green Desert with the rocks on the cover (Relativity) rarer than
the other two? Which one has the best sound quality?
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Gustavo Jobim
Date: Mon Nov 8, 1999 7:13
pm
Subject: comment - Re: RE: scratches in CDs.
>From: Owens James
>
>Hi Tom and all,
>
>The scratch on the particular CD that I was referring to (Edgar Froese's
>_Pinnacles_ to be precise) came due to a malfunction in my CD player. I had
>a 6-disc magazine changer and the tray cross-threaded into the tray below,
>scratching the CD most heinously. No lack of proper care here, just a freak
>mishap.
OUCH!!!! (says the CD)
What a horrible accident.
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
James Joystick
Date: Thu Jan 1, 1970 1:59
am
Subject: D:Studio [Stratosfear]
Here is my week's review... I did not comment on Sorcerer because I do not own
the original record, only the Tangentized fragments!
Stratosfear... This album is a total departure from the previous TD sound,
showing a clear and intentional shift toward structured composing and complex
arrangements combining acoustic and electronic instruments. It states that TD¹s
definition of 'electronic' sound leaves behind the elements of pure
experimentation and amorphous soundscapes and seeks to create a new coherent
sonic language. In few words: a bit pretentious...
1. Stratosfear
This great track starts with a nostalgic phrase - about to be repeated at the
end - and then a sequence begins to (surprise!) make the foundation to a
structured song, instead of being an autonomous entity as it was the use in
previous works.
2:10 - The second theme sounds seriously lacking harmonic building. As a matter
of fact, in early TD it was a custom to play notes doubled one octave higher
and little or nothing else.
3:13 - The third theme, with the guitar making a counter-rhythm, is one of the
coolest things of the album...
4:48 - The keyboards in this section are of pure genius! Seconds later, the
first theme is to be re-presented.
6:12 - Ending theme, with a march-like rhythm pattern.
7:11 - The organ bursts seem to spell: 'Stra-tos-fear... Stra-tos-fear...'
7:32 - Yes! Yes! More!
8:40 - The opening theme is fully developed, in a such and slow calm way that
it doesn¹t sound like TD. The closest thing is a track from 'Wavelength'.
2. The Big Sleep In Search of Hades
Aha! The harpsichord sound debuts in classic period TD! Only this is a real
one, not electronic. Baumann puts out a simple melody through the flute. Who
played the bass? Again, it sounds nothing like regular TD... where¹s the
sequencer and the synth?
1:04 - Ah, a sequence. The theme is dry like a desert, though...
1:33 - the Mellotron line dissolves into dissonant reminiscences.
2:37 - This part fools us, because it sounds simple, but in reality it¹s quite
complex and sophisticated. The sound structure degenerates into a formless
chord, much like the previous part. Both seem to depict the mind of someone
who¹s about to sleep, wakes up for a moment and loses consciousness again... at
least the title confirms this.
3:26 - Return of the main theme.
3. 3AM in The Border of the Marsh From Okefenokee
Another almost silent track. Edgar plays 'drunk harmonica'. There are liquidy
sound effects and an intriguing rattlesnaking rhythm sound - in reality, a
suggestion of rhythm.
1:50 - A broad and mystic sound cloud gives impression of a sudden revelation
or, maybe, a spaceship hovering around...
2:42 - Another dry theme in the keyboard. Soon we hear dreamy flute notes, the
rattle and very nice and soft keyboard solos.
6:30 - This flute phrase is a band favorite which was recycled by Chris several
times in later compositions.
6:58 - A flock in the Florida swamps...?
7:53 - The harmonica brings us back where we started.
4. Invisible Limits
I like this song better yet than 'Stratosfear'. It lacks a central theme but is
more freeform, full of intriguing sounds, and evocative. Is begins with full
and gorgeous chords and wah-wah guitar...
2:49 - Military drum announces a radical change in mood.
3:06 - A deafening bell/organ note followed by a insistent guitar phrase.
3:53 - To me, this is one of the top TD moments of the 70s. The Edgar guitar
solo, the way in which it cedes to the sequencer and then to the keyboard and
to the guitar again... simply fantastic... I fail to describe it in words! It¹s
solid inspiration. Note how the keyboard solo by the second sequence seems to
be coming from the distance and circling us, in a 3D spatial effect created
through wise use of the phaser.
6:53 - Dreamland again... some weird and frightening sounds with heavy
spacialization, followed by a final statement on the guitar.
7:53 - Ambientland now. Curious effects evoke an alien landscape - maybe the
one seen in the album cover?
9:03 - A piano and flute theme brings back the classic mood and ends the album
with a gold key.
jjoy
NP (as I post this text) - Cocteau Twins BBC Sessions - double CD
From:
Klaus Beschorner
From:
'Jens Peschke'
> I don't think anyone's commented on this yet, which is somewhat
> surprising! TDI has just launched another 'Booster' package to suck money
> from our wallets.
Speaking of sucking, it was 180 bucks for 2 CDs and a T-shirt, right ? ;-)
>This one has an interesting twist! Of course it offers
> the new 'Great Wall of China' album, and a T-Shirt...but in addition,
> they're throwing in 'The Keep!' Yes, kiddies, the very one.
Well, I have the '97 release they sold in the UK which is quite good,
but not half as good as Logotypes, IMO. Other than it's rare there's
no argument for such a high price. Well, there will most certainly be demand
even for 180 bucks, the marketing man rules the land...
> It has a new (ugly) cover,
*Ugly* maybe for a grafix wizzard like you, Sean.
It ain't that bad, IMO.
> No word on whether the track listing is the same as the one distributed
> during their tour, but I would imagine that it is.
Mind you, it won't surprise me at all if one track is added or omitted -
it won't be the first time IIRC. 8-)
> Only $180 U.S., people. Go to it! ;-)
Yeah, get da booster - it's darn hot, innit ? ;-)
Best Regards
Jens
Ronnenberg, Germany
From:
Gustavo Jobim 1. Stratosfear
>7:11 - The organ bursts seem to spell: 'Stra-tos-fear... Stra-tos-fear...'
gfj: Yes, very nice! I also could sing 'stra-tos-fear' around 6:40...
>2. The Big Sleep In Search of Hades
>1:33 - the Mellotron line dissolves into dissonant reminiscences.
gfj: I hadn't noticed that - interesting effect here.
>2:37 - This part fools us, because it sounds simple, but in reality it¹s
quite complex and sophisticated. The sound structure degenerates into a
formless chord, much like the previous part. Both seem to depict the mind
of someone who¹s about to sleep, wakes up for a moment and loses
consciousness again... at least the title confirms this.
gfj: I'd like to add this: Have you all ever noticed that the track ends as
if it was going back exactly to the position 1:04? AND, if you count,
they're exactly the same size (1:04. The first part from 0:00 to 1:04, the
other part from 3:24 to 4:28). I think they're identical! Can anyone check
this? I think this isn't a Big Sleep, it's an infinite sleep, or a
nightmare...boooo.
>3. 3AM in The Border of the Marsh From Okefenokee
>6:30 - This flute phrase is a band favorite which was recycled by Chris
several times in later compositions.
gfj: Where else could we (I) find this theme?
>6:58 - A flock in the Florida swamps...?
gfj: Never noticed that!!!
>4. Invisible Limits
>3:06 - A deafening bell/organ note followed by a insistent guitar phrase.
gfj: It remainds me of Ricochet part 1.
>9:03 - A piano and flute theme brings back the classic mood and ends the
album with a gold key.
gfj: Another of many top moments on this album.
(jjoy)
(comments: gfj np Invisible Limits)
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
Replies
Name/Email
Yahoo! ID
Date
Size
18978
Re: Quite interesting note on Big Sleep, but mayb
Marcel Engels
Tue
11/9/1999
1 KB
18984
Re: Quite interesting note on Big Sleep, but mayb
James Joystick
Tue
11/9/1999
2 KB
19044
Re: Quite interesting note on Big Sleep, but mayb
Gustavo Jobim
Thu
11/11/1999
2 KB
From:
Gustavo Jobim Also - check out the following musician's pages. If you like Tangerine
Dream, Jarre and Brian Eno, you'll love their music:
>KELVIN L SMITH - http://www.mp3.com/kelvinlsmith
Just to add that I downloaded Kelvin Smith's Hydrogene V, tribute to Jarre.
Liked it and recommend it! :)
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
'John Gentile'
To:
Sent: Monday, November 08, 1999 12:32 PM
Subject: [tadream] The Keep available in TD Holiday Booster
> From: Sean Montgomery
>
>
>
> I don't think anyone's commented on this yet, which is somewhat
> surprising! TDI has just launched another 'Booster' package to suck money
> from our wallets. This one has an interesting twist! Of course it offers
> the new 'Great Wall of China' album, and a T-Shirt...but in addition,
> they're throwing in 'The Keep!' Yes, kiddies, the very one. It has a new
> (ugly) cover, and is touted as the 'Original Motion Picture Soundtrack'.
> No word on whether the track listing is the same as the one distributed
> during their tour, but I would imagine that it is. Here's the official
> wording:
>
> ' This package will be a strictly limited number of copies, due to the
> nature of our agreement regarding 'The Keep'. This might be your last
> chance ever to get hold of an officially authorized version of this
> extremely wanted item.'
>
>
> Only $180 U.S., people. Go to it! ;-)
>
>
>
> SEAN MONTGOMERY Animator
>
> T O P I X / Mad Dog
> http://www.topix.com/~sean
>
> > Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing original
messages in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed from this list), send
a blank e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
> Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
>
From:
Gustavo Jobim Only $180 U.S., people. Go to it! ;-)
>
>SEAN MONTGOMERY Animator
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
'Steven Le Vine' From: 'John Gentile'
>
> SEAN
> I also think this is a huge rip-off I would like to own The
> Keep sound track(and I mean The soundtrack from the movie itself) not what
> they are pushing as official ST. $180.00 is very steep for 2 CDs and a tee
> shirt.
Replies
Name/Email
Yahoo! ID
Date
Size
18976
Re: The Keep?
Sean Montgomery
Tue
11/9/1999
1 KB
18977
Re: The Keep?
upnsm0ke
Tue
11/9/1999
1 KB
24446
The Keep?
Craig Chambers
Tue
10/17/2000
4 KB
24449
Re: The Keep?
Joe Shoults
Tue
10/17/2000
2 KB
24450
Re: The Keep?
quarlie@a...
Wed
10/18/2000
2 KB
24451
Re: The Keep?
Feldon Feldon
Wed
10/18/2000
2 KB
From:
Sean Montgomery I think Martin from TDI is a nice guy & I do not blame the messenger.
I second that. I don't blame Martin at all...in fact, I sent my message
about the Booster package the very second that his message came
up...in other words, mine wasn't a response.
Anyway, sure TDI wants to make money and all that, but I really think that
this package is a shameless attempt to extort money from their fans.
If Virgin ends up putting The Keep on the market a couple of months from
now, the fans who shelled out over 100 bucks for it here have every right
to be upset. Of course, I'm sure that TDI would just say 'hey, ours was
the only *officially authorized* one. Blah.
SEAN MONTGOMERY Animator
T O P I X / Mad Dog
http://www.topix.com/~sean
From:
'upnsm0ke' From: Sean Montgomery
>
> Anyway, sure TDI wants to make money and all that, but I really think that
> this package is a shameless attempt to extort money from their fans.
'Nuff said. I pity da fool who shells out $180 US for two discs and a
tee-shirt. Fuq that.
E-Man
From:
'Marcel Engels' From: Gustavo Jobim
>
> >6:30 - This flute phrase is a band favorite which was recycled by Chris
> several times in later compositions.
>
> gfj: Where else could we (I) find this theme?
For instance on his solo live album: London Concert.
Don't know if I heard it on other albums though, maybe on Encore?
Marcel
Music-page :http://home.wxs.nl/~m1engels
Email :fsp@w...
From:
'Jeffrey Au Yeung'
From:
Steven Feldman Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 12:32:00 -0500 (EST)
>Really-From: Sean Montgomery
>From: tadream@o...
>Subject: [tadream] The Keep available in TD Holiday Booster
>
>' This package will be a strictly limited number of copies, due to the
>nature of our agreement regarding 'The Keep'. This might be your last
>chance ever to get hold of an officially authorized version of this
>extremely wanted item.'
>
>Only $180 U.S., people. Go to it! ;-)
Drop your drawers and spread your cheeks -- wide -- this one's
gonna hurt! :( :( :( ;) :( :( :(
Back in 1997, those fortunate enough to see TD on tour were able
to fork over $45.00 for a copy of THE KEEP SPECIAL EDITION, and there
were those -- myself included -- who found this price inordinately
high. But $180.00?!?!?!? Gimmee a breaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaak!
I've been reamed by the Norse God before, but this time I think
he's slathering some Tabasco on before doing the deed.
>Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 21:34:29 -0500 (EST)
>Really-From: Sean Montgomery
>From: tadream@o...
>Subject: Re: [tadream] The Keep?
>
>Anyway, sure TDI wants to make money and all that, but I really think
>that this package is a shameless attempt to extort money from their
>fans. [. . ]
What, and the (D)REAM DICE 10-CD box set *wasn't*?
>If Virgin ends up putting The Keep on the market a couple of months
>from now, the fans who shelled out over 100 bucks for it here have
>every right to be upset. [. . .]
I dunno. The http://www.snafu.de/~tadream/mainmenu.html quote
seems to imply that this might be all there is, but how they can call
it 'an officially authorized version' is beyond me.
>Really-From: 'upnsm0ke'
>From:
>Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 18:49:24 -0800
>Subject: Re: [tadream] The Keep?
>
>>From: Sean Montgomery
>>
>>Anyway, sure TDI wants to make money and all that, but I really think
>>that this package is a shameless attempt to extort money from their
>> fans.
>
>'Nuff said. I pity da fool who shells out $180 US for two discs and a
>tee-shirt. Fuq that.
And I pity the fools who later find out that the print run on this
puppy was/is even lower than that of the 1997 release -- and what's the
1997 release go for these days? $120.00? $150.00? More???
So, the choice is spread 'em for $180.00 now, or spread 'em for
even more than *that* later!!!!! Merry Christmas. :( :( :( :(
-- Steven Feldman
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
When you try to snort a book up your nose instead of actually reading it,
you get a mess like Mann's 'The Keep.' -- F. Paul Wilson, April 29, 1999
Replies
Name/Email
Yahoo! ID
Date
Size
18986
Re: Merry Christmas from Ed: Another KEEP Reaming
Nigbur D
Tue
11/9/1999
4 KB
From:
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Date: Tue Nov 9, 1999 3:31
am
Subject: Re: The Keep available in TD Holiday Booster
In a message dated 08-11-1999 12:39:18 PM EST, sean@t... writes:
<< Only $180 U.S., people. >>
Unfair business practices!!
Warm up your CD burners.
Phil N.
From:
Alistair.Hull@l...
Date: Tue Nov 9, 1999 3:31
am
Subject: Alistair Hull is out of the country
I will be out of the office from 11/04/99 until 11/11/99.
I shall be over iat the European User Exchange, So I will also be unable to
easily check Voice Mails. If you have an urgent need to schedule one of my team
of Technical Consultants, then Please contact Ann Marriot on 770-399-9910 x
2246. I will respond any message(s) requiring action when I return.
Regards
Alistair
From:
'Steven Le Vine' From: Alistair.Hull@l...
>To: tadream@o...
>Subject: [tadream] Alistair Hull is out of the country
>Date: Mon, Nov 8, 1999, 10:31 PM
>
> From: Alistair.Hull@l...
>
>
> I will be out of the office from 11/04/99 until 11/11/99.
Don'tja love life in the siber world?
Thank's for letting us know, Alistair's computer. :)
Hey you guys can go on & on about TD & CDs I can make an ammusing
observation.
Besides, I am really upset about this 'Keep thing'. Gee.... Is'nt
there anything we can do? I mean TDI is doing this to us. All I can
think of is the poor children who will not get presents cause Dad
needs a copy of a CD (GWOC) that will be $14.00 in a couple of months!
:}
Anyway, guess I'll live. I mean I can find a copy someday maybe even
for under $100.00. Or maybe one of them overseas distributors on 'the
net' will actually have what they advertise (At least I got
apologies).
That's all. I ain't really in the mood to review Strat now. Even
though it is Really Good & the versions on Tang. Amb. 1 & 2 are an
excellent tribute.
The TD curse continues... The las song on Strat. is what, Invisible
Limits?
On TA 1 it is listed as Invisible Lights. HAR-DE-HAR-HAR!
siberkat
>
From:
James Joystick > >6:30 - This flute phrase is a band favorite which was recycled by Chris
>> several times in later compositions.
>>
>> gfj: Where else could we (I) find this theme?
>
>For instance on his solo live album: London Concert.
>Don't know if I heard it on other albums though, maybe on Encore?
Yeah, the theme is used in 'Vermillion Sands', an extremely energetic and
heavy track which sounds a lot like my beloved 'Horizon' (end of Poland)
and the helicopter scene from 'The Park Is Mine'... There is a similar
passage in 'Quichotte Part I', but it's not the same... as well as the
one in 'Encore'... the one in 'Cyclone' is not the same either...
...Let me see... a phrase from 'Dolphin Dance' was used in 'Stratosfear
1995'... No, no.
Sorry, I don't remember where else it was used, by I can swear I heard it
in another piece... could it be in one of the Babylon 5 scores?
This will force me to re-listen to my entire TD collection in order to
find it...
Heheh! Not a bad idea!
jjoy
From:
'Heiko Heerßen' From: Sean Montgomery
>
> Only $180 U.S., people. Go to it! ;-)
>
The price is ridiculous. How low can you go? Come on, if you buy the T-shirt
and the 'Great wall of China' CD as separate items this would cost you about 40
or 50 Dollars.
Just wait a few months and then TD will re-issue The 1999 Keep edition, 'back
by popular demand' for 20 bucks.
I'm really a TD diehard and have spent a few thousand Deutschmarks on my
favourite band...but this is too much for me.
Heiko
From:
Nigbur D ----------
> From: Steven Feldman[SMTP:AR402004@B...]
> Reply To: tadream@o...
> Sent: 09 November 1999 02:54
> To: Tangerine Dream mailing list
> Subject: [tadream] Merry Christmas from Ed: Another KEEP Reaming
>
> From: Steven Feldman
>
> >Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 12:32:00 -0500 (EST)
> >Really-From: Sean Montgomery
> >From: tadream@o...
> >Subject: [tadream] The Keep available in TD Holiday Booster
> >
> >' This package will be a strictly limited number of copies, due to the
> >nature of our agreement regarding 'The Keep'. This might be your last
> >chance ever to get hold of an officially authorized version of this
> >extremely wanted item.'
> >
> >Only $180 U.S., people. Go to it! ;-)
>
> Drop your drawers and spread your cheeks -- wide -- this one's
> gonna hurt! :( :( :( ;) :( :( :(
> Back in 1997, those fortunate enough to see TD on tour were able
> to fork over $45.00 for a copy of THE KEEP SPECIAL EDITION, and there
> were those -- myself included -- who found this price inordinately
> high. But $180.00?!?!?!? Gimmee a breaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaak!
> I've been reamed by the Norse God before, but this time I think
> he's slathering some Tabasco on before doing the deed.
>
> >Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 21:34:29 -0500 (EST)
> >Really-From: Sean Montgomery
> >From: tadream@o...
> >Subject: Re: [tadream] The Keep?
> >
> >Anyway, sure TDI wants to make money and all that, but I really think
> >that this package is a shameless attempt to extort money from their
> >fans. [. . ]
>
> What, and the (D)REAM DICE 10-CD box set *wasn't*?
>
> >If Virgin ends up putting The Keep on the market a couple of months
> >from now, the fans who shelled out over 100 bucks for it here have
> >every right to be upset. [. . .]
>
> I dunno. The http://www.snafu.de/~tadream/mainmenu.html quote
> seems to imply that this might be all there is, but how they can call
> it 'an officially authorized version' is beyond me.
>
> >Really-From: 'upnsm0ke'
> >From:
> >Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 18:49:24 -0800
> >Subject: Re: [tadream] The Keep?
> >
> >>From: Sean Montgomery
> >>
> >>Anyway, sure TDI wants to make money and all that, but I really think
> >>that this package is a shameless attempt to extort money from their
> >> fans.
> >
> >'Nuff said. I pity da fool who shells out $180 US for two discs and a
> >tee-shirt. Fuq that.
>
> And I pity the fools who later find out that the print run on this
> puppy was/is even lower than that of the 1997 release -- and what's the
> 1997 release go for these days? $120.00? $150.00? More???
> So, the choice is spread 'em for $180.00 now, or spread 'em for
> even more than *that* later!!!!! Merry Christmas. :( :( :( :(
>
> -- Steven Feldman
> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> When you try to snort a book up your nose instead of actually reading it,
> you get a mess like Mann's 'The Keep.' -- F. Paul Wilson, April 29, 1999
>
> > Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing original
> messages in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed from this list),
> send a blank e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
> Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
>
From:
'Heiko Heerßen' Is this Keep edition identical to the version sold on the 1997 tour then, or
> is it a different compilation?
>
I guess this is a good question for Martin Kay. There has been no information
on the TD website regarding the tracklisting of the re-issue. I bet it will be
the same. Although I would be very glad to
hear the finale ('Snowman theme') in studio quality. God knows why it wasn't
included in the 1997 edition...grrr....
Heiko
Replies
Name/Email
Yahoo! ID
Date
Size
18994
Re: Merry Christmas Mr. Froese
Joel Mullen
Tue
11/9/1999
1 KB
18997
Re: Merry Christmas Mr. Froese
Sean Montgomery
Tue
11/9/1999
1 KB
From:
'Yensen, Stephen'
From:
'Yensen, Stephen'
From:
'Poulton, Larry'
Alright, so it's a little late...
I can't add much to what has already been said, except for the fact that I
can only play this
in the background. It's too dark and rambling to sit back and listen to it,
except for just
one track ... GRIND!!! It is an absolute stonker and I'm often putting
this one on repeat play
because I like it so much.
One thing though, it is so unlike anything else on the album that I feel it
doesn't belong there...
Anyone else have this thought?? Mmmm??
Cheers,
Steve.
np: Stratosfear - another absolute stonker of an album ...
============ STEVE YENSEN ===============
Home: syensen@i...
http://www.innotts.co.uk/~syensen/
(the internet in nottingham)
Work: Stephen.Yensen@s...
(Siemens Communications)
No animals were harmed in the production and
transmission of this e-mail ...
Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing original
messages in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed from this list), send
a blank e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
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______________________________________________________________________
From:
Steve Jenkins
From:
Totta Rydqvist From: Steve Jenkins
>
> [From deep lurk mode]
>
> I know this list is monitored, hence the post. Ouch...if the band
> really thought hard about this they'd have made the offer at cost.
> going into the Millenium in this way sure fucks with the Socialist
> leanings Edgar had through the 70's and early 80's.
>
> Hhmm Berlin Wall and early 80's communist Poland to 180 bucks for 2 CDs
> and a T shirt - the man ought to be ashamed.
>
> Steve
>
> [Back to deep lurk mode]
>
> > Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing original
messages in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed from this list), send a
blank e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
> Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
From:
TOMX01@a...
Date: Tue Nov 9, 1999 6:52
pm
Subject: Re: Re: The Keep available in TD Holiday Booster
I think it is a reasonable price, supply versus demand, after all there are
only so many copies they can sell under their agreement with Virgin. And as
for waiting for a Virgin release ... forget it. There is no way in the world
Virgin will go through the legal hassles of securing the rights of this work
from the studio.
I for one will be ordering it.
Tom (Melrose)
N.P. Pergamon
From:
Joel Mullen
Date: Tue Nov 9, 1999 7:34
pm
Subject: RE: Merry Christmas Mr. Froese
You guys need to read the fine print. The Keep CD is 'a very special bonus
gift'
Therefore the T-Shirt and Wall of China CD is what costs $180. 'The Keep' is
a gift from our friend Ed..... ;-)
And if it is like Valentine Wheels the WoC CD will be $13 after it is released
in
the US. $180-$13=$167 for postage and a T-shirt.
How does the saying go? 'with friends like that who needs enemies'
All that being said I am still bending over and getting the *package*
Joel
From:
Radu Velicescu
Date: Tue Nov 9, 1999 7:58
pm
Subject: Re: Re: The Keep available in TD Holiday Booster
> Hhmm Berlin Wall and early 80's communist Poland to 180 bucks for 2 CDs
> and a T shirt - the man ought to be ashamed.
>
> Steve
Well, like Tom said - supply and demand. The fans asked for it so
insistently that TDI laid out the bait. You want something so bad, you
may even piss away $180, not tell the wife, etc. IMO the fans are really
being taken advantage of, TDI knows the demand for the Keep is high, so
skyward goes the price. Why be surprised? This is what every business
person would do, maximize the profit. Who knows though, there may be real
issues here, such as legal battles fought, money matters that had to be
dealt with. Maybe TDI will actually post a real reason and not 'can't
afford it, don't buy it' message on the guestbook.
Maybe Groove will get the package, or the individual Keep CD. Kees?...
Radu
np - Encore - a superb, classic CD - and only $12!!!
From:
'twosheds'
Date: Tue Nov 9, 1999 7:59
pm
Subject: Re: TDI booster
>Who said that TD is not in it for the money?
Well, if that's true, they need a lesson in economics: they'd sell a hell of
a lot more GWoC's if they were about US$15 a piece instead of 50. Wal-Mart
does more business than Nordstrom...
Scott
Replies
Name/Email
Yahoo! ID
Date
Size
19003
Re: TDI booster
Jens Peschke
Tue
11/9/1999
1 KB
19015
Re: TDI booster
Gabe Yedid
Wed
11/10/1999
2 KB
19017
Re: TDI booster
Jens Peschke
Wed
11/10/1999
2 KB
19018
Re: TDI booster
Greg
Wed
11/10/1999
2 KB
19019
Re: TDI booster
Joel Mullen
Wed
11/10/1999
1 KB
19020
Re: TDI booster
Joel Mullen
Wed
11/10/1999
1 KB
19026
Re: TDI booster
Rainer Rutka
Thu
11/11/1999
2 KB
19051
Re: TDI booster
Gabe Yedid
Fri
11/12/1999
2 KB
19059
Re: TDI booster
twosheds
Fri
11/12/1999
1 KB
From:
Sean Montgomery
Date: Tue Nov 9, 1999 7:54
pm
Subject: RE: Merry Christmas Mr. Froese
> All that being said I am still bending over and getting the *package*
Joel! Don't do it! You're just encouraging them. Just don't look,
keep your wallet shut, and the business people lose their magical power.
SEAN MONTGOMERY Animator
T O P I X / Mad Dog
http://www.topix.com/~sean
From:
'twosheds'
Date: Tue Nov 9, 1999 8:03
pm
Subject: Re: Alastair Hull is our of the country and can't we do something?
>Anyway, guess I'll live. I mean I can find a copy someday maybe even
>for under $100.00. Or maybe one of them overseas distributors on 'the
>net' will actually have what they advertise (At least I got
>apologies).
Talk about an invitation to piracy! Just kidding, of course!
Scott
NP: Grateful Dead, Winterland, SF, CA 6/9/77
From:
'Jim Moore'
Date: Tue Nov 9, 1999 8:06
pm
Subject: Re: Re: The Keep available in TD Holiday Booster
> I know this list is monitored, hence the post. Ouch...if the band
> really thought hard about this they'd have made the offer at cost.
> going into the Millenium in this way sure fucks with the Socialist
> leanings Edgar had through the 70's and early 80's.
>
> Hhmm Berlin Wall and early 80's communist Poland to 180 bucks for 2 CDs
> and a T shirt - the man ought to be ashamed.
Supply and demand... if no one buys then, the price will go down. If
they're all bought, then this kind of trend will continue.
But, geez, people; with all these complaints, you'd think TDI was *forcing*
you to buy these items. But, no, they're not. GREAT WALL will
be available later for a reasonable price. The T-shirt will probably
be available seperately, too. I can't speak for the KEEP, but those
who really want it will find a way (like when it was previously
available).
Just cool down and be patient...
- jim
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
-
'The dream is always the same...' -- Joel, Risky Business
jimbo@v... -- Jim Moore, Atlanta, Georgia
Home Page: http://www.jimbo.vivid.net
From:
'Thomas'
Date: Tue Nov 9, 1999 8:13
pm
Subject: The Keep available....
Hello everyone!
Many of you think $180 is rediculous for two CDs and a t-shirt (make no
mistake, so do I). But how many CDs do you need to sell of a release to
actually make a profit? Can you release 200 ex (or however many there may be)
of an item AND make a profit??? I don't know, but if the number of copies is
low it's natural the price go up to cover the costs. Am I being reasonable or
just ignorant?
I bought the set, because i WANT it. It doesn't feel good to pay that much, but
at least I'll own an original copy of 'the Keep' (or how original the reworked
version may be).
Have a day!
Thomas
Sweden
Replies
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Yahoo! ID
Date
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19002
Re: The Keep available....
TOMX01@xxx.xxx
Tue
11/9/1999
1 KB
19006
Re: The Keep available....
SCRIBE1964@xxx.xxx
Wed
11/10/1999
1 KB
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Re: The Keep available....
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Wed
11/10/1999
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Re: The Keep available....
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Wed
11/10/1999
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Re: The Keep available....
Jens Peschke
Wed
11/10/1999
1 KB
From:
'Jared White' From: Klaus Beschorner
>
> The track Stratosfear itself has always remained my all-time
> favourite piece of music. Even above the original rests the
> 1986 live version, which I first heard in Cologne. This is
> not released on any offical record, so in it's own is
> reason enough to start collecting bootlegs.
>
> As yet another shameless promotion of my new homepage, and
> to have you all help to determine how well it actually is
> connected, you can download an MP3-version of this
> masterpiece from:
>
> http://www.caby.de/Music
Uh, no offense, but this version sounds rather stupid to me. It just
sounds like random Canyon Dreams-era 'orchestra hit'-type stuff stuck on
top of the original Stratosfear track right off the 1976 album. The
Stratosfear cameo on Encore as well as Stratosfear '95 are both much
better versions, IMO!
BTW, the choral voices on the Valentine Wheels version of Stratosfear
'95 was a brilliant touch, IMHO. I first heard S95 on Tyranny of Beauty,
and thought it was 'OK', but then I heard the VW version and went WOW!
Plus, Zlatko's guitar playing, while perhaps more up front than
Gerald's, was much more interesting. I just have to confess that
Gerald's guitar playing bugs the living daylights out of me! Zlatko has
style, finese, and can go hog-wild without being obnoxious. Boy, I sure
wish I could see him live!
(P. S. One wonders why TD got Gerald instead of Edgar doing it himself.
I mean, getting Zlatko makes some sense, because the Z man really is an
amazing guitarist. But Gerald? Give me Edgar's Coldwater Canyon-style
playing any day!)
Anyway, take care now, and let's hope the Keep will *eventually* come
out in a larger, cheaper run!
Regards,
Jared
__________________________________________
Jared White E-mail: jwhite@g...
GaelDesign: http://www.gaeldesign.com
iReview: http://www.gaeldesign.com/ireview
The Digital Fine Art Gallery:
http://www.gaeldesign.com/gallery
Distant Oaks: http://www.distantoaks.com
Personal Site: http://www.sonic.net/~jwhite
Try BeOS Today! http://www.be.com
From:
TOMX01@xxx.xxx
Date: Tue Nov 9, 1999 8:30
pm
Subject: Re: The Keep available....
Let us remember that TDI music is a business. A business formed to allow
Edgar to continue producing high quality music and continue to add to his
body of work despite waning popularity. If the TDI business isn't successful
then Edgar will have to admit defeat and retire. Nobody is forcing anyone to
part with money if they are not comfortable with it but a release of this
nature is the only way TDI can release the keep. I'm sure Edgar would love to
release the keep as a normal TDI release but this is simply not possible.
Tom (melrose)
From:
'Jens Peschke' From: 'twosheds'
>
> >Who said that TD is not in it for the money?
>
> Well, if that's true, they need a lesson in economics: they'd sell a hell
of
> a lot more GWoC's if they were about US$15 a piece instead of 50. Wal-Mart
> does more business than Nordstrom...
Sorry, but it looks you need to take a lesson in economics. ;-)
With GWoC TDI combine two strategies -
one takes into account the snob effect at a higher price
and the other will be the legal (cheaper) mass (?) release later,
maybe spiced up with a stonking cover...
Wal-Mart price and marketing strategies simple won't work for the products
of
TDI, btw. However they could offer different products - from a marketing
point of view. 8-)
Best Regards
Jens
From:
'Patrik *'
From:
'Ken Mitchell'
From:
SCRIBE1964@xxx.xxx
Date: Wed Nov 10, 1999 12:19
am
Subject: Re: The Keep available....
> . . . But how many CDs do you need to sell of a release to actually make a
profit?
> Can you release 200 ex (or however many there may be) of an item AND make a
> profit??? I don't know, but if the number of copies is low it's natural the
> price go up to cover the costs. . . .
I'm sure there's some truth to this, but it still wouldn't cost them THAT
much. And TDI's official response (so far) has been that 'The Keep' is a
collector's item. IMHO, this kind of business practice is indefensible.
Does this mean that the next time they tour, they will charge scalper's
prices for tickets?
--Scribe
From:
Robert Williams
I don't think anyone's commented on this yet, which is somewhat
surprising! TDI has just launched another 'Booster' package to suck money
from our wallets. This one has an interesting twist! Of course it offers
the new 'Great Wall of China' album, and a T-Shirt...but in addition,
they're throwing in 'The Keep!' Yes, kiddies, the very one. It has a new
(ugly) cover, and is touted as the 'Original Motion Picture Soundtrack'.
No word on whether the track listing is the same as the one distributed
during their tour, but I would imagine that it is. Here's the official
wording:
' This package will be a strictly limited number of copies, due to the
nature of our agreement regarding 'The Keep'. This might be your last
chance ever to get hold of an officially authorized version of this
extremely wanted item.'
Only $180 U.S., people. Go to it! ;-)
SEAN MONTGOMERY Animator
T O P I X / Mad Dog
http://www.topix.com/~sean
Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing original
messages in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed from this list), send
a blank e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
From:
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Date: Wed Nov 10, 1999 7:05
am
Subject: Re: The Keep available....
In a message dated 09-11-1999 9:02:11 PM EST, SCRIBE1964@a... writes:
<< And TDI's official response (so far) has been that 'The Keep' is a
collector's item. IMHO, this kind of business practice is indefensible.
Does this mean that the next time they tour, they will charge scalper's
prices for tickets?
--Scribe >>
Point -- Match -- Game!!
PRN
From:
Steven Feldman
- - - - - - -
Quip: 'Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.' --Albert Einstein
Another: 'Science is to investigate the unexplained, not to 'explain' the
univestigated.' --Stanton Friedman (nuclear physicist and UFO researcher)
From:
Jeff Stevenson 1. Special Millennium X- Mas Collector's Packs
>
[SNIP]
>This package will be a strictly limited number of copies, due to the
nature of
>our
> agreement regarding 'The Keep'. This might be your last chance ever to get
>hold of
> an officially authorized version of this extremely wanted item.
Martin,
Would you please elaborate on 'strictly limited'. Exactly how many will
there be? Would you also post a track listing?
Thanks.
Jeff Stevenson
jsteven@o...
Greymane on Kali - #24670 *** ICQ #312642
(also in #TADREAM in IRC) I HIGHLY recommend these programs!
From:
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Date: Wed Nov 10, 1999 7:00
am
Subject: Re: The Keep available....
In a message dated 09-11-1999 3:31:20 PM EST, TOMX01@a... writes:
<< Nobody is forcing anyone to
part with money if they are not comfortable with it but a release of this
nature is the only way TDI can release the keep. I'm sure Edgar would love
to
release the keep as a normal TDI release but this is simply not possible.
Tom (melrose) >>
Excuse me? Then why release it at all? I'm sure all at TDI had
tears in their eyes when the were 'forced' to release only a paltry few
copies. And I grieve for their sorrow as they wail and gnash their teeth
about what they can release next week.
Isn't the number of TD albums released in a twelve month period at
an all time high?
Phil N.
From:
Grant M Somerville
From:
Nigbur D ----------
> From: Jared White[SMTP:jwhite@s...]
> Reply To: tadream@o...
> Sent: 09 November 1999 20:30
> To: tadream
> Subject: RE: [tadream] D:Studio [Stratosfear]
>
[snip...]
> Gerald's guitar playing bugs the living daylights out of me! Zlatko has
> style, finese, and can go hog-wild without being obnoxious. Boy, I sure
> wish I could see him live!
>
> (P. S. One wonders why TD got Gerald instead of Edgar doing it himself.
> I mean, getting Zlatko makes some sense, because the Z man really is an
> amazing guitarist. But Gerald? Give me Edgar's Coldwater Canyon-style
> playing any day!)
>
This just goes to show how opinions differ...
Zlatko is undoubtedly a great guitarist and a really nice bloke on top of
that, but from a listener's point of view, I prefer the Gradwool/Hornby
combination (e.g. on Goblins' Club). I keep thinking that Zlatko needs to
calm down a bit...
Taken on its own, his guitar work is great, but I think G/H are better
suited to TD purposes...I'd prefer even more if Edgar got his Gibson out
again, though...haven't seen that in ages!
Dennis
From:
'Jens Peschke' Isn't the number of TD albums released in a twelve month period
at
> an all time high?
Yep, you're right at least concerning the quantity...
From:
Gabe Yedid From: 'Jens Peschke'
>
> > From: 'twosheds'
> >
> > >Who said that TD is not in it for the money?
> >
> > Well, if that's true, they need a lesson in economics: they'd sell a hell
> of
> > a lot more GWoC's if they were about US$15 a piece instead of 50. Wal-Mart
> > does more business than Nordstrom...
>
> Sorry, but it looks you need to take a lesson in economics. ;-)
> With GWoC TDI combine two strategies -
> one takes into account the snob effect at a higher price
> and the other will be the legal (cheaper) mass (?) release later,
> maybe spiced up with a stonking cover...
Does any of this have to do with the extraordinarily high costs of
shipping things from Germany, maybe?
I haven't gotten too many things from Germany, but the few times that I
have, I noted the numbers on the stamps of the packages. I asked Rainer
Rutka about this once, and what I understood is that these prices are in
fact in deutschemarks. Over 1000 DM to send a a 2CD case from Konstanz to
Montreal!!! If prices like that were being charged by Canada Post or the
US Postal Service, there'd be riots in the streets I tell you!
But I just wanted to know if that was a possible reason for the high
prices--it simply reflects the cost of doing business in Germany.
>
> Jens
Gabe
From:
'Glenn Folkvord (JMJ FKN)' I haven't gotten too many things from Germany, but the few times that I
>have, I noted the numbers on the stamps of the packages. I asked Rainer
>Rutka about this once, and what I understood is that these prices are in
>fact in deutschemarks. Over 1000 DM to send a a 2CD case from Konstanz to
>Montreal!!! If prices like that were being charged by Canada Post or the
>US Postal Service, there'd be riots in the streets I tell you!
the price you are talking about, 1000 DM, is not possible. That is aproximately
550 US dollars. Not even German post rates are that high!!
kind regards,
glenn
From:
'Jens Peschke' From: Gabe Yedid
> Does any of this have to do with the extraordinarily high costs of
> shipping things from Germany, maybe?
Nope. That's about free markets and competition.
Our postal market isn't totally free yet, so we have to
choose 'Deutsche Post', who are outstanding expensive
especially outside Europe. Usually it's at least 200% of what you have to
pay
for the return - they are quick, though.
Also the price schemes are a bit unfair. In the UK and the USA
you have to pay for each 20gr or 28 gr (IIRC) whereas
a paket with 101 gr is the same as a 250 gr paket over here.
Of course a single CD with jewel box in a decent jiffy bag is 103 gr
so sending two CDs and two jewel boxes is as expensive as sending just
one...
> But I just wanted to know if that was a possible reason for the high
> prices--it simply reflects the cost of doing business in Germany.
Nope, as I said it depends if the market is free or not.
After changing our telephone/internet provider we now pay about 33% of what
used to pay
to the bloody German Telekom. Using the Internet is still not cheap - about
35 (US) cents per hour incl. telephone line (plus 10 bucks/month for the ISP
account)... ;-)
.. but don't ask those in smaller cities without decent providers...
Best Regards
Jens
From:
'Greg' From: Gabe Yedid
>
> Does any of this have to do with the extraordinarily high costs of
> shipping things from Germany, maybe?
>
> I haven't gotten too many things from Germany, but the few times that I
> have, I noted the numbers on the stamps of the packages. I asked Rainer
> Rutka about this once, and what I understood is that these prices are in
> fact in deutschemarks. Over 1000 DM to send a a 2CD case from Konstanz to
> Montreal!!! If prices like that were being charged by Canada Post or the
> US Postal Service, there'd be riots in the streets I tell you!
>
> But I just wanted to know if that was a possible reason for the high
> prices--it simply reflects the cost of doing business in Germany.
> Gabe
Well Gabe..
it must cost a fortune to ship within Germany too..
as it's the same price all around.. you see it's $180 PLUS
shipping!
Greg H.
NP: FSOL Dead Cities
From:
Joel Mullen Does any of this have to do with the extraordinarily high costs of
> shipping things from Germany, maybe?
I am sure that is some justification, but remember that the Stimpack 5
only costs $90 for 5 CDs including shipping, (or $18 each w/shipping.)
Lets wait and see how much the T-shirts are going to be priced at and
then you can figure out what is left over.
From:
Joel Mullen Well Gabe..
> it must cost a fortune to ship within Germany too..
> as it's the same price all around.. you see it's $180 PLUS
> shipping!
>
> Greg H.
No, that price 'includes' shipping. Take another look! :-)
From:
Steven Feldman From:
>Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 15:06:26 -0500
>Subject: Re: [tadream] Re: The Keep available in TD Holiday Booster
>Really-From: 'Jim Moore'
>
>[. . .] with all these complaints, you'd think TDI was *forcing*
>you to buy these items. But, no, they're not. GREAT WALL will
>be available later for a reasonable price. The T-shirt will probably
>be available seperately, too. I can't speak for the KEEP, but those
>who really want it will find a way (like when it was previously
>available).
When do you mean . . . in 1983/1984, or 1997? I really want the
one from 1983/1984, but don't have it yet. And as for wanting something
and finding a way, it seems to me that there is only *one* person on
this list who has the actual Sony topping-off ceremony CD -- and it
wont't surprise me if no one else here ever gets a copy. Wishing for
something and getting it are two entirely different things.
>Just cool down and be patient...
That's right, kiddies, sit on your hands until you see a copy of
the CD at a yard sale for 50 cents twenty-five years from now -- but
don't hold your breath.
>Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 15:30:56 EST
>From: tadream@o...
>Really-From: TOMX01@a...
>Subject: Re: [tadream] The Keep available....
>
>Let us remember that TDI music is a business. A business formed to allow
>Edgar to continue producing high quality music [. . .]
Oh, so *that's* what you call HOLLYWOOD YEARS I and II, THE DREAM
ENCORES, TRANSSIBERIA, SOHOMAN and VALENTINE WHEELS! Silly me; and I
thought those were all doo doo.
[. . .] Nobody is forcing anyone to part with money if they are not
>comfortable with it but a release of this nature is the only way TDI
>can release the keep. [. . .]
Oh, is it really? How do you know that? Have you spoken with
their accountant recently, perchance? If they can only release it
with a price tag of $180, how did they manage to release it with a tag
of $45 in 1997?
It seems to me that this 'free with a purchase of two other items'
stunt is akin to a gambit for selling quasi-illegal stuff on eBAY that
I've seen a few times:
'Buy this postcard of Ricky Martin for $75.00, and for free, you'll get
a special 2-CD concert set of THE BEST OF MARIAH CAREY, available only
here!'
In other words, Ed does *not* have the rights, so the only way he
can disseminate copies is to pass them off as 'free' in a package deal.
The pathetic part is milking the fans while keeping the lawyers away.
You'd think that since this was a free item, they'd at least add in
the stuff that they supposedly didn't want to pay royalties for, i.e.
Howard Blake's THEME FROM THE SNOWMAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Time
will tell, since a track list hasn't been released yet. I'll tell ya,
for $180, the THEME FROM THE SNOWMAN *better* be there, and I mean the
seven minute and twenty-six second version from the long TV ending,
me buckos!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Arrrrrrrrgggggggghhhhhhhhh! X-0 ;)
-- Steven Feldman
+ - - - - + - - - - + - - - - + - - - - + - - - - + - - - - + - - - - +
Ben and Jerry: ice cream with enough saturated fat to kill a blue whale
Eddie & Jerry (TD): band with enough CD releases to kill a bank account
Replies
Name/Email
Yahoo! ID
Date
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19045
Re: Buy this postcard of Ricky Martin and get thi
Gustavo Jobim
Thu
11/11/1999
1 KB
From:
'Alan Benson' Message: 20
> Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 23:55:17 GMT
> From: 'Ken Mitchell'
> Subject: Message from Ken Mitchell
>
> Without any prior warning Microsoft cleared my entire e-mail
> account. I lost a load of messages - anyone who has tried to
> contact me recently please do so again.
>
> Chris from Cambridge - sorry mate your address was on
> the mails that were deleted - please let me have it again.
>
> Alan Benson - please contact me ASAP.
>
> Ken Mitchell
________________________________________________
Dear Ken,
Computers & servers:
You know um.
You love um.
You can't bloody well
live without um!
BTW,
ASAP?
ROFL LOL...
Fear NOT my TD friend
-- e-mail help is on the way...
-- Al
Berkeley, CA / USA
************************
PS: Chris only subs to the
Tadream tangerinedream
list. I'll let him know as well.
PPS: I'm still back logged (SNAFU!), and am
currently asking my lawyers to offer a counter
offer to the opposing sides first (pitiful) offer
of a final settlement. If they don't match my
request, I'll take my chances and have the
WCAB judge decided the matter in court!
I'm in no bloody hurry... The court date to
be set sometime before Christmas, 'Bah
Humbug!' LOL ;-)
NP: 'Blade Runner' (Wait for Me) by Vangelis.
Rachel to Deckard: '...You know those files
on me?' LOL (CD Atlantic #82623-2).
*******************************************************
__________________________________________
NetZero - Defenders of the Free World
Get your FREE Internet Access and Email at
http://www.netzero.net/download/index.html
From:
'Jeffrey Au Yeung'
From:
SCRIBE1964@xxx.xxx
Date: Thu Nov 11, 1999 5:25
am
Subject: Re: Some comments on the high price of the Xmas Booster
> To those who don't have the original the Keep: pls ask TDI about the
> possibility of the Virgin release before you buy - and ask in detail about
> 'the nature of our agreement regarding 'The Keep''
This is great advice, except that TDI has never heard of the concept of
customer service. If you ask them why the Xmas Booster is so damned
expensive, their answer is 'though. Don't buy it.' When previously asked
about the delays concerning 'The Keep,' their answer has been 'ask Virgin!'
And we're their friggin' fans!!!
I would LOVE to have a copy of 'The Keep,' simply because I am a fan of TD
and of this soundtrack in particular, but I won't buy it at this price. And
I think anyone who does is just encouraging them to continue with these
practices.
--Scribe
From:
'Marcel Engels'
From:
Rainer Rutka I haven't gotten too many things from Germany, but the few times that I
> have, I noted the numbers on the stamps of the packages. I asked Rainer
> Rutka about this once, and what I understood is that these prices are in
> fact in deutschemarks. Over 1000 DM to send a a 2CD case from Konstanz to
> Montreal!!! If prices like that were being charged by Canada Post or the
> US Postal Service, there'd be riots in the streets I tell you!
NONONO !
The prices on our stamps here in Germany are in Pfennig (Cents).
That means: 100 = 1 DM = 0,45 $ !
Postage for 2 CDs ist approx. 15 DM if sent by airmail.!
Rainer Rutka
---------------------------------------------------------------------
TD-page -> http://home.t-online.de/home/rutka
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
From:
'Nick Adams' From: 'Jeffrey Au Yeung'
> - There are special CDs from other musicians who are sold at much lower
> price, for instance, the Klaus Schulze Ultimate Edition set (I refer here
to
> the price per disc), even the Neuronium special CDs and the Roedelius ones
> are only at US$30 or so.
What special Neuronium CD's are you talking about Jeffrey.
Nick
Home Nicad@c...
Work Nick.Adams@p...
Replies
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Yahoo! ID
Date
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Re: Neuronium ( Was Some comments on the high pr
Jeffrey Au Yeung
Thu
11/11/1999
2 KB
19042
Re: Neuronium ( Was Some comments on the high pr
Nick Adams
Thu
11/11/1999
2 KB
19043
Re: Neuronium ( Was Some comments on the high pr
Marcel Engels
Thu
11/11/1999
2 KB
From:
'F.H. Dumay'
From:
'Marcel Engels' From: 'F.H. Dumay'
>
> Personally, i think that the price of $180,= is rather high, but i must
> agreee with TDI in that respect, that if you find it to expensive, don't
> by it! On the other hand, i don't mind this if it is a single time gag,
> but I am not sure what signal we will give if they would sell all the
> packages...
Exactly...if it was a one time release only then it may have been different.
But it has been released before and for less money...
And who knows what the future will bring?
Strange marketing concepts.
Reminds me of ordering a bed a couple of weeks ago.
I should have received it on 4th nov. then it was the 8th and then it would
be delivered next saturday...they had delivery problems and the one who from
who I ordered it suggested that it's best to cancel the order.
???????? Now, do you want to sell me a bed or not???????????
I really can't understand it.
(well, I would have cancelled it anyway, but for someone who is trying to
sell
you something and then say don't buy it...)
Marcel
Music-page :http://home.wxs.nl/~m1engels
Email :fsp@w...
From:
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Date: Thu Nov 11, 1999 2:41
pm
Subject: Re: Some comments on the high price of the Xmas Booster
In a message dated 11-11-1999 2:44:25 AM EST, fsp@w... writes:
<< All this talk about the Keep...
I've got the Blue Moon version and I don't listen
to it much actually. I don't find the music that
interesting...it's okay but nothing more then that.
I really wonder if it was normally available the people
would still think the same about The Keep. >>
I got the impression somewhere, perhaps by mistake, that the Blue
Moon Boot was significantly different from the Official version. Is this
true? I also have the Blue Moon version, and I think that it is just so much
crap. Particularly since I paid a fortune for it, although nothing like one
hundred and eighty American.
Phil N.
From:
'Marcel Engels' From: PNaunton@a...
>
> I got the impression somewhere, perhaps by mistake,
> that the Blue
> Moon Boot was significantly different from the Official version. Is this
> true? I also have the Blue Moon version, and I think that it is
> just so much
> crap. Particularly since I paid a fortune for it, although
> nothing like one
> hundred and eighty American.
I don't have the 'Official' version so I don't know.
I know from talk on the lists that the 'Official' version got other
tracks on it which sounds 'newer'.
Because I have the Blue Moon I never bothered to get the official one.
Marcel
Music-page :http://home.wxs.nl/~m1engels
Email :fsp@w...
From:
Steven Feldman 1:53
15. The Keep 'End Theme' (Remix) (2:22) cf 70/90 2 > 2:28
* indicates track not on COMPLETE WORKS OF THE KEEP CD-R
+ - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - +
| THE COMPLETE WORKS OF THE KEEP CD-R from 1994 | 2/20/99
+ - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - +
Total running time 74:06
1. Sailing Mission (3:52) cf BM 6
2. Reign of Terror (5:20) cf BM 3
3. Dinu Pass I (3:02) cf BM 1
4. Dinu Pass II (4:08) cf BM 2
5. Mighty Castle (8:15) cf BM 9
6.+*Leave Taking (1:22) (cf LOGOS TYPE?)
7.!*Crossing Saver (4:02)
8.+*Gloria (1:42) volume is diff from film version
9. *Denounce (3:45) cf BM 7 (4:38), but starts 0:16 later than BM 7
10.!*Terrible (5:42)
11. Fisherman's Morning (6:44) cf BM 4
12. Glow in the Dark (8:20) cf BM 5; cf LOGOS PT. 1
13.+*The Keep Theme (3:57)
14. Sailing Mission (3:05) < cf BM 13
15. Gloria (3:06) < cf BM 10, cf TDI 1
16. Fisherman's Morning (3:20) < cf BM 12, cf TDI 2
17. Romanian Road (2:52) < cf BM 11, cf TDI 4
* indicates tracks not on the BLUE MOON boot
! indicates faked tracks that were created by editing
+ indicates not from the film nor on the Blue Moon boot
+ - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - +
| The Official [TDI] THE KEEP--SPECIAL EDITION CD from 1997 | 2/19/99
+ - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - +
Total running time 60:06
1. Puer Natus est Nobis (Gloria theme) (3:09) cf Blue Moon track 10
2. Ancient Powerplant (4:28) cf Blue Moon track 12: Fisherman's M +
3. The Silver Seal (3:07)
4. Voices from a Common Land (4:06) cf Blue Moon track 11: Romanian +
5. Arx Allemand (4:24)
6. The Night in Romania (3:15) cf LOG TYPE 6: Renewed Purpose
7. Canzone (2:51)
8. Sign in the Dark (4:19) cf LOGOS TYPE track 5: Desert Run
9. Weird Village (3:23)
10. Love and Destiny (3:31)
11. The Challenger's Arrival (4:32) cf Blue Moon track 6: Evil - sort of
12. Supernatural Accomplice (4:07)
13. Parallel Worlds (4:29)
14. Truth and Fiction (2:52)
15. Wardays Sunrise (3:20)
16. Heritage Survival (4:13) cf LOGOS TYPE trck 3: Rush of Joy + guitar
+ - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - +
| The LOGOS TYPE boot from 1997 (Berlin, 1992): | 2/19/99
+ - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - +
Total running time of selections 22:14
Tracks 3-7 contain music not on LOGOS that sounds similar to
that in the film known as 'The Keep.'
3. Rush of Joy (5:09) cf TDI track 16: Heritage Survival
4. Mirage (2:37)
5. Desert Run (3:57) cf TDI track 8: Sign in the Dark; cf South Camora
6. Renewed Purpose (4:18) cf TDI trck 6: The Night in Romania
7. Dreamscape (6:12) ???
_______________________________________________________________________
OFFICIAL [TDI] THE KEEP compared to BLUE MOON and THE COMPLETE WORKS:
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Okay. Now let's get down to business. I'll comment and remark on
similarities between TDI010, the other two CDs, and film itself track-
by track, in sequential order.
1. Puer Natus est Nobis (Gloria theme) (3:09)
This track is pretty much the same as Blue Moon track 10, but it
has nice instrumentation in the background which makes it vastly
superior to the virtually a cappella version on the Blue Moon boot.
2. Ancient Powerplant (4:28)
This is Blue Moon track 12--one of the four tracks broadcast on
German radio--'Fisherman's Morning' (3:20), but this version is better
and longer. The song itself appears nowhere in the film.
3. The Silver Seal (3:07)
This track, reminiscent of material on HYPERBOREA and of 'Love
Phantasy' off the FLASHPOINT soundtrack, contains music not in the film,
and not on the Blue Moon boot nor LOGOS TYPE.
4. Voices from a Common Land (4:06)
This is Blue Moon track 11--one of the four tracks broadcast on
German radio--'Romanian Road' (2:52), and seems to be identical to the
version on the BM boot, except longer. The song itself appears nowhere
in the film.
5. Arx Allemand (4:24)
This is a jaunty, neo-classical tune that sounds somewhat like a
combination of the styles of Tomita and Walter/Wendy Carlos, and brings
to mind what a funkified version of 'Hobo March' (a/k/a 'Ode to Granny
A' off Edgar's AGES album) might sound like. This tune does not appear
in the film, the Blue Moon boot, nor LOGOS TYPE.
6. The Night in Romania (3:15)
Finally! A tune that is not a cover of a classical composition
that actually appears in the film! This music comes from the climax
where Dr. Cuza yells to Molasar, 'So . . . you prove yourself to *me*!'
This music also appears on LOGOS TYPE as Track Six. It is not on the
Blue Moon boot.
7. Canzone (2:51)
This tune also appears in the film. It comes from the sequence
wherein Dr. Cuza walks out of the sub-basement of the keep and past the
silver crosses in the walls which light up as he passes them. It is not
on the Blue Moon boot nor LOGOS TYPE.
8. Sign in the Dark (4:19)
This track corresponds to LOGOS TYPE Track 5. This music, although
quite Keep-esque, does not appear in the film nor on the Blue Moon boot.
9. Weird Village (3:23)
This track is reminiscent of an early track on the WAVELENGTH
soundtrack. I'm not sure which track. This tune does not appear in the
film nor the Blue Moon boot nor LOGOS TYPE.
10. Love and Destiny (3:31)
This track is reminiscent of material on the DESTINATION BERLIN
soundtrack, even though DB is from 1989 and THE KEEP is from 1983! It
did not appear in the film, nor the Blue Moon boot, nor on LOGOS TYPE.
11. The Challenger's Arrival (4:32)
This track is very similar to Blue Moon track 6, Evil Healing. At
the 3 minute mark, however, this 'official' version diverges. The Blue
Moon boot version is better IMHO because it is spookier. This tune does
not appear in the film nor on LOGOS TYPE as far as I know, and yet, since
most of what is on the Blue Moon boot is indeed in the film, I am not
sure of this.
12. Supernatural Accomplice (4:07)
This track starts off sounding like a track of the WAVELENGTH
soundtrack, then has a portion of the beginning of 'Cloudburst Flight'
(from FORCE MAJEURE), then is similar to Blue Moon track 4, 'Deadly
Silver Crosses,' but the contents of the tune are in a different order
so that the backwards-air sound at the end of 'Deadly Silver Crosses'
appears towards the beginning of 'Supernatural Accomplice' (this track).
This version of the song does not appear in the film per se: it is a
variant. It is not on LOGOS TYPE at all.
13. Parallel Worlds (4:29)
This music does not appear in the film, nor the Blue Moon boot, nor
on LOGOS TYPE. It is unique and unlike anything else TD has done. I
have all four of Johannes Schmoelling's albums, and it is my guess that
this track is 100% Johannes' doing since I don't hear any Froese
influence whatsoever.
14. Truth and Fiction (2:52)
This track, which does not appear in the film nor on LOGOS TYPE,
has sounds at the end that are similar to those found on track 12 (which,
in turn, corresponds to Blue Moon Track 4, 'Deadly Silver Crosses').
Otherwise, this track is all-new (to *me*, at least).
15. Wardays Sunrise (3:20)
This track, which does not appear in the film nor the Blue Moon boot
nor LOGOS TYPE, features a guitar lead similar to that on track 11 ('The
Challenger's Arrival').
16. Heritage Survival (4:13)
This track, which does not appear in the film nor the Blue Moon
boot, is basically LOGOS TYPE Track Three with guitar added, but it
fades out, leaving the impression that, like 'Silver Scale,' it is an
excerpt from a longer piece. This is a great, majestic tune, similar to
the ending of 'Logos Pt. II,' but more upbeat. It is more or less the
high point of the LOGOS TYPE boot.
So, there you have it. There are only three and a half tracks that
appear in the film (track 12, 'Supernatural Accomplice,' being the half).
One of the three tracks broadcast on German radio, 'Sailing Mission,' is
nowhere to be found. The long variant of 'Moorland' in the film which
clocks in at about seven minutes is not be found. Ditto the seven-minute
ending that appears on the UHF-only syndicated TV broadcasts of the film.
Actually, not even the end tune from the *regular* cut of the film is on
the TDI010 CD!
For those who like the film more than TD per se, a better bet than
TDI010 would be the Blue Moon boot and tracks 3-7 on LOGOS TYPE (or 22
22 minutes of TD's 1982 Croydon concert, starting at the 6:40 mark).
o LOGOS TYPE Track 3: Rush of Joy = TDI Track 16: 'Heritage Survival'
o LOGOS TYPE Track 5: Desert Run = TDI Track 8: 'Sign in the Dark'
o LOGOS TYPE Track 6: Renewed Purpose = TDI Track 6: 'Night in Romania'
It's not too late for us to get a more for-real THE KEEP soundtrack:
maybe the *non*-Special Edition version will be more like the Blue Moon
boot and actually feature a lot of music from the film! ;) Hey, and
there's even the remote possibility that one of us will actually find a
copy of the original 1984 issue of THE KEEP and we'll be able to find
out if that version had as little music from the film as TDI010 does.
_________________________________________________________________________
THE COMPLETE WORKS compared to OFFICIAL [TDI] THE KEEP and BLUE MOON: 2/20/99
---------------------------------------------------------------------
1. Sailing Mission (3:52) - Blue Moon #6/Evil Healing (3:51)
cf TDI #11/The Challenger's Arrival (4:32)
2. Reign of Terror (5:20) - Blue Moon #3/The Black Soldiers (5:14)
3. Dinu Pass I (3:02) - Blue Moon #1/Dinu Pass (3:07)
4. Dinu Pass II (4:08) - Blue moon #2/The Keep (Main Title) 4:05
5. Mighty Castle (8:15) - Blue Moon #9/The Black Soldiers (1st Mix) 8:57
6.*Leave Taking (1:22) - Appears on no other CD
7.*Crossing Saver (4:02) - FAKE: the 1st part of the movie's Moorland variant
cf Blue Moon #14/The Keep 'Mid Theme' (remix) 1:50
8.*Gloria (1:42) - movie version. Not on TDI, BM, LOGOS, nor LOGOS TYPE
9. Denounce (3:45) - cf BM 7 (4:38), but starts 0:16 later than BM 7
10.*Terrible (5:42) - FAKE: the version of Flying Kamikaze (KAMIKAZE 1989 trck
ten) from the movie + the Logos Pt. II opening
11. Fisherman's Morning (6:44) - Blue Moon #4/Deadly Silver Crosses (6:31)
12. Glow in the Dark (8:20) - Blue Moon #5/Brothers in Death (8:07). In the
movie when the soldiers open the stone block.
13.*The Keep Theme (3:57) - Blue Moon #15/The Keep 'End Theme' (remix) 2:22
14. Sailing Mission (3:05) - Blue Moon #13 (3:00)
15. Gloria (3:06) - Blue Moon #10 (3:05)
cf TDI #1/Puer Natus est Nobis (Gloria theme) 3:09
16. Fisherman's Morning (3:20) - Blue Moon #12 (3:20) is this vers. different?
cf TDI #2/Ancient Powerplant (4:28) longer?
17. Romanian Road (2:52) - Blue Moon #11 (2:52)
cf TDI #4/Voices from a Common Land (4:06) longer!
* tracks not on the BLUE MOON boot; note absence of BLUE MOON track 8
Replies
Name/Email
Yahoo! ID
Date
Size
19033
Re: Comparisons: Blue Moon, COMPLETE WORKS and TD
Joe Shoults
Thu
11/11/1999
1 KB
19040
Re: Comparisons: Blue Moon, COMPLETE WORKS and TD
Owens James
Thu
11/11/1999
2 KB
From:
'Joe Shoults' -----Original Message-----
> From: Steven Feldman [mailto:AR402004@B...]
> Sent: Thursday, November 11, 1999 10:08 AM
> To: Tangerine Dream mailing list
> Subject: [tadream] Comparisons: Blue Moon, COMPLETE WORKS and TDI
> SPECIAL EDITION
>
>
From:
'Poulton, Larry'
From:
'Jeffrey Au Yeung' From: 'Marcel Engels'
>
> All this talk about the Keep...
> I've got the Blue Moon version and I don't listen
> to it much actually. I don't find the music that
> interesting...it's okay but nothing more then that.
Marcel,
To a certain extent I agree with you about the music of The Keep - it's not
as outstanding as Sorcerer or Thief, not innovative either, but some
mysticism is possibly the main attraction for the Keep.
> I really wonder if it was normally available the people
> would still think the same about The Keep.
> It's because it's rare the people want it so bad.
Again I think the mysticism and the limited availability combined makes it
kind of obscure/curious collectible.
Jeffrey
From:
'Jeffrey Au Yeung' From: 'Nick Adams'
>
> > From: 'Jeffrey Au Yeung'
>
> > - There are special CDs from other musicians who are sold at much lower
> > price, for instance, the Klaus Schulze Ultimate Edition set (I refer
here
> to
> > the price per disc), even the Neuronium special CDs and the Roedelius
ones
> > are only at US$30 or so.
>
> What special Neuronium CD's are you talking about Jeffrey.
>
> Nick
>
Nick,
On Neuronium's website at http://www.neuronium.com/Music4U.htm,
http://www.neuronium.com/cdGold.htm &
http://www.neuronium.com/neuroOrder.htm (the structure of the pages are kind
of mess), are a few limited edition signed CD (or CDRs) of Neuronium's
recent and early works (inc. Quasar 2C361and Vuelo Quimico). I haven't got
any of them yet, for financial reasons. I am sure I will get them some
time, if they are/will still be available. Not sure, as I never inquired.
BTW I am very interested in those recordings feat. Santi Pico, He's a really
great guitarist.
Jeffrey
From:
Owens James -----Original Message-----
> From: PNaunton@a...
>
> I got the impression somewhere, perhaps by mistake, that the
> Blue
> Moon Boot was significantly different from the Official version. Is this
> true? I also have the Blue Moon version, and I think that it is just so
> much
> crap. Particularly since I paid a fortune for it, although nothing like
> one
> hundred and eighty American.
>
> Phil N.
From:
TOMX01@xxx.xxx
Date: Thu Nov 11, 1999 5:40
pm
Subject: TDI Business ethics
A lot has been said on many different subjects regarding the practices
employed by Tangerine Dream and TDI music.
1) Fabrication of material.
Why would TD fabricate material for the keep soundtrack? By declaring that it
is material commissioned for the keep they would be waiving the publishing
rights to this material. That is definitely not TD practise. Therefore the
official keep release must be genuine.
2) The price of The Millennium Booster is too high.
As I pointed out on the TDI guest book, and was subsequently barbecued for,
if TDI sold their allocated copies of the Keep for any less they would simply
end up being bought by people simply interested in trading them. this would
mean that the fans who really want it would still have to shell out a great
deal of money. I can't see anything unethical in that.
Tom (Melrose)
From:
'Glenn Folkvord (JMJ FKN)'
From:
Owens James -----Original Message-----
> From: Steven Feldman
>
> OFFICIAL [TDI] THE KEEP compared to BLUE MOON and THE COMPLETE WORKS:
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> 11. The Challenger's Arrival (4:32)
>
> This track is very similar to Blue Moon track 6, Evil Healing. At
> the 3 minute mark, however, this 'official' version diverges. The Blue
> Moon boot version is better IMHO because it is spookier. This tune does
> not appear in the film nor on LOGOS TYPE as far as I know, and yet, since
> most of what is on the Blue Moon boot is indeed in the film, I am not
> sure of this.
>
[...]
> One of the three tracks broadcast on German radio, 'Sailing Mission,' is
> nowhere to be found.
From:
Owens James -----Original Message-----
> From: 'Poulton, Larry'
>
> Check out the following link
>
> http://www.cyberden.com/cyberden/database/Lyrics/Tangerine_Dream/
>
> also go up to parent directory to see other artists....
>
> Larry
>
From:
'Nick Adams' From: 'Jeffrey Au Yeung'
>
>There are a few limited edition signed CD (or CDRs) of Neuronium's
> recent and early works (inc. Quasar 2C361and Vuelo Quimico). I haven't got
> any of them yet, for financial reasons. I am sure I will get them some
> time, if they are/will still be available. Not sure, as I never inquired.
> BTW I am very interested in those recordings feat. Santi Pico, He's a
really
> great guitarist.
>
> Jeffrey
Ah i see, ........ i have Quasar and Vuelo Quimico on LP they are excellent
works, in fact probably their best IMO, ....., have you heard ''Carlos
Guirao's Revelation'' it is very similar in style to Quasar and Vuelo
Quimico, i have this on Lp as well btw.
Nick
NP.Agitation Free / Fragments ...Did you know Chris Franke Featured on this
album ?
Home Nicad@c...
Work Nick.Adams@p...
From:
'Marcel Engels' From: 'Jeffrey Au Yeung'
>
> On Neuronium's website at http://www.neuronium.com/Music4U.htm,
> http://www.neuronium.com/cdGold.htm &
> http://www.neuronium.com/neuroOrder.htm (the structure of the
> pages are kind
> of mess), are a few limited edition signed CD (or CDRs) of Neuronium's
> recent and early works (inc. Quasar 2C361and Vuelo Quimico). I haven't got
> any of them yet, for financial reasons. I am sure I will get them some
> time, if they are/will still be available. Not sure, as I never inquired.
> BTW I am very interested in those recordings feat. Santi Pico,
> He's a really
> great guitarist.
Stunning albums Quasar and Vuelo. Simple but very nice, little bit of
singing.
I got them on CDR, transferred from LP incl. little clicks/hiss but thats
okay.
Marcel
Music-page :http://home.wxs.nl/~m1engels
Email :fsp@w...
From:
Gustavo Jobim From: James Joystick
>
>>> >6:30 - This flute phrase is a band favorite which was recycled by Chris
>>> several times in later compositions.
>>>
>>> gfj: Where else could we (I) find this theme?
>>
>>For instance on his solo live album: London Concert.
>>Don't know if I heard it on other albums though, maybe on Encore?
>
>Yeah, the theme is used in 'Vermillion Sands', an extremely energetic and
>heavy track which sounds a lot like my beloved 'Horizon' (end of Poland)
>and the helicopter scene from 'The Park Is Mine'... There is a similar
>passage in 'Quichotte Part I', but it's not the same... as well as the
>one in 'Encore'... the one in 'Cyclone' is not the same either...
>...Let me see... a phrase from 'Dolphin Dance' was used in 'Stratosfear
>1995'... No, no.
>Sorry, I don't remember where else it was used, by I can swear I heard it
>in another piece... could it be in one of the Babylon 5 scores?
>
>This will force me to re-listen to my entire TD collection in order to
>find it...
>Heheh! Not a bad idea!
>
>jjoy
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Gustavo Jobim something and getting it are two entirely different things.
I wish I could buy the complete Beethoven works box, which is around 1200
dollars, for example, but I won't get it, as well as I'd like to buy the
KS's Ult. Edition.
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Gustavo Jobim 35 (US) cents per hour incl. telephone line (plus 10 bucks/month for the ISP
>account)... ;-)
>
>.. but don't ask those in smaller cities without decent providers...
>
>Best Regards
>
>Jens
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Gustavo Jobim
From:
'Carl & Jacqui Kearney'
From:
'Ken Mitchell' Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 19:31:58 -0800
> From: 'Alan Benson'
>Subject: Re: Re: Message from Ken Mitchell.
>
>
>In Tadream #274 (11/10/99):
>
>Ken wrote:
>
> > Message: 20
> > Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 23:55:17 GMT
> > From: 'Ken Mitchell'
> > Subject: Message from Ken Mitchell
> >
> > Without any prior warning Microsoft cleared my entire e-mail
> > account. I lost a load of messages - anyone who has tried to
> > contact me recently please do so again.
> >
> > Chris from Cambridge - sorry mate your address was on
> > the mails that were deleted - please let me have it again.
> >
> > Alan Benson - please contact me ASAP.
> >
> > Ken Mitchell
>________________________________________________
>
>
>Dear Ken,
>
>Computers & servers:
>You know um.
>You love um.
>You can't bloody well
>live without um!
>
>BTW,
>ASAP?
>ROFL LOL...
>
>Fear NOT my TD friend
>-- e-mail help is on the way...
>
>-- Al
>Berkeley, CA / USA
Aye ! Like women eh ?
Thanks to all those that expressed sympathy.
Microsoft actually restored about two thirds of the messages they randomly
deleted. There was no accompanying explanation - it was all done in the same
impersonal fashion as the deletion. I guess I should be impressed that a
trillion dollar turnover company responded at all to a non fee paying punter
but the whole episode has left me wiser and more cynical.
Ken
From:
Vic Rek
From:
Gabe Yedid From: Rainer Rutka
>
> On Wed, 10 Nov 1999, Gabe Yedid wrote:
>
> > I haven't gotten too many things from Germany, but the few times that I
> > have, I noted the numbers on the stamps of the packages. I asked Rainer
> > Rutka about this once, and what I understood is that these prices are in
> > fact in deutschemarks. Over 1000 DM to send a a 2CD case from Konstanz to
> NONONO !
> The prices on our stamps here in Germany are in Pfennig (Cents).
> That means: 100 = 1 DM = 0,45 $ !
> Postage for 2 CDs ist approx. 15 DM if sent by airmail.!
>
> Rainer Rutka
Well OK, thanks for clearing THAT up!!!
Also, to reply to Jens' comments about the free-market situation...
When you say that the postal market is not free, does that mean that
Deutsche Post is really the only game in town? There aren't any
courier services allowed, not even UPS?
And if there are couriers, does TDI ship through them, or do they use
Deutsche Post as well?
The couriers aside, Canada Post is a monopoly in the same sense.
It would be unconscionable for them to charge prices as high as Deutsche
Post's seem to be, though. It's not like we have dozens of private mail
companies all competing for a piece of the postal pie here!
Gabe
From:
'Jeffrey Au Yeung' From: Vic Rek
>
> Anyway, so far Windham Hill has not released any TD, except for one
> track on a CD.
>
> The trivia question is to name this track. All fans and collectors are
> eligible.
>
> The first person to answer this question will get to choose 2 CD-Rs from
> my list or pick 1 offical TD CD from a list that I'll provide.
>
> Have fun!
> Vic
>
> > Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing original
messages in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed from this list), send
a blank e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
> Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
>
>
From:
Steven Feldman
From:
Klaus Beschorner
From:
'Jens Peschke'
Date: Fri Nov 12, 1999 11:28
am
Subject: Re: Re: TDI booster/KEEP
> From: Gabe Yedid
> Also, to reply to Jens' comments about the free-market situation...
>
> When you say that the postal market is not free, does that mean that
> Deutsche Post is really the only game in town? There aren't any
> courier services allowed, not even UPS?
There are other companies, of course. But DP still has the monopoly for
socalled 'Briefe' (incl pakets up to 500 gr.) for private customers.
Companies already have free choice and often send mass mailings from
the Netherlands as it is cheaper (mass mailings from German companies to
German customers), so the market in Germany is a bit odd.
And about 7 USD postage for sending a single CD overseas helped me a lot not
trading with North Americans too much. (Hi Vic!)
UPS is bloody expensive, btw. I use German Parcel instead for huge pakets.
> And if there are couriers, does TDI ship through them, or do they use
> Deutsche Post as well?
Most likely not DP. If they are clever enough they use GP for example. Are
they clever ? 8-)
As to the KEEP:
>From: Gustavo Jobim
>I just want to know - what's SO special about the Keep *soundtrack*?
Which one ? ;-)
The '97 version is so-so, some tracks are really good, tho.
If you take into account the tracks that could be on a real KEEP soundtrack
incl. the good stuff not used in the film, it could be a good release.
'The Keep' is highly overrated, IMO.
Best Regards
Jens
From:
Rainer Rutka > From: Rainer Rutka
>> NONONO !
>> The prices on our stamps here in Germany are in Pfennig (Cents).
>> That means: 100 = 1 DM = 0,45 $ !
>> Postage for 2 CDs ist approx. 15 DM if sent by airmail.!
> When you say that the postal market is not free, does that mean that
> Deutsche Post is really the only game in town? There aren't any
> courier services allowed, not even UPS?
NO ! We can use anything we want. Unfortunately the German Post is the
slowest but the cheapest. If I send 2 CD to the U.S. by UPS I have to
pay approx. 120 DM (!) and more. TNT is expensive, too.
I sent a lot of packages the last years to the U.S. and other countries
and IMO the 'normal' post is the only economical way to do it.
> And if there are couriers, does TDI ship through them, or do they use
> Deutsche Post as well?
No I don't think so. If I remember well, it was sent by UPS (but I'm
not shure about it!). Can't remember!
> The couriers aside, Canada Post is a monopoly in the same sense.
> It would be unconscionable for them to charge prices as high as Deutsche
> Post's seem to be, though. It's not like we have dozens of private mail
> companies all competing for a piece of the postal pie here!
The German post does _not_ have the monopoly for packages. But they are
the cheapest (by far!). All private mail companies are more expensive.
Example: Postage for 4 CDs from Germany to the U.S. (or Canada....)
+ handling and a.t.s. (all the sh...) is about approx. 30,- DM
if sent by airmail. The receiver get the 'goodies' between
6 and 10 days later.
If _not_ sent by airmail (overseas-shipping) it's only half the
price but it takes 6 weeks (!) for delivery.
Rainer
rainer@k...
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TD-page -> http://home.t-online.de/home/rutka
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19057
Re: The German Post
Heiko Heerßen
Fri
11/12/1999
1 KB
From:
'Heiko Heerßen' Example: Postage for 4 CDs from Germany to the U.S. (or Canada....)
> + handling and a.t.s. (all the sh...) is about approx. 30,- DM
> if sent by airmail. The receiver get the 'goodies' between
> 6 and 10 days later.
> If _not_ sent by airmail (overseas-shipping) it's only half the
> price but it takes 6 weeks (!) for delivery.
German postage costs and the TDI millennium booster...
two ways to lose your money the fast way! ;-)
From:
'Simon Slator'
From:
'twosheds'
Date: Fri Nov 12, 1999 6:18
pm
Subject: Re: TDI booster
>Hey, it's not just 2 CDs and a shirt. It's the absolute last chance to get
a
>real rarity, which will go up in value. If you feel it's too expensive,
>there is nothing wrong with it: just don't buy it. -
OK! All my money's going to Pokemon now anyway. :-)
Scott
From:
Sean Montgomery
Date: Fri Nov 12, 1999 6:25
pm
Subject: Architecture in Motion - Thumbs Up!
I just got my copy of Architecture in Motion in the mail today, and must
say that I'm pleasantly surprised by what I'm hearing. While it's hardly
a TD 'classic', I prefer it to Mars Polaris, and I'm sure that opinion is
in the minority here on the list. The main reason I feel that way though
is that the tracks on this album hold together better as individual
compositions. They generate decent grooves and moods...and *sustain* them
long enough to engage me, whereas Mars Polaris let go of good sounds and
atmospheres before they had time to develop fully. I like *parts* of
Outland and Astrophobia a lot, but I like *all* of Silver Screen quite a
bit. Perhaps it's the fact that they were scoring long sequences that
compelled them to keep the track consistent for the duration of the scene.
There's also a 'darker' element to AiM than most 90s TD...but I find
it hard to explain what I mean by that. I'm not schooled in musical
composition, so I can't say whether it's the key they're playing in or
whatever, but it's there...particularly in tracks like Silver Screen and
Forced to Surrender (the latter of which is like a Dream Mix version
of the Near Dark soundtrack). The percussion is generally pretty good,
as is the sound design...and I even like the two remixes at the
end...they're better than the originals, and I'm glad they weren't cut
from the Miramar release.
Architecture in Motion isn't a stellar album, but I do like it, and
I felt it important to say that, given how much complaining I do about TD
here on the list!
SEAN MONTGOMERY Animator
T O P I X / Mad Dog
http://www.topix.com/~sean
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Re: Architecture in Motion - Thumbs Up!
Jared White
Fri
11/12/1999
3 KB
19062
Re: Architecture in Motion - Thumbs Up!
Greg
Fri
11/12/1999
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Re: Architecture in Motion - Thumbs Up!
Jared White
Fri
11/12/1999
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Re: Architecture in Motion - Thumbs Up!
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Sun
11/14/1999
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19084
Re: Architecture in Motion - Thumbs Up!
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Sun
11/14/1999
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Re: Architecture in Motion - Thumbs Up!
Andrew J. Rozsa
Tue
11/14/2000
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Re: Architecture in Motion - Thumbs Up!
Jared White
Sun
11/14/1999
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Re: Architecture in Motion - Thumbs Up!
Jared White
Sun
11/14/1999
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Re: Architecture in Motion - Thumbs Up!
PNaunton@a...
Mon
11/15/1999
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From:
'Jared White'
Date: Fri Nov 12, 1999 8:07
pm
Subject: RE: Architecture in Motion - Thumbs Up!
> From: Sean Montgomery
>
> I just got my copy of Architecture in Motion in the mail
> today, and must
> say that I'm pleasantly surprised by what I'm hearing. While
> it's hardly
> a TD 'classic', I prefer it to Mars Polaris, and I'm sure
> that opinion is
> in the minority here on the list.
Actually, I've heard a lot of people (I think mainly on the TDI
guestbook) say that they liked WAB/AiM better that Mars Polaris. Isn't
that interesting....
You know what? This may shock a lot of you, but I, Mr. '90's TD! They
can do no wrong!' Jared 'Mars Polaris is a masterpiece!' White, the guy
who was heaping ridiculous amounts of praise on MP only a few months
ago, the guy who said TD was going to new heights, am becoming rather
unenthusiastic about Mars Polaris. I had been e-screaming until I was
e-blue-in-the-face how great it was, until a couple people made a couple
comments that really got me thinking. They were both basically the same
complaint, which was that practically every piece was 'beat-driven' and
had drums going on almost *all* of the time. Once I realized that they
were right, and I started listening to MP from that viewpoint, I started
becoming less and less impressed by it. I don't know why, really --
since I think the Dream Mixes series is incredible. Maybe it's a matter
of focus. The Dream Mixes were focused on a style that encompassed drums
and beat-driven music all the time (techno/dance/etc.). But Mars Polaris
was *supposed* to be focused on space. Even when there was rather slow,
spacey music going on (like on tracks 6 and 9), there were drums in the
background. They were unnecessary in those situations.
Don't get me wrong -- I still think MP is a fine album. But it's been
pushed off my pedestal of being this incredible 'TD is BACK!!!'-type
album. In a way, I think Oasis better fits that title, except TD doesn't
seem to be continuing that line of composition these days. :(
I'm quite looking forward to picking up AiM, though, as I liked the
sound clips I've heard on the 'Net. I'll let y'all know what I think of
it, of course. ;)
Take care,
Jared
__________________________________________
Jared White E-mail: jwhite@g...
GaelDesign: http://www.gaeldesign.com
iReview: http://www.gaeldesign.com/ireview
The Digital Fine Art Gallery:
http://www.gaeldesign.com/gallery
Distant Oaks: http://www.distantoaks.com
Personal Site: http://www.sonic.net/~jwhite
Try BeOS Today! http://www.be.com
From:
'Greg'
Date: Fri Nov 12, 1999 8:28
pm
Subject: Re: Architecture in Motion - Thumbs Up!
Sounds like a great album--I'll be sure to pick it up when I can. I like
DM2 a whole lot so this seems like an extension. As far as the music
being beat driven that Jared White was saying, well a lot of it used to
be sequencer driven and to me it's around the same thing. As the
effect on 'Ricochet' as compared to say beat driven 90's material
has simmilar ideas. I think Jerome's drumming has improved
incredibly since 'Tyranny of Beauty' and I'm sure a few would agree
with me on that!
Greg H.
NP: Cusco 'Temple of Rememberance'
> From: Sean Montgomery
>
>
>
> I just got my copy of Architecture in Motion in the mail today, and must
> say that I'm pleasantly surprised by what I'm hearing. While it's hardly
> a TD 'classic', I prefer it to Mars Polaris, and I'm sure that opinion is
> in the minority here on the list. The main reason I feel that way though
> is that the tracks on this album hold together better as individual
> compositions. They generate decent grooves and moods...and *sustain* them
> long enough to engage me, whereas Mars Polaris let go of good sounds and
> atmospheres before they had time to develop fully. I like *parts* of
> Outland and Astrophobia a lot, but I like *all* of Silver Screen quite a
> bit. Perhaps it's the fact that they were scoring long sequences that
> compelled them to keep the track consistent for the duration of the scene.
>
> There's also a 'darker' element to AiM than most 90s TD...but I find
> it hard to explain what I mean by that. I'm not schooled in musical
> composition, so I can't say whether it's the key they're playing in or
> whatever, but it's there...particularly in tracks like Silver Screen and
> Forced to Surrender (the latter of which is like a Dream Mix version
> of the Near Dark soundtrack). The percussion is generally pretty good,
> as is the sound design...and I even like the two remixes at the
> end...they're better than the originals, and I'm glad they weren't cut
> from the Miramar release.
>
> Architecture in Motion isn't a stellar album, but I do like it, and
> I felt it important to say that, given how much complaining I do about TD
> here on the list!
>
>
>
> SEAN MONTGOMERY Animator
From:
'Jared White'
Date: Fri Nov 12, 1999 8:41
pm
Subject: RE: Architecture in Motion - Thumbs Up!
> From: 'Greg'
>
> Sounds like a great album--I'll be sure to pick it up when I
> can. I like
> DM2 a whole lot so this seems like an extension. As far as the music
> being beat driven that Jared White was saying, well a lot of
> it used to
> be sequencer driven and to me it's around the same thing. As the
> effect on 'Ricochet' as compared to say beat driven 90's material
> has simmilar ideas. I think Jerome's drumming has improved
> incredibly since 'Tyranny of Beauty' and I'm sure a few would agree
> with me on that!
Oh, I think Jerome's drumming has always been very innovative, and the
last few years it's gotten to be rather brilliant, IMHO. I was just
saying that it doesn't always seem to 'work' on MP, and early TD was
often NOT beat-driven (or sequencer-driven, if you will) at all. You
mention Ricochet -- think of the beginning of part 2. If it had just
started with the fast and furious sequencer work, it wouldn't have been
half as good as it is because of the beautiful slow piano-and-flute
section at the beginning.
I hate to admit it, but some of you folks are converting me. The more I
listen to the 70's and early 80's albums, the more I realize how
brilliant they really are. There are getting to be fewer and fewer
recent albums of theirs that I still hold with high regard.... I don't
know if that's good or bad, but at least I still have plenty more work
of theirs I can listen to and enjoy! :) (It's truly amazing just how
much work they've done over the years, I really can't believe it
still....)
Anyway, talk to y'all later,
Jared
From:
'Carl & Jacqui Kearney'
Date: Sat Nov 13, 1999 12:27
am
Subject: Transsiberia. Tangram Ian Body UK E Music
OK guys I have had this album now for a few months and just can't get my
head around it at all. Almost another Aqua I think.
Any way the real reason for the post is to ask if anyone has come across
Tangram on CD? I cant seem to find it listed anywhere.I already have three
copys on vinyl one of which is almost smooth and the other two have never
been played ( sad I know ) I could do with the CD version if out there for
the new all singing all dancing system I have set up in my Dream machine
van ) The improved version soon to be breaking windows in your
neighbourhood.
P:S Does anyone know if Ian Body and the like are playing in the UK anywhere
soon ( a question for my Scotish counterparts I think )
Cheers all Carl ' Orch '
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Re: Transsiberia. Tangram Ian Body UK E Music
Grant M Somerville
Sun
11/14/1999
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Re: Transsiberia. Tangram Ian Body UK E Music
Lawry Simm
Tue
11/16/1999
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From:
Quarlie@a...
Date: Sat Nov 13, 1999 2:20
am
Subject: D:Studio [Stratosfear]
Me? Late with a review? Shocking, I know. (Heck, the last one I wrote was so
late I decided not to bother posting it.)
---
1. Stratosfear
Rather atypically, the first thing they do is play a melody. I'm not exactly
sure, but it sounds like a guitar with some sort of filtering. Some washes of
Mellotron sound back it up, and soon, that sequence shows up. It's still
unique 23 years later. As more keyboards join in (as usual, I can't identify
them), it becomes clear that this is going to be a bit more conventionally
melodic than the band's prior efforts.
That 'rolling' sequence, instantly identifiable as TD, appears just in time
for what would I can only call the chorus (maybe 'refrain' is more
appropriate). Another 'verse' of keyboards, and another time through the
chorus, except this time it's a bit different (naturally). That high-pitched
note at 4:34 is pretty striking.
They continue to play the melodies they've used throughout the piece, but
they're a little different each time, with seemingly improvised bits added
around the edges. Very impressive. The music gets more intense as a drum roll
appears (not too surprising after 'Ricochet,' but someone who unknowingly
went from 'Rubycon' to this might wonder what the heck happened).
Hey, a guitar solo. Well, sort of--maybe it's a bit too short to be called a
solo. Neat, though. The drums go away near the end of the guitar part, and
then everything gets quiet for the return of the melody that opened the
track. It's fleshed out a bit more this time, and it sounds great. As for the
ending, it's as atypical as the beginning. An excellent piece of music, but I
admit to missing the floaty ambience that makes 'Rubycon' my favorite.
---
2. The Big Sleep in Search of Hades (huh?)
The first time I ever heard this, years ago, was a somewhat muffled tape
playing on a low-quality deck that I don't even think did had stereo
speakers. The reason I note this is because in that first listening, I
couldn't hear the harpsichord in the background of the intro. (I'm pretty sure
that's the harpsichord, anyway.) All I could hear is that flutey
sound--Mellotron, I assume, since the liner notes don't mention any
flute--and it sounded really spacey to me. It's amazing how much that
harpsichord changes it. Kind of brings it down to Earth.
Some heavy chords come out of nowhere and then we're kind of floating in
space for a bit. That blip-bleep sequence sounds as spacey to me as the flute
in the intro did back when I couldn't hear the harpsichord. Then there are
some more of those heavy chords. Then it's back into space, though this time
it feels more like going forward than floating.
A re-intro takes us planetside once again (although if you can't hear the
stuff in the background it takes you further into space). And that's the end,
after just four and a half minutes. Although it's certainly not boring, I
don't think this track ever really manages to do much. I do like the
space-floating part.
---
3. 3 AM at the Border of the Marsh from Okefenokee
The machine that goes 'ping!' makes an appearance on this track. So does a
harmonica. It's rather laid-back. Naturally, there are some weird electronic
noises going on as well. After a couple minutes, the machine and harmonica go
away, and some Mellotron noises fade in and get really loud. I can't imagine
what this is supposed to evoke, but it's pretty neat. The ping returns, along
with a sequencer playing a simple bassline. That Mellotron flute they used
all the time back then plays an eerie, haunting melody. (Now that I mention
it, that's what they usually did with the Mellotron flute.)
There's a bell/xylophone sound somewhere in here, first appearing near the
five-minute mark, that I really like, and then a great sequence (I assume
it's a sequence, but I guess it might be played by hand) around 5:20. I
particularly enjoy the echo effect (which could, I suppose, also be by hand)
on last three notes of each repetition.
Are those sheep? I never noticed this sound before, but close to 7:00 there's
something that sounds like sheep. Then the various elements fade out for the
return of the harmonica (and the weird electronic noises), and that's how it
ends. This is a great track, and varied.
---
4. Invisible Limits
Simple beginning, with just a bass sequence and some noises in the background
that I can't quite identify. There's a very nice part where the bassline is
joined by Mellotron strings and flute, and the sequence starts to get more
varied (the same basic pattern, but on different notes). Once in a while,
when this track is playing but I'm not listening too closely, I find myself
expecting the beat from the 'Tangerine Ambience' version (by Inter-Mase,
who/whatever that is) to come in.
Things rapidly intensify for a bit at 2:50, where a bit of reverbed snare
drum leads up to a big, dramatic chord. I think I hear a piano, a bell, and a
Mellotron in there. Edgar picks up his guitar and starts to jam a bit, as the
sequence is exchanged for a new, faster one.
This guitar solo, classic Froese, goes on for a while, and then the sequence
seems to speed up further (I think it's actually the same tempo, but with
more notes) as a keyboard appears and gets improvised on in an upbeat
segment. The guitar returns, and the sequences get enjoyably complex, in a
way that reminds me of 'Ricochet.' At some point it all disintegrates into
weird, dissonant ambience. The sequence from the beginning makes a brief
reappearance.
This is followed by a very quiet part, with faint noises echoing through
near-silence. Then comes exactly what you wouldn't expect: a piano solo. The
liner notes say that Edgar played the grand piano, which is interesting
because until I got this I hadn't realized he was such an accomplished
keyboard player. There's a little pseudo-flute sneaking around too, but the
piano gets the final word, with a powerful finale. That last note really says
'!'.
This is my favorite track on the album. The slow intro, the guitar solo, the
speedy, trancy sequence in the middle, and the piano ending--it's all great.
---
This, obviously, is another important album. I like this one a lot, but my
taste for ambience keeps 'Rubycon' on top for me. It mayjust be my
perception, but I think that this one is a less layered and 'deep' than its
studio predecessor. Still, it's a must-have, like most of the Virgin albums.
--Quarlie :)
NP: not Stratosfear anymore
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Re: D:Studio [Stratosfear]
AOutland@xxx.xxx
Sat
11/13/1999
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Vic Rek
Sat
11/13/1999
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tom george
Sun
11/14/1999
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Jim Moore
Tue
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Lawry Simm
Tue
11/16/1999
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11/17/1999
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Sean Montgomery
Wed
11/17/1999
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From:
Vic Rek
Date: Sat Nov 13, 1999 3:21
am
Subject: Re: Windham Hill Trivia Quiz
A Big thanks for the few TD fans that tried to answer this trivia
question.
The winner is SEAN MONTGOMERY from Canada (Jeffrey was only a few
minutes late)! I hope you can let us know how you got the answer?
So I guess I owe you a Logotypes CD-R + another? ;-)
> From: 'Jeffrey Au Yeung'
>
> Heh heh Vic, are you bored by the rants about the X'mas booster...the answer
> is 'Melrose' isn't it?
The answer is correct, but YES I am bored by the rants when TD offers a
'package' to the fans, and all, as usual complain about the price. If
this was a regular release I would be upset, but 'The Keep' is still
special in terms of the legality of the release. Let's not forget that
for all the CD-Rs we pass amongst us - don't you think that our band,
Tangerine Dream, should have something to put into the bank also?? Vic
From:
Steven Feldman
Date: Thu Jan 1, 1970 4:59
am
Subject: Message about 1999 KEEP CD Edition Size (posted to the guestbook)
Hi,
I just posted the followig to the TD guestbook (I guess I'm not
a Tangerine Dream Apologist -- what can I say?):
-- Steven Feldman
+ + + + + + +
TO ALAN BENSON:
Somehow, I don't think you're ever been subscribed to any of the e-mail-
based Tangerine Dream mailing lists, because if you were, you'd know that
the figure of 150 copies of the 1997 KEEP CD being pressed is completely
erroneous. To clarify, TDI announced that 150 copies would be relegated
to online fans, but they reneged and sold them all on a subsequent
European tour. At each of several concert dates, several hundred were
sold, so the figure is probably more like in between 500 and 1500. I
merely asked my question here to put things in perspective vis a vis the
1999 version of the CD.
.
I work in a store that sells limited edition pens. Some are editions of
2000, some of 1000, some of 999, some of 66, some of 25, some of 6, and
so on, but the manufacter's stating of the size of the edition is seen as
a selling point: the smaller the edition, the more expensive the pen,
generally. What's in it for TD to mask what the number of CDs is, and
what's in for them not to play up the fact that the 1999 edition is
smaller than that of the the 1997 edition -- unless, of course, that is
not the case, i.e. that there are more than enough to go around.
.
Another thing that strikes me as odd is that the Sony Topping Off
Ceremony CD 'sold out' of its 300-CD run, and yet, no mention was made of
its (eventual?) availability to fandom. And wasn't the bonus disc that
came with the DREAM DICE set essentially an edition of 300, too? Food
for thought(?).
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Re: Message about 1999 KEEP CD Edition Size (post
Joel Mullen
Sat
11/13/1999
1 KB
From:
Joel Mullen
Date: Sat Nov 13, 1999 5:24
am
Subject: RE: Message about 1999 KEEP CD Edition Size (posted to the guestbook)
On Friday, November 12, 1999 10:19 PM, Steven Feldman
[SMTP:AR402004@B...] wrote:
> From: Steven Feldman
> Another thing that strikes me as odd is that the Sony Topping Off
> Ceremony CD 'sold out' of its 300-CD run, and yet, no mention was made of
> its (eventual?) availability to fandom.
Actually the Sony CD enjoyed a run of 900.
From:
'Jeffrey Au Yeung'
Date: Sat Nov 13, 1999 6:05
am
Subject: Re: Windham Hill Trivia Quiz / Last comment
> From: Vic Rek
>
>
> > From: 'Jeffrey Au Yeung'
> >
> > Heh heh Vic, are you bored by the rants about the X'mas booster...the
answer
> > is 'Melrose' isn't it?
>
> The answer is correct, but YES I am bored by the rants when TD offers a
> 'package' to the fans, and all, as usual complain about the price. If
> this was a regular release I would be upset, but 'The Keep' is still
> special in terms of the legality of the release. Let's not forget that
> for all the CD-Rs we pass amongst us - don't you think that our band,
> Tangerine Dream, should have something to put into the bank also?? Vic
Vic,
I promised not to post the 2nd time on the TD guestbook, because I still
respect the band and what TDI have done for us, so the last appendum to the
issue. The general criticism so far is levelled basically at the high price,
though for myself, my complaint, if any, is the package. I'm not sure about
other fans, but I, who am one of the owners of the Keep Special Edition
already, I am more interested in the Great Wall Of China CD and T-shirt,
because of the fact that I am a Chinese myself and I am curious how the boys
will handle the oriental theme. Nevertheless, given this package consisting
of these 2 CDs and the T-shirt, I cannot buy the Great Wall Of China CD and
the T-shirt only and at a more affordable price because one must purchase
the whole package with an expensive the Keep CD. That's also what I meant
the package is a bit odd and does not cater for fans with such interest and
option. In any case,
Another issue is I wonder if a limited edition CD should be tied in a
package with another CD in a probably unlimited edition. So if there are
many really orders (let's assume), more than what TDI initially thought to
supply, are they to enlarge the edition? We don't know.
Having said the above, after all, I don't really blame TDI myself. Pricing
and packaging aside, I have found their service satisfactory, and they have
been very friendly from my experience. Also, don't forget that they have the
website and the photos and so on, which are free for us to enjoy.
OK I will really shut up on this issue completely.
Jeffrey
>
> > Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing original
messages in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed from this list), send
a blank e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
> Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
>
>
From:
Rainer Rutka
From:
'Jens Peschke'
From:
'Nick Adams' From: 'Carl & Jacqui Kearney'
>
> P:S Does anyone know if Ian Body and the like are playing in the UK
>anywhere soon ( a question for my Scotish counterparts I think )
Well i don't know about Ian Boddy but, Here is what i know
11 Mar 2000 RMI & Under The Dome
22 Apr 2000 Paul Nagle & Arcane
13 May 2000 Airsculpture & Kubusschnitt/wEirD
?? Jun 2000 Asana
All to be at Jodrell Bank '' UK
If you go to the first three concerts, admission to the last one will be
free.
Contact Dave Law for further Enquires david@n...
Nick
Home Nicad@c...
Work Nick.Adams@p...
From:
Steven Feldman Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 15:32:34 +0100 Jens Peschke said:
>Subject: Re: [tadream] THE KEEP-Mystery page online! (Rainer)
>From: Tangerine Dream mailing list
>Really-From: 'Jens Peschke'
>
>I bet even Steven founds details (*) on your page he didn't knew yet.
This is true. Just the same, I have more details, still, that I
didn't post to the list, for fear of taking up too much bandwidth and
trying people's patience more than I already did. I'll be contacting
Rainer about this, and it'll probably wind up on his site.
>Sound of xmas booster for Mr. Feldman !!!!
I don't think so, unless people feel like pitching in and buying
me one. I don't have the money, and if the contents of the 1997 and
1999 releases are the same, I won't be trying to hock anything to buy
one, either.
>KEEP on the good work, Rainer. :-)
Yes, he *did* do a great job.
-- Steven Feldman
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
When you try to snort a book up your nose instead of actually reading it,
you get a mess like Mann's 'The Keep.' -- F. Paul Wilson, April 29, 1999
From:
Steven Feldman
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Re: Web MD
joe shoults
Thu
11/18/1999
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From:
'James Horecka, AIA'
From:
AOutland@xxx.xxx
Date: Sat Nov 13, 1999 5:15
pm
Subject: Re: D:Studio [Stratosfear]
In a message dated 11/12/99 9:21:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, Quarlie@a...
writes: Quarlie:
<< Me? Late with a review? Shocking, I know. >>
Since we spoke about this, you have shamed me into finally joining into
this group again and submitting a review, even late. Cpt Klotz and I
simulplayed Stratosfear a few nights ago. I wish I could remember all the
comments we made; perhaps he will submit his own review as well. Gee, I don't
know what I can add to all the excellent reviews already posted here. I
would like to say that it is terrific to see the new list with new active
people taking part in the discussions. Makes me believe the Dream will never
end.
Stratosfear: Oddly, I also like the '95 version, maybe because I don't have
to think about it so much: it's just a good straightforward melody and beat
to tap to. This older version, however, seems to be trying to tell a story as
most of their earlier works did, but I can't quite grasp what it is saying.
Taking a cue from the title, I would say the rapid beat simulates a heart
beating in fear and anticipation of the unknown. At about 4:45, somebody goes
'eeeeek' and disappears. I get a picture of kids playing in a supposedly
haunted house, doing their best to scare each other. Running up and down
stairs, jumping out from behind creaky doors. In general having a whopping
good time, better than the movies. Exhausted, they finally gather on the
front porch while the quiet calm of the music surrounds them like the fading
colors of the evening into darkness.
Big Sleep: I really liked somebody's suggestion of a person asleep who
briefly wakes up and then returns to sleep. That really describes the three
part progression of this composition. Why anybody would actively search for
Hades I don't know, but dreams can't be counted on to be logical. At 1:45 we
have a sound indicating a clock ticking the passage of time and the slow
decent into deep sleep. I can't add much more to this one.
3 AM: Well, I live in Florida so I know the feeling of swamps. Also, I have
visited the Okeefenokee so I have a taste for its ambience as well. It was a
beautiful place, calm, quiet, shady from the hot sun. However, I was there in
broad daylight. 3AM would be a different story and this music seems to
capture that idea well. Anybody out there at that time of night is probably
up to no good. The boatman is quietly poling his small craft along the bank
of the slow moving stream on the edge of the cypress. Gator hunter, what he
is doing is illegal. He carefully shines a light about, seeking the red glare
of eyes looking back at him. Only the sounds of the bull frogs relieve the
silence. The boat disappears into the blackness of the night swamp.
Invisible Limits: This is my favorite one here. The quiet muffled slow beat
and melody just make it special for me at the start. A hot afternoon, a bored
young man, he decides to take a stroll away from his village, alone, seeking
something, no idea what, anything to take away this dull boredom. The village
elders have cautioned its people not to go to a certain area; it is taboo.
Clang, the music announces that our young man has decided to go exactly
there. He has stepped across the invisible limits. His heart begins to beat.
Why is this place taboo? What is going to happen to him now that he has dared
to take this chance? He moves forward faster, nervously looking about. Drawn
in by the beauty of the place, seeing no danger except the possibilities his
own mind can create. Ahh, I love this softly strummed guitar at 6:30. He
comes to a new path out of his valley. To a new world. This song is dedicated
to those who bravely stepped across the line drawn by others attempting to
keep power. To the first man to prove the world was not flat, to the first
person to eat a clam, to the first woman who decided to wear white after
Labor Day. Sweet melody of success.
8-) Dell
From:
'Andrew J. Rozsa'
From:
Gustavo Jobim >From the updated TDI HomePage...
>
>'Since this year's X- Mas will be the last of the Millennium, we at TDI
>MUSIC decided that we would have to come up with some very special treat
>for your giftbag:......'
>
>The well-known German penchant for precision fails.... would somebody,
>please, tell TD that the new millennium won't start until the 2001, making
>the last Christmas for THIS millennium the one in the year 2000, not 1999?
>
>OTOH, this gaffe may make the Christmas package a true collectors'
>item...you know, like the stamps that were printed upside-down.
>
>File this under 'TD Trivia.'
>
>Andrew
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Vic Rek 3 AM: Well, I live in Florida so I know the feeling of swamps. Also, I have
> visited the Okeefenokee so I have a taste for its ambience as well. It was a
> beautiful place, calm, quiet, shady from the hot sun. However, I was there in
> broad daylight. 3AM would be a different story and this music seems to
> capture that idea well. Anybody out there at that time of night is probably
> up to no good. The boatman is quietly poling his small craft along the bank
> of the slow moving stream on the edge of the cypress. Gator hunter, what he
> is doing is illegal. He carefully shines a light about, seeking the red glare
> of eyes looking back at him. Only the sounds of the bull frogs relieve the
> silence. The boat disappears into the blackness of the night swamp.
The swap is basically in Georgia. I would like to challenge any fan to
meet up with me at the Okeefenokee Swap 'trip' some day. I have not
been there yet even though I live in Atlanta. But distance is relative,
it's like going from Berlin to Munich? Let's make sure be bring along
our portable CD player :-)
Vic
From:
Vic Rek From: 'Andrew J. Rozsa'
> The well-known German penchant for precision fails.... would somebody,
> please, tell TD that the new millennium won't start until the 2001, making
> the last Christmas for THIS millennium the one in the year 2000, not 1999?
Hi Andrew, I had the same laugh, it's more Y2K than the Millennium.
Vic
From:
Grant M Somerville From: 'Carl & Jacqui Kearney'
>
> OK guys I have had this album now for a few months and just can't get my
> head around it at all. Almost another Aqua I think.
> Any way the real reason for the post is to ask if anyone has come across
> Tangram on CD? I cant seem to find it listed anywhere.I already have three
> copys on vinyl one of which is almost smooth and the other two have never
> been played ( sad I know ) I could do with the CD version if out there for
> the new all singing all dancing system I have set up in my Dream machine
> van ) The improved version soon to be breaking windows in your
> neighbourhood.
> P:S Does anyone know if Ian Body and the like are playing in the UK anywhere
> soon ( a question for my Scotish counterparts I think )
> Cheers all Carl ' Orch '
>
>
> There is a SBM Tangram CD available. Saw it in Tower for £9.99
>
>
>
-- Kind Regards, Grant.
Grant M Somerville
Glasgow, Scotland.
Looking for Live Music Recordings...try
SOUNDCHECK
From:
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Date: Sun Nov 14, 1999 2:21
am
Subject: Re: Re: TDI booster
<< It's the absolute last chance to get
a
>real rarity >>
That's what they said about a few other recordings as well, like
Green Desert, and the Easter Island tune and some others that I can't
remember. Now everyone has them. Is this any different?
With the proliferation of CD Burners and the Black and Grey Markets,
some enterprising people are going to have a field day making some
'additional' ill gotten money.
Hmmm. Lessee, 180 divided by six is 30. Any five poeple want to join
a co-op? I know where to get HQ CDRs for a nickle each. My Marantz Pro CD
Burner has no copy protection.
The FBI is too busy with Waco.
Phil N.
From:
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Date: Sun Nov 14, 1999 2:22
am
Subject: Re: Architecture in Motion - Thumbs Up!
In a message dated 12-11-1999 3:08:49 PM EST, jwhite@s... writes:
<< I still think MP is a fine album. But it's been
pushed off my pedestal of being this incredible 'TD is BACK!!!'-type
album. In a way, I think Oasis better fits that title, except TD doesn't
seem to be continuing that line of composition these days. :( >>
RIGHT! 'Oasis' is a throwback. There is subtlety here. There is
development here. There is dynamic punch here when the need is present. It
soars.
I don't know about what you think, but when I hear a tune start, and
shortly thereafter become assaulted by those mind numbing computer drum
segments, that no human in creation could accomplish or even want to perform,
a little voice in the back of my head screams silently, 'OH, NO! NO! NO! NO!
NOoOooOoO! You've ruined it.'
No subtlety! BANG! There they are. No build. Suddenly -- 90MPH (and
then) BANG! gone. And eight more bars....and BANG! -- 90MPH again. My
head hurts.
I've heard half-deaf DJs finishing a six hour shift with more finesse
on the drum machines.
It really pisses me off to see it all thrown away so cavalierly like
this. The lack of pride surprises me sometimes. Its almost like they say,
'I'm bored with this shit. This is good enough. Let's pack it in.'
Well, let me tell you, I expect more out of a World Class operation
like Tangerine Dream.
Phil Naunton
From:
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Date: Sun Nov 14, 1999 2:22
am
Subject: Re: Architecture in Motion - Thumbs Up!
In a message dated 12-11-1999 1:33:13 PM EST, sean@t... writes:
<< I just got my copy of Architecture in Motion in the mail today, and must
say that I'm pleasantly surprised by what I'm hearing. While it's hardly
a TD 'classic', I prefer it to Mars Polaris, and I'm sure that opinion is
in the minority here on the list. >>
While I think I know where you are coming from, I think you are
mistaken or perhaps under an illusion.
I felt the same way when I heard it the first few times. Suddenly,
almost overnight, I got this bad taste in my mouth about this music. Now I
can't listen to anymore without getting pissed off. It is boring, boring,
boring. I think that there is not a scrap of nuance in this music; almost as
if it was an album of jumbled samplings of any-no-thing that TD has done in
the last several years, plastered over this unimaginative drum & percussion
wallpaper. This is Mecha-Godzilla Tangerine Dream. It has all the semblance
of a monster, but the creature has no soul, so who gives a $# !t?
Mars Polaris at least has a redeeming facet or two; a couple of gems
hidden in the dross.
Phil N.
From:
'Andrew J. Rozsa' From: Gustavo Jobim
>
>Yeah, I hate this millennium number problem.
>
>The problem is that the transformation of 1999 to 2000 has a much bigger
>visual impact than from 2000 to 2001.
Of course... and we would all prefer it that it weren't the way it is.... I
was just being mischievous... clearly, music is MUCH more important than
mere calendarial precision.
Andrew
P.S. What a wonderful name.... Jobim... sure rekindles some nice memories
for me...:-)
From:
'Andrew J. Rozsa' I felt the same way when I heard it the first few times. Suddenly,
>almost overnight, I got this bad taste in my mouth about this music. Now I
>can't listen to anymore without getting pissed off. It is boring, boring,
>boring. I think that there is not a scrap of nuance in this music; almost as
>if it was an album of jumbled samplings of any-no-thing that TD has done
[.........]
I finally yanked 'WaB - AiM' of the shelf where it has been sitting with
the other of the unopened (last 15) TD albums. Who would have thought that
I will ever get a new TD and rip off the cellophane off the cover on my way
from the mailbox?
Anyway.... this album, in my book, is OK. I will probably never listen to
it again. Nothing spectacularly bad or good about it. That is, it has not
annoyed me or excited me. It was just there. Wallpaper.
I guess it is the price I pay for having listened to virtually everything
TD has produced... been listening for 23 years...
It would be so wonderful never to have heard any of it and just discovering
the music from scratch.
Oh, well... the thrill is gone... although the late 70s and early 80s music
still makes my heart beat faster.
I think I will leave the rest of the TDI releases unopened... they do look
graphically appealing.
:-((
Andrew
From:
Klaus Beschorner This is true. Just the same, I have more details, still, that I
>didn't post to the list, for fear of taking up too much bandwidth and
>trying people's patience more than I already did.
--
Klaus.Beschorner........................work....+49-7033-45683
Drosselweg.6............................fax.....+49-7033-45631
D-71120.Grafenau........................Mobile.+49-171-7338969
Germany.................................home....+49-7033-45142
............................................http://www.caby.de
From:
'tom george' length does not become an issue in transferring to a cassette which is often
>too short. This is a real issue with KS recordings. .
>
i read somewhere sometime ago that you should allow 24 hours between playings
on lps. something about the expansion of the groove and the time needed for
resettlement. so tell your wife that you are not crazy. sorry about the long
time for my response but i have been out of pocket for a week. good to hear
from the few vinylphobes out there in dream land. tom
> My wife thinks I'm crazy. I never play an LP twice in a single day.
>It is a house rule. Replaying seems to cause
>
Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com
Replies
Name/Email
Yahoo! ID
Date
Size
19091
Re: scratches in CDs. (was:CD vs LP)
PNaunton@a...
Sun
11/14/1999
2 KB
19092
Re: scratches in CDs. (was:CD vs LP)
tom george
Sun
11/14/1999
2 KB
From:
'tom george' From: Owens James
>
>Hi Tom and all,
>
>The scratch on the particular CD that I was referring to (Edgar Froese's
>_Pinnacles_ to be precise) came due to a malfunction in my CD player. I had
>a 6-disc magazine changer and the tray cross-threaded into the tray below,
>scratching the CD most heinously. No lack of proper care here, just a freak
>mishap.
dry). It is a PERMANENT
>fix, unless you scratch the disc again. I still play _Pinnacles_, and I
>fixed it over 6 years ago.
Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com
From:
'tom george'
Date: Sun Nov 14, 1999 4:52
pm
Subject: Re: D:Studio [Stratosfear]
hi vic,
put me down as one to meet up at the swamp. i am in knoville, tn. as
i've told you before so the trip is within reason for me. let me know when.
tom
>The swap is basically in Georgia. I would like to challenge any fan to
>meet up with me at the Okeefenokee Swap 'trip' some day. I have not
>been there yet even though I live in Atlanta. But distance is relative,
>it's like going from Berlin to Munich? Let's make sure be bring along
>our portable CD player :-)
>
>Vic
>
Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com
From:
PNaunton@a...
Date: Sun Nov 14, 1999 5:41
pm
Subject: Re: scratches in CDs. (was:CD vs LP)
In a message dated 14-11-1999 10:06:45 AM EST, eloy-usa@a... writes:
<< i read somewhere sometime ago that you should allow 24 hours between
playings on lps. something about the expansion of the groove and the time
needed for resettlement. so tell your wife that you are not crazy. sorry
about the long time for my response but i have been out of pocket for a week.
good to hear from the few vinylphobes out there in dream land. tom >>
Vinyl is a quasi-liquid and therefore has a very flexible memory
coefficient. You can reform it quite easily at the same temperature which we
as human bodies would find only mildly uncomfortable. Vinyl also has a
tendency, particularly is some deficient formulations and recyclings, to
revert into its individual chemical components. This deterioration can play
havoc with even a mildly sensitive ear. I have a couple of vinyl copies of
'Force Majeure' which are virtually unlistenable, due to vinyl breakdown. One
of these is the 'Force Majeure' Clear Cut transparent vinyl LP. For some
reason this vinyl copy is a disaster. Oh, well.
Phil N.
From:
'tom george'
Date: Sun Nov 14, 1999 6:44
pm
Subject: Re: scratches in CDs. (was:CD vs LP)
hi phil,
i have never experienced a vinyl breakdown and hope i never do. did you
have them in the attic or garage or something? in all my reading of vinyl over
the last 30 or more years i have never heard of it. i too have both of the
'Force Majeure' vinyl copies you speak of. the clear one has always been noisey
due to a bad pressing or just the structure of the vinyl being clear (although
i have other clear vinyls that sound crisp and clean) but the black vinyl copy
sounds noise free and new. in audiophile circles you hear of albums from the
50s and maybe even a little older still sounding wonderful. i hope your case is
an isolated one. tom
of vinyl copies of
>'Force Majeure' which are virtually unlistenable, due to vinyl breakdown. One
>of these is the 'Force Majeure' Clear Cut transparent vinyl LP. For some
>reason this vinyl copy is a disaster. Oh, well.
>
>Phil N.
Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com
From:
Steven Feldman
Date: Thu Jan 1, 1970 4:59
am
Subject: Evading the KEEP issue, then Shutting the TD Guestbook down!
Man,
What a bunch of lame-os! Instead of giving simple answers to how
many KEEP CDs were pressed in 1997 & 1999 and whether or not the content
of the two is identical, the geniuses at the TD homepage shut down the
guestbook instead! At least *someone* mentioned that the run for the
1999 CD is 300 before everyone was silenced. See below for specifics:
+ + + + + + +
From Bruno Desjardins at Sat, 13/Nov/99 18:31:
Steven Feldman's guess was a good one: CD distributor Groove in the
Netherlands confirmed in its last newsletter (today's in fact) that the
total number of CDs being released as 'The Keep 99' is 300. There, you
got it... No word on the tracklisting though... Not that I care, TDI's
version is full of overbuds 'ë la' 'Sohoman' and equipment not used in
1982-83 is everywhere in this CD that has nothing to do with the
original soundtrack of the movie... Despite what the cover of 'The Keep
97' indicates, the best musical moments of the movie are just not on
the CD... Pity...
-----
From TDI Music Office at Sun, 14/Nov/99 18:34:
-
o This guestbook is now temporarily closed!!!
It seems that some of you wanted it this way!!
Best regards - TDI Office
+ + + + + + +
I guess their attitude is that if we can't play nice with our
toys, then they'll take them away.
-- Steven Feldman
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Re: Evading the KEEP issue, then Shutting the TD
Jared White
Sun
11/14/1999
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Re: Evading the KEEP issue, then Shutting the TD
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Sun
11/14/1999
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Mon
11/15/1999
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Re: Evading the KEEP issue, then Shutting the TD
Jared White
Mon
11/15/1999
2 KB
From:
Steven Feldman
Date: Thu Jan 1, 1970 4:59
am
Subject: What the Groove newsletter said about THE 1999 KEEP CD
The following is excerpted from http://www.groove.nl/e-news/169.txt
| Special news from TD.
| They now offer from their website a 'Special Millennium X- Mas
| Collector's Pack' containing: a 'Great Wall of China' T- Shirt,
| 'Great Wall of China' CD (scheduled for 2000) and...
| 'The Keep' 99 re-release - official version
| The complete package cost US$ 180.00 (incl. shipping & handling).
| This is no typo! It really cost US$ 180.00
| We've asked if we can buy these packages but we were told that
| that's not possible. In other words, we also have to pay US$ 180.
| If seems that there are only 300 copies of 'the Keep' so if you want
| a copy then you have to buy it directly from them or ...
| if you persist that we supply you then write us an Email and we'll
| order it for you. Our price will be US$ 195 plus shipping.
+ + + + + + +
It seems that this is an internet newsletter, and that Groove also
has its own e-music mailing list! To find out about it on the web:
http://www.groove.nl/mailing.html
or to subscribe, send an e-mail to
Groove_Unlimited-subscribe@o...
-- Steven Feldman
From:
'Jared White'
Date: Sun Nov 14, 1999 8:39
pm
Subject: RE: Evading the KEEP issue, then Shutting the TD Guestbook down!
> >From TDI Music Office at Sun, 14/Nov/99 18:34:
> -
> o This guestbook is now temporarily closed!!!
> It seems that some of you wanted it this way!!
> Best regards - TDI Office
>
> + + + + + + +
>
> I guess their attitude is that if we can't play nice with our
> toys, then they'll take them away.
>
> -- Steven Feldman
While I think that this is poor way to handle the situation on their
part, you have to remember that it's THEIR guestbook, not YOURS. They
can do anything they want to with it. That's just the way it is.
However, that doesn't mean this doesn't suck *big time*. They really
seem to be blowing it on this one. I was willing to get them a bit of
slack, but this is starting to get just a bit outrageous. I suggest we
all send Mr. 'TDI Office' (webmaster@t...) a *polite* note
explaining our frustrations and why we think he's not taking very good
care of his potential customers. Maybe a deluge of e-mails saying 'we're
willing to pay a reasonable amount of money for this package, but not
THIS much, and the least we deserve are some answers why it IS this
much' will finally pay off?
Regards,
Jared
From:
'Jared White'
Date: Sun Nov 14, 1999 8:45
pm
Subject: RE: Architecture in Motion - Thumbs Up!
> From: PNaunton@a...
>
> In a message dated 12-11-1999 1:33:13 PM EST, sean@t... writes:
>
> << I just got my copy of Architecture in Motion in the mail
> today, and must
> say that I'm pleasantly surprised by what I'm hearing.
> While it's hardly
> a TD 'classic', I prefer it to Mars Polaris, and I'm sure
> that opinion is
> in the minority here on the list. >>
>
> While I think I know where you are coming from, I
> think you are
> mistaken or perhaps under an illusion.
> I felt the same way when I heard it the first few
> times. Suddenly,
> almost overnight, I got this bad taste in my mouth about this
> music. Now I
> can't listen to anymore without getting pissed off. It is
> boring, boring,
> boring. I think that there is not a scrap of nuance in this
> music; almost as
> if it was an album of jumbled samplings of any-no-thing that
> TD has done in
> the last several years, plastered over this unimaginative
> drum & percussion
> wallpaper. This is Mecha-Godzilla Tangerine Dream. It has all
> the semblance
> of a monster, but the creature has no soul, so who gives a $# !t?
> Mars Polaris at least has a redeeming facet or two;
> a couple of gems
> hidden in the dross.
You know, all I can say is this: you can choose to live negatively, or
you can choose to live positively. It's your choice.
Personally, I prefer the former.
Regards,
Jared
P. S. When was the last time you actually posted a nice, friendly,
positive, and informative message? Hmm? (sorry, Joe! I can't help it!)
From:
'Jared White'
Date: Sun Nov 14, 1999 8:49
pm
Subject: RE: Architecture in Motion - Thumbs Up!
> I've heard half-deaf DJs finishing a six hour shift
> with more finesse
> on the drum machines.
Are those DJs better than than the deluge of crap I hear at most record
stores and practically everything I hear at MP3.com and elsewhere on the
Internet?
I thought so. Give me Mars Polaris and AiM any day.
Regards,
Jared
From:
Joel Mullen
Date: Sun Nov 14, 1999 9:03
pm
Subject: RE: Evading the KEEP issue, then Shutting the TD Guestbook down!
On Sunday, November 14, 1999 2:39 PM, Jared White [SMTP:jwhite@s...] wrote:
> From: 'Jared White'
>
> > >From TDI Music Office at Sun, 14/Nov/99 18:34:
> > -
> > o This guestbook is now temporarily closed!!!
> > It seems that some of you wanted it this way!!
> > Best regards - TDI Office
> >
> > + + + + + + +
> >
> > I guess their attitude is that if we can't play nice with our
> > toys, then they'll take them away.
> >
> > -- Steven Feldman
I am sure that this has something to do with the Holiday Boost-you package, but
there was some problems with a guy claiming that Edgar was like Hitler,
resulting
in them deleting 3 pages of posts. I think it was just TOOOOOOO negative for
too long and that was the final straw. How the heck are they supposed to
attract
new fans with all that complaining going on. Not that I too don't have
'issues' with
the current 'keep' release.
Joel
BTW as Al if you want to know more about the Hitler thing, I just heard it
second hand
From:
Steven Feldman
Date: Thu Jan 1, 1970 4:59
am
Subject: My Assumption as to Why the 1999 KEEP CD is So Expensive
>Date: 14 Nov 1999 12:39:25 -0800
>Subject: RE: [tadream] Evading the KEEP issue, then Shutting the TD
Guestbook down!
>From: Tangerine Dream mailing list
>Really-From: 'Jared White'
>
>[. . .] I suggest we all send Mr. 'TDI Office'
>(webmaster@t...) a *polite* note explaining our
>frustrations and why we think he's not taking very good care of his
>potential customers. Maybe a deluge of e-mails saying 'we're willing to
>pay a reasonable amount of money for this package, but not THIS much,
>and the least we deserve are some answers why it IS this much' will
>finally pay off?
If what the Groove newsletter at http://www.groove.nl/enews.html
says is correct (specifically, see http://www.groove.nl/e-news/169.txt),
then I can understand why the price tag of $180 apiece. I mean, 300
*is* a very low print run for a relatively high demand item. The 1997
edition cost $45 (well, at least, that's what it cost *me*), and there
were 500-1500 (?) of those made, so asking $180 for an edition of 300
really isn't all that outrageous, in context. And no, I have not all
of a sudden turned into an Edgar apologist -- I'm just trying to deal
with the facts honestly and with some uncharacteristic objectivity (as
regards all things THE KEEP, at any rate), for once. ;)
I won't be buying a copy of the 1999 KEEP CD *unless* the content
is different; I am a huge TD fan and somewhat of a completist, but not
*that* big a completist! Geesh!
As for THE KEEP, I just won an eBAY auction for a Japanese movie
program of THE KEEP that supposedly has 24 color pages packed with
photos. Oh boy, more pix of our posterboy, Molasar!!! :) ;)
-- Steven Feldman
+ + + + + + +
'[. . .] TD will never hurt for money as long as Vic Rek is alive. :-)'
-- Scott Plumer, Tadream mailing list, September 30, 1998
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Date
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Re: My Assumption as to Why the 1999 KEEP CD is S
Jared White
Sun
11/14/1999
2 KB
From:
'Jared White'
Date: Sun Nov 14, 1999 9:23
pm
Subject: RE: My Assumption as to Why the 1999 KEEP CD is So Expensive
> From: Steven Feldman
>
> If what the Groove newsletter at http://www.groove.nl/enews.html
> says is correct (specifically, see
> http://www.groove.nl/e-news/169.txt),
> then I can understand why the price tag of $180 apiece. I mean, 300
> *is* a very low print run for a relatively high demand item. The 1997
> edition cost $45 (well, at least, that's what it cost *me*), and there
> were 500-1500 (?) of those made, so asking $180 for an edition of 300
> really isn't all that outrageous, in context. And no, I have not all
> of a sudden turned into an Edgar apologist -- I'm just trying to deal
> with the facts honestly and with some uncharacteristic objectivity (as
> regards all things THE KEEP, at any rate), for once. ;)
And don't forget -- it's not $180 just for The Keep CD. There's a
T-Shirt and another CD (Great Wall of China) in the package as well. If
the T-Shirt and CD add up to, say, $40, than The Keep is only $140.
Better yet! ;)
Still it's too steep for most people, and that's the problem. Oh
well....
Regards,
Jared
__________________________________________
Jared White E-mail: jwhite@g...
GaelDesign: http://www.gaeldesign.com
iReview: http://www.gaeldesign.com/ireview
The Digital Fine Art Gallery:
http://www.gaeldesign.com/gallery
Distant Oaks: http://www.distantoaks.com
Personal Site: http://www.sonic.net/~jwhite
Try BeOS Today! http://www.be.com
From:
Steven Feldman
Date: Thu Jan 1, 1970 4:59
am
Subject: 'Claiming that Edgar was like Hitler'?!?!
>Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 15:03:22 -0600
>Subject: RE: [tadream] Evading the KEEP issue, then Shutting the TD
Guestbook down!
>From: Tangerine Dream mailing list
>Really-From: Joel Mullen
>
>[. . .] there was some problems with a guy claiming that Edgar was like
>Hitler, resulting in them deleting 3 pages of posts.
Whoah! What could have possibly precipitated *that*? ;) Hee hee.
>[. . .] I think it was just TOOOOOOO negative for too long and that was
>the final straw. How the heck are they supposed to attract new fans
>with all that complaining going on. [. . .]
Oh, I don't know, I'll be there are some white supremacists online
who previously didn't care a whit about TD, who might be considering
checking them out, now, so the Hitler comments could amount to, say, 1
or 2 more fans. But then again, THE KEEP was anti-Hitler, so maybe not.
Yeeeeeeeeeeeeehahahahahahhahahaha (to paraphrase Dano). ;)
>BTW as Al if you want to know more about the Hitler thing, I just heard
>it second hand
Sounds like a potential font of high hilarity. If anyone out there
has a copy of the offending posts, please forward them to me in personal
e-mail. I'd *love* to see *this*! I promise not to forward any of it
here, if you don't want me to.
Steve Feldman (Me) -- 33 Brook Street; Brookline, MA 02445; 617-232-3876;
. Robert Carty -- 5478 S. 235 E. #E; Murray, UT 84107;
801-281-2157; http://www.california.com/~eameece/carty.htm. Peter Gulch/
Nightcrawlers -- 1493 Greenwood Ave.; Camden, NJ 08103; ; http://www.voicenet.com/~pgulch/special.html. SOME CURRENT E-MUSIC
FAVES: Tangerine Dream, Nightcrawlers, Robert Carty, Node, Ozrics, Serrie
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------+
| TD DISCOGRAPHY http://members.spree.com/molasar/tadream/tadream2.html |
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------+
From:
Owens James
Date: Sun Nov 14, 1999 11:09
pm
Subject: Okefenokee trip?
Vic,
Sign me up too. Huntsville, AL isn't too far to drive...
> -----Original Message-----
> From: tom george [SMTP:eloy-usa@a...]
> Sent: Sunday, November 14, 1999 10:52 AM
> To: tadream@o...
> Subject: Re: [tadream] D:Studio [Stratosfear]
>
> From: 'tom george'
>
> hi vic,
> put me down as one to meet up at the swamp. i am in knoville, tn.
> as i've told you before so the trip is within reason for me. let me know
> when. tom
>
> >The swap is basically in Georgia. I would like to challenge any fan to
> >meet up with me at the Okeefenokee Swap 'trip' some day. I have not
> >been there yet even though I live in Atlanta. But distance is relative,
> >it's like going from Berlin to Munich? Let's make sure be bring along
> >our portable CD player :-)
> >
> >Vic
>
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From:
RBrown4856@a...
Date: Sun Nov 14, 1999 11:19
pm
Subject: The Keep Tracklisting!
Greetings All!
I have been in sleep mode for a while because my other computer died on me.
I am just catching up on my mail.For those who are interested I E-Mailed
Martin at TDI and he responded nicely and very quickly about the tracklisting
and he stated it is identical to the 97 release.
Rick Brown
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Joel Mullen
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From:
EMC Holland
Date: Mon Nov 15, 1999 1:18
am
Subject: RE: Evading the KEEP issue, then Shutting the TD Guestbook down!
At 15:03 14-11-99 -0600, you wrote:
>From: Joel Mullen
>> > >From TDI Music Office at Sun, 14/Nov/99 18:34:
>> > o This guestbook is now temporarily closed!!!
>> > It seems that some of you wanted it this way!!
>> > Best regards - TDI Office
>> >
>I am sure that this has something to do with the Holiday Boost-you package, but
>there was some problems with a guy claiming that Edgar was like Hitler,
resulting
>in them deleting 3 pages of posts. I think it was just TOOOOOOO negative for
>too long and that was the final straw. How the heck are they supposed to
attract
>new fans with all that complaining going on. Not that I too don't have
'issues' with
>the current 'keep' release.
>
>Joel
>
>BTW as Al if you want to know more about the Hitler thing, I just heard it
second hand
Hi all,
If the statement about Hitler is really true then I don't blame them
for shutting down the guestbook. This is WAY BELOW THE BELT.
How dare someone compare a thing like this with Hitler.
I've followed the discussion about the price and I think that everybody
has the right to his or hers opinion but this is really awful.
How low can one go?
All the best.
Kees
------------------------------------------------------
For Electronic Music: Groove Unlimited http://www.groove.nl
------------------------------------------------------
---> Exercise your face... Smile :-)
From:
'Jared White'
Date: Mon Nov 15, 1999 1:44
am
Subject: RE: Evading the KEEP issue, then Shutting the TD Guestbook down!
> From: EMC Holland
>
> Hi all,
>
> If the statement about Hitler is really true then I don't blame them
> for shutting down the guestbook. This is WAY BELOW THE BELT.
> How dare someone compare a thing like this with Hitler.
>
> I've followed the discussion about the price and I think that
> everybody
> has the right to his or hers opinion but this is really awful.
> How low can one go?
Oh, a number of people have compared Edgar Froese to Hitler, called him
and the TDI office 'greedy Germans', made references to 'Herr Froese',
and wrote other such demeaning statements. He must really think we
Americans (and others perhaps?) are a bunch of filthy-mouthed jerks!
Still, the TDI guy running the guestbook *could* have been a bit more
helpful. But oh well....
Regards,
Jared
__________________________________________
Jared White E-mail: jwhite@g...
GaelDesign: http://www.gaeldesign.com
iReview: http://www.gaeldesign.com/ireview
The Digital Fine Art Gallery:
http://www.gaeldesign.com/gallery
Distant Oaks: http://www.distantoaks.com
Personal Site: http://www.sonic.net/~jwhite
Try BeOS Today! http://www.be.com
From:
Vic Rek
Date: Mon Nov 15, 1999 2:16
am
Subject: Re: Okefenokee trip?
OK,
We have Tom and James signed up so far. I think if we can get a group
of 7-8 or so we can make a good time of it!
So, how about Jim, Robert, Roger, Dell, Rick? Maybe we could do this in
the Spring of 2000. Any takers from Europe or beyond?
How about you Jerome Froese, are you game too? ;-)
Vic
Owens James wrote:
>
> From: Owens James
>
> Vic,
>
> Sign me up too. Huntsville, AL isn't too far to drive...
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: tom george [SMTP:eloy-usa@a...]
> > Sent: Sunday, November 14, 1999 10:52 AM
> > To: tadream@o...
> > Subject: Re: [tadream] D:Studio [Stratosfear]
> >
> > From: 'tom george'
> >
> > hi vic,
> > put me down as one to meet up at the swamp. i am in knoville, tn.
> > as i've told you before so the trip is within reason for me. let me know
> > when. tom
> >
> > >The swap is basically in Georgia. I would like to challenge any fan to
> > >meet up with me at the Okeefenokee Swap 'trip' some day. I have not
> > >been there yet even though I live in Atlanta. But distance is relative,
> > >it's like going from Berlin to Munich? Let's make sure be bring along
> > >our portable CD player :-)
> > >
> > >Vic
> >
>
> > Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing original
messages in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed from this list), send a
blank e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
> Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
From:
'Steven Le Vine'
Date: Mon Nov 15, 1999 3:01
am
Subject: This 'Keep Thing' Sucks
Hey Gang!
This 'Hitler thing' ain't to cool either (if it is true).
Anyway, I can understand an eager perhaps disheveled mind with a
chance to finally get a real HTG KEEP & being slapped in the face
with an OUTRAGEOUS (I said it :) price, getting upset & going
overboard.
I mean, people have illusions about the groups that experience there
lives. Explain this to me again, I mean, has or does another group
take such advantage of its fanbase as this?
You do not see Limited Peekachoo $500.00 (Sold by Nintendo that is :)
Or N-Sync T-Shirt $100.00.
Am I just being naive? It sounds like a bunch of people in a dark
smokey room planning to take over the world. LOL
Do you think a stand will get us anywhere?
np: What A Blast: Stoneyard, which is an EXCELLENT SONG & not on AIM
(I am so pissed!)
Other than that life is OK,
siberkat
> From: 'Jared White'
>
>> From: EMC Holland
>>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> If the statement about Hitler is really true then I don't blame them
>> for shutting down the guestbook. This is WAY BELOW THE BELT.
>> How dare someone compare a thing like this with Hitler.
>>
>> I've followed the discussion about the price and I think that
>> everybody
>> has the right to his or hers opinion but this is really awful.
>> How low can one go?
>
> Oh, a number of people have compared Edgar Froese to Hitler, called him
> and the TDI office 'greedy Germans', made references to 'Herr Froese',
> and wrote other such demeaning statements. He must really think we
> Americans (and others perhaps?) are a bunch of filthy-mouthed jerks!
>
> Still, the TDI guy running the guestbook *could* have been a bit more
> helpful. But oh well....
>
> Regards,
>
> Jared
\
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DJS
Mon
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EMC Holland
Mon
11/15/1999
1 KB
From:
DJS
Date: Mon Nov 15, 1999 3:32
am
Subject: Re: This 'Keep Thing' Sucks
Steven Le Vine wrote:
> I mean, people have illusions about the groups that experience there
> lives. Explain this to me again, I mean, has or does another group
> take such advantage of its fanbase as this?
Eh, what's the big deal? Just fire up the ol' cd burner, pop open a
bottle of Riptide Rush Gatorade, laugh much like the Emperor did in
Return of the Jedi & listen to the infamous Keep OST knowing full well
you paid about $2.99 for parts. ;-) Maybe Eddie wants to be one of those
bands who only wants rich people to listen to them.
LUKE: 'You won't convert me like you did my father. I won't buy any 2
disc Keep set for $180.'
EMPEROR 'Oh, I'm afraid you are mistaken about a great many things.'
LUKE: 'Your overconfidence is your weakness.'
EMPEROR: 'Your faith in Edgar is yours.'
EDGAR: 'It is pointless to resist my fans'.
--
Dan J. Schulte
Rakinik Intertype-http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Dungeon/2140/
Progressive Electronic Music
http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/12/dan_j_schulte.html
From:
PNaunton@a...
Date: Mon Nov 15, 1999 4:52
am
Subject: Re: Architecture in Motion - Thumbs Up!
In a message dated 14-11-1999 3:46:04 PM EST, jwhite@s... writes:
<< P. S. When was the last time you actually posted a nice, friendly,
positive, and informative message? Hmm? (sorry, Joe! I can't help it!) >>
If you are THAT interested, which I doubt, check your old mail.
Phil N.
From:
Gabe Yedid
Date: Mon Nov 15, 1999 4:56
am
Subject: Re: Architecture in Motion - Thumbs Up!
On Fri, 12 Nov 1999, Sean Montgomery wrote:
> From: Sean Montgomery
>
>
>
> I just got my copy of Architecture in Motion in the mail today, and must
> say that I'm pleasantly surprised by what I'm hearing.
The real question for you, Sean, is whether you'll still say that after
you've heard the album 10 times or so. I had the same opinion about Chris
Franke's _Klemania_ once, an album which I eventually consigned to the
second-hand bin after deciding that it was more flash than substance.
While it's hardly
> a TD 'classic', I prefer it to Mars Polaris, and I'm sure that opinion is
> in the minority here on the list.
Actually I think it might be a little more common than you think ;)
The main reason I feel that way though
> is that the tracks on this album hold together better as individual
> compositions. They generate decent grooves and moods...and *sustain* them
> long enough to engage me, whereas Mars Polaris let go of good sounds and
> atmospheres before they had time to develop fully. I like *parts* of
> Outland and Astrophobia a lot, but I like *all* of Silver Screen quite a
> bit. Perhaps it's the fact that they were scoring long sequences that
> compelled them to keep the track consistent for the duration of the scene.
>
> There's also a 'darker' element to AiM than most 90s TD...but I find
> it hard to explain what I mean by that. I'm not schooled in musical
> composition, so I can't say whether it's the key they're playing in or
> whatever, but it's there...particularly in tracks like Silver Screen and
> Forced to Surrender (the latter of which is like a Dream Mix version
> of the Near Dark soundtrack).
IMO, this album is what _Rockoon_ should have been. 'Silver Siren'
(that's the WaB version of the song title) and 'Beauty of the Blast' do a
far better job of conveying an urban environment--although a rather
menacing and despairing one--than anything from _Rockoon_. The picture
that comes most readily to my mind--particularly with 'Beauty...'--is of
walking through the streets of downtown Montreal or Toronto, seeing things
through the eyes of some of the less fortunate denizens of the city.
I do have to say, though, that I think your take on 'Forced to Surrender'
is unique. ;)
What about it reminds you of 'Near Dark'? 'San Rocco' from _Dream Mixes_
casts a rather long shadow over this whole track, as does the rhythm that
underlies 'Roaring of the Bliss' and 'Missing Link' (from _Zoning_), but I
certainly don't hear anything that reminds me of _Near Dark_ in this
piece.
> The percussion is generally pretty good,
> as is the sound design...
Yeah, I thought so too--the production on _Mars Polaris_ seems rather
shoddy compared to the clarity of this album. The percussion loops on
this album also seem smoother than those on _Mars Polaris_, too, in
that there doesn't seem to be this annoying, short pause whenever the loop
cycles, the rhythm patterns are all very flowing and continuous. So what
if it sounds like General MIDI? It's little things like that which can
make or break an album, and I'd say that _WaB_ succeeds far better at
conveying the intended atmosphere than _Mars Polaris_.
[Having said that, I do think that 'Astrophobia' is one of TD **BEST
TRACKS EVER**--easily as good as anything from the '70s or '80s, in its
own way. It's the only track from _MP_ I can say this about, though.]
>and I even like the two remixes at the
> end...they're better than the originals, and I'm glad they weren't cut
> from the Miramar release.
Agree about the 'TimeSquare' remix, which I find very enjoyable--chunkier
and more fleshed-out without being obnoxious. The 'Jungle Journey' mix is
just the 'Reptile Mix' with some new sounds pasted over--nothing
obtrusive, but nothing too impressive either.
Hmmm....you're missing what was the first track on _What A Blast_,
'Stoneyard'. I don't know if you'd like that, though--it's rather like a
re-scored Lily-era track; I can easily picture it having been intended for
'L'Affaire Wallraff'. I think it's a pretty strong track, even if it does
sound a little anachronistic (yes I am one of those people who DOES hear a
difference between 1989 TD and 1999 TD).
> Architecture in Motion isn't a stellar album, but I do like
it, and
> I felt it important to say that, given how much complaining I do about TD
> here on the list!
>
You can't praise all the time if you really don't feel any is deserved.
> SEAN MONTGOMERY Animator
Gabe
From:
'Andrew J. Rozsa'
Date: Wed Nov 15, 2000 5:28
am
Subject: Re: Okefenokee trip?
At 21:16 11/14/99 -0500, Vic wrote:
>From: Vic Rek
>
>OK,
>
>We have Tom and James signed up so far. I think if we can get a group
>of 7-8 or so we can make a good time of it!
>
>So, how about Jim, Robert, Roger, Dell, Rick? Maybe we could do this in
>the Spring of 2000. Any takers from Europe or beyond?
>
Count me in... just name the place and time.... :-).. March or April should
be ok...before the weather gets too hot.
Andrew
From:
Joel Mullen From: RBrown4856@a...
>
> Greetings All!
>
> I have been in sleep mode for a while because my other computer died on me.
> I am just catching up on my mail.For those who are interested I E-Mailed
> Martin at TDI and he responded nicely and very quickly about the tracklisting
> and he stated it is identical to the 97 release.
>
> Rick Brown
Any bets that it actually IS the same disc, but now in a jewel box instead of
the
cardboard 'gumby' holder?? Or maybe the special art on the website is an
'interpretation' of the real 1997 release and it is the totally identical
package.
People did *testify* that they saw lots of extras during the tour. They perhaps
did not sell out as most people expected to get it cheaper later on (fools!)
Now
I doubt that they destroyed the extra discs so my guess is that it really is
different art, but the same identical discs.
Now that would be a first wouldn't it?? (NOT!!!) ;-)
Joel
From:
Joel Mullen From: Vic Rek
>
> OK,
>
> We have Tom and James signed up so far. I think if we can get a group
> of 7-8 or so we can make a good time of it!
>
> So, how about Jim, Robert, Roger, Dell, Rick? Maybe we could do this in
> the Spring of 2000. Any takers from Europe or beyond?
>
> How about you Jerome Froese, are you game too? ;-)
>
> Vic
>
> Owens James wrote:
> >
> > From: Owens James
> >
> > Vic,
> >
Depending on the date I might be able to swing it, but I probably would not
be able to give a definate yes until a month or so ahead of time.
Regards,
Joel
From:
craig.cordrey@g...
Date: Mon Nov 15, 1999 8:41
am
Subject: Re: Transsiberia. Tangram Ian Body UK E Music
>From: 'Carl & Jacqui Kearney'
>
>P:S Does anyone know if Ian Body and the like are playing in the UK anywhere
>soon ( a question for my Scotish counterparts I think )
>Cheers all Carl ' Orch '
Don't know if anyone answered this, but you may find the following, taken from
the Beyond_EM list, of use.
--
From: John Christian
Here's hot poop on the upcoming series of JB concerts, fresh from the
dobbins gob:
11 Mar 2000 RMI & Under The Dome
22 Apr 2000 Paul Nagle & Arcane
13 May 2000 Airsculpture & Kubusschnitt/wEirD
?? Jun 2000 Asana
The date and 2nd act for the June concert will be confirmed later.
If you go to the first three concerts, admission to the last one will be
FREE.
I just nagged Dave Law into booking the dates, so the exact dates will
be news to some of the artists :) but should be firm.
Any queries to Dave (david@n...).
For Flittermouse, and anyone else who doesn't know:
Jodrell Bank is south of Manchester, England, and is home to a pretty
huge radio telescope. The concerts will take place in the planetarium.
It is a very nice place to watch (and play!) music.
--------------------------------------------------------------
Craig R. J. Cordrey craig.cordrey@g...
Senior Software Engineer 01383 828187
Alenia Marconi Systems
Integrated Systems Division
Donibristle, Fife, Scotland
--------------------------------------------------------------
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Carl & Jacqui Kearney
Tue
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2 KB
From:
'Thomas' From: Vic Rek
>
>OK,
>
>We have Tom and James signed up so far. I think if we can get a group
>of 7-8 or so we can make a good time of it!
>
>So, how about Jim, Robert, Roger, Dell, Rick? Maybe we could do this in
>the Spring of 2000. Any takers from Europe or beyond?
>
>How about you Jerome Froese, are you game too? ;-)
>
>Vic
I'm not Jerome Froese, sorry! But if I can manage to scrape the money for a
flight across the Atlantic together I would most certainly like to join in!
Thomas
Helsingborg, Sweden
From:
EMC Holland From: 'Steven Le Vine'
>This 'Hitler thing' ain't to cool either (if it is true).
>
>Anyway, I can understand an eager perhaps disheveled mind with a
>chance to finally get a real HTG KEEP & being slapped in the face
>with an OUTRAGEOUS (I said it :) price, getting upset & going
>overboard.
NO price can justify the comparing of Edgar to the biggest mass
murderer of all times! You must be complete sick or have no brain
at all to do such a thing!
All the best.
Kees
------------------------------------------------------
For Electronic Music: Groove Unlimited http://www.groove.nl
------------------------------------------------------
---> Exercise your face... Smile :-)
From:
jon.schick@xxxxxxxx.xx
Date: Mon Nov 15, 1999 2:14
pm
Subject: great wall of china
I just realized that the ad for Mars Polaris in Bilboard a few months ago
already had a picture of the Great Wall of China album on it.
Did anyone else notice this?
Jonathan
From:
Sean Montgomery The winner is SEAN MONTGOMERY from Canada (Jeffrey was only a few
> minutes late)! I hope you can let us know how you got the answer?
Well, I thought it was a track from Melrose, but to be sure I went to the
Dogpile search engine and typed in the phrase 'Windham Hill Tangerine
Dream'. It took me to the record label's catalogue, where the compilation
was listed. The process reminded me of the 'Mars Polaris' contest that TD
ran through their webpage a few months back. It still burns my ass that I
incorrectly assesed the number of edges on a hypercube.
SEAN MONTGOMERY Animator
T O P I X / Mad Dog
http://www.topix.com/~sean
From:
Sean Montgomery I finally yanked 'WaB - AiM' of the shelf where it has been sitting with
> the other of the unopened (last 15) TD albums.
You're kidding me? 15 *unopened* albums? I could sort of understand if
they were all ultra-valuable collectables, but really now...didn't you
first start buying TD because you liked *listening* to them? Isn't that
the point of purchasing a CD? Surely you aren't spending 15 bucks a
disc just for the 'graphically appealing' paper spine? If so, I could
whip up a few for you for half that price! :-)
SEAN MONTGOMERY Animator
T O P I X / Mad Dog
http://www.topix.com/~sean
From:
Owens James -----Original Message-----
> From: Sean Montgomery
>
> The process reminded me of the 'Mars Polaris' contest that TD
> ran through their webpage a few months back. It still burns my ass that I
> incorrectly assesed the number of edges on a hypercube.
>
From:
Sean Montgomery NO price can justify the comparing of Edgar to the biggest mass
> murderer of all times!
Not to diminish Hitler's crimes, but I think Stalin was responsible for
far more deaths in Russia during his years in power.
Comparing someone to Hitler is a standard, immature ploy to pull their
chain, but it's particularly objectionable when the target is from
Germany.
SEAN MONTGOMERY Animator
T O P I X / Mad Dog
http://www.topix.com/~sean
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Mon
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Mon
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Tue
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From:
Sean Montgomery The real question for you, Sean, is whether you'll still say that after
> you've heard the album 10 times or so.
Yes, only time will tell! But since I listen to so much music, it's
probably be a while before I can make that assessment.
> I do have to say, though, that I think your take on 'Forced to Surrender'
> is unique. ;) What about it reminds you of 'Near Dark'?
The guitar sounds and general 'rock and roll' tone reminds me of 'Rain in
the Third House' and 'Fight at Dawn'
> [Having said that, I do think that 'Astrophobia' is one of TD **BEST
> TRACKS EVER**--easily as good as anything from the '70s or '80s, in its
> own way. It's the only track from _MP_ I can say this about, though.]
Well, that *is* high praise! I don't quite agree, although a good remix
that made it about 1/3 shorter and added more AiM style punch might make
me a believer.
> Agree about the 'TimeSquare' remix, which I find very enjoyable--chunkier
> and more fleshed-out without being obnoxious.
Yeah, I thought that the original had a nice theme, but went on too
long. The remix adds more sonic seasoning and better pacing.
> The 'Jungle Journey' mix is just the 'Reptile Mix' with some new sounds
> pasted over--nothing obtrusive, but nothing too impressive either.
True, but for me the beauty of TD music has often been in the layering.
Now, in the case of something like 'Sohoman', and especially 'Heritage
Survival' from the TDI Keep CD, the layering of new over old is annoying
as all hell. But here, the sounds mesh more successfully.
SEAN MONTGOMERY Animator
T O P I X / Mad Dog
http://www.topix.com/~sean
From:
Gustavo Jobim I hate to admit it, but some of you folks are converting me. The more I
>listen to the 70's and early 80's albums, the more I realize how
>brilliant they really are. There are getting to be fewer and fewer
>recent albums of theirs that I still hold with high regard.... I don't
>know if that's good or bad, but at least I still have plenty more work
>of theirs I can listen to and enjoy! :) (It's truly amazing just how
>much work they've done over the years, I really can't believe it
>still....)
>
>Anyway, talk to y'all later,
>
>Jared
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Gustavo Jobim From: Vic Rek
>
>OK,
>
>We have Tom and James signed up so far. I think if we can get a group
>of 7-8 or so we can make a good time of it!
>
>So, how about Jim, Robert, Roger, Dell, Rick? Maybe we could do this in
>the Spring of 2000. Any takers from Europe or beyond?
>
>How about you Jerome Froese, are you game too? ;-)
>
>Vic
>
>Owens James wrote:
>>
>> From: Owens James
>>
>> Vic,
>>
>> Sign me up too. Huntsville, AL isn't too far to drive...
>>
>> > -----Original Message-----
>> > From: tom george [SMTP:eloy-usa@a...]
>> > Sent: Sunday, November 14, 1999 10:52 AM
>> > To: tadream@o...
>> > Subject: Re: [tadream] D:Studio [Stratosfear]
>> >
>> > From: 'tom george'
>> >
>> > hi vic,
>> > put me down as one to meet up at the swamp. i am in knoville, tn.
>> > as i've told you before so the trip is within reason for me. let me know
>> > when. tom
>> >
>> > >The swap is basically in Georgia. I would like to challenge any fan to
>> > >meet up with me at the Okeefenokee Swap 'trip' some day. I have not
>> > >been there yet even though I live in Atlanta. But distance is relative,
>> > >it's like going from Berlin to Munich? Let's make sure be bring along
>> > >our portable CD player :-)
>> > >
>> > >Vic
>> >
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Gustavo Jobim From: 'Andrew J. Rozsa'
>
>>From: Gustavo Jobim
>>
>>Yeah, I hate this millennium number problem.
>>
>>The problem is that the transformation of 1999 to 2000 has a much bigger
>>visual impact than from 2000 to 2001.
>
>Of course... and we would all prefer it that it weren't the way it is.... I
>was just being mischievous... clearly, music is MUCH more important than
>mere calendarial precision.
>
>Andrew
>P.S. What a wonderful name.... Jobim... sure rekindles some nice memories
>for me...:-)
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Gustavo Jobim
From:
Gustavo Jobim > NO price can justify the comparing of Edgar to the biggest mass
>> murderer of all times!
>
>Not to diminish Hitler's crimes, but I think Stalin was responsible for
>far more deaths in Russia during his years in power.
>
>Comparing someone to Hitler is a standard, immature ploy to pull their
>chain, but it's particularly objectionable when the target is from
>Germany.
>SEAN MONTGOMERY Animator
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Gustavo Jobim I guess it is the price I pay for having listened to virtually everything
>TD has produced... been listening for 23 years...
Been listening for 2 months and a half.
>It would be so wonderful never to have heard any of it and just discovering
>the music from scratch.
That's what I'm doing now! :))
>Oh, well... the thrill is gone... although the late 70s and early 80s music
>still makes my heart beat faster.
My thrill is beginning!! Isn't that great?!
>I think I will leave the rest of the TDI releases unopened... they do look
>graphically appealing.
Not in my opinion; just fractals and fractals...
>:-((
>
>Andrew
gfj np Convention of the 24. Unusual, isn't it?
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
PNaunton@xxx.xxx
Date: Mon Nov 15, 1999 8:04
pm
Subject: Obsession
In a message
<< I finally yanked 'WaB - AiM' of the shelf where it has been sitting with
the other of the unopened (last 15) TD albums. >>
How many 'other' recordings do you have which remain unlistened? Or
is it just TD?
A guy I used to know, who lived inside his anal preoccupation with
music, had a whole collection of recordings which he could not bear to listen
to. Primarily '70s Rock & Roll. They all remained sealed and in pristine
condition. The added irony was that he also spent thousands and thousands and
thousands on his music system which he never played either. He was happy just
to be surrounded by his wealth of collected art and equipment.
One day his house burned to the ground. I saw him once more shortly
thereafter, and he looked pretty ill. I never saw him or heard from him again
after that.
I always wondered if he died of a broken heart.
Phil N.
From:
'Jared White' From: Gustavo Jobim
>
> You (I mean, all the fans, including myself) have to face this: TD's
golden
> era was 1970-1987 (expanding a little here). The real golden era would be
> 1974-1984 (including Quichotte and Poland), in my humble opinion. That's
it!
Um, no offense, but have you actually LISTENED to anything past 1987?
Optical Race? Melrose? 220 Volt? Turn of the Tides? Goblin's Club? Dream
Mixes I & II? Oasis? Architecture in Motion? Mars Polaris?
Sure, TD's done some sub-par work the past 12 years or so. But they've also
done some brilliant work, I mean BRILLIANT work. This kind of
narrow-mindedness *really* irritates me.
If you're such a new fan, I'm surprised at you. You don't have any
particular emotional attachment to any particular period of theirs -- so why
should you just write everything after 1987 off as being somehow 'mediocre'
or 'inferior'?
I think it's time for me to take a break again.
See you all sometime soon,
Jared
From:
Synthhtnys@xxx.xxx
Date: Mon Nov 15, 1999 8:42
pm
Subject: Re: Name that Tyrant
In a message dated 11/15/99 7:10:12 PM !!!First Boot!!!,
gustavfj@m... writes:
<< >> NO price can justify the comparing of Edgar to the biggest mass
>> murderer of all times!
>
>Not to diminish Hitler's crimes, but I think Stalin was responsible for
>far more deaths in Russia during his years in power.> >>
*In recent years, Pol Pot killed more Vietnamese than Hitler did Jews.
From:
Gabe Yedid From: Sean Montgomery
>
> > I do have to say, though, that I think your take on 'Forced to Surrender'
> > is unique. ;) What about it reminds you of 'Near Dark'?
>
> The guitar sounds and general 'rock and roll' tone reminds me of 'Rain in
> the Third House' and 'Fight at Dawn'
*DOH*
This is where you all get to picture Gabe eating a 12-inch foot sandwich.
The track I had in mind was, of course, 'Art of Destruction'.
> > [Having said that, I do think that 'Astrophobia' is one of TD **BEST
> > TRACKS EVER**--easily as good as anything from the '70s or '80s, in its
> > own way. It's the only track from _MP_ I can say this about, though.]
>
> Well, that *is* high praise! I don't quite agree, although a good remix
> that made it about 1/3 shorter and added more AiM style punch might make
> me a believer.
For me, it's the fact that except for the beginning and end sections, this
track has virtually NO well-planned internal cohesiveness or structure.
It's what I enjoyed the most about _Dream Mixes_, and here Jerome just
took it a little bit further.
It's also quite unlike the other tracks on the album in the way it
actually builds and develops. And that beginning/end section...I'd have
to say Jerome is finally learning how to make his music have a more
dramatic, emotional impact, not to mention it's probably one of TD's best
sound experiments in years. It just drips darkness and menace (in a
rather soundtrack-like way...),and the way it ends is on a note of dread
finality that's rare in TD from any time period.
> > The 'Jungle Journey' mix is just the 'Reptile Mix' with some new sounds
> > pasted over--nothing obtrusive, but nothing too impressive either.
>
> True, but for me the beauty of TD music has often been in the layering.
> Now, in the case of something like 'Sohoman', and especially 'Heritage
> Survival' from the TDI Keep CD, the layering of new over old is annoying
> as all hell. But here, the sounds mesh more successfully.
Granted, they do mesh more successfully than the above examples, but they
certainly don't add as much to the track as the treatment that
'TimeSquare' got, which included a partial re-structuring as well.
> SEAN MONTGOMERY Animator
Gabe
From:
Gabe Yedid From: Synthhtnys@a...
>
> In a message dated 11/15/99 7:10:12 PM !!!First Boot!!!,
> gustavfj@m... writes:
>
> << >> NO price can justify the comparing of Edgar to the biggest mass
> >> murderer of all times!
> >
> >Not to diminish Hitler's crimes, but I think Stalin was responsible for
> >far more deaths in Russia during his years in power.> >>
>
> *In recent years, Pol Pot killed more Vietnamese than Hitler did Jews.
Why can't we just all agree that genocide is inexcusable, no matter who is
perpetrating it, who the victims are, or how many are killed?
Gabe
From:
'Thomas'
From:
DJS
>
> Sure, TD's done some sub-par work the past 12 years or so.
Some? Some? SOME? ;-p
But they've also
> done some brilliant work, I mean BRILLIANT work. This kind of
> narrow-mindedness *really* irritates me.
You know what they say, 'broad is the road...'. I think TD fans more
fond of the 'mellotron' days & the 'poland years' are more discerning. I
also think they are usually older fans who have come to respect the more
creative output of the band's earlier years. I mean, come on, even
hardcore fans have to admit that TD's last several years of stuff sounds
so similar it makes you wonder if they recorded it all in the same year
& just took several years off pretending they've been in the studio. My
fandom for TD stopped after Rockoon. Everything since then has sounded
the same (typical ho-hum Dream Mixes vein). I'd rather pay $16 for
Mark's Shreeve's/Redshift's more than perfect recreation of TD's berlin
school days, even if it is an homage to Rubycon.
>
> If you're such a new fan, I'm surprised at you. You don't have any
> particular emotional attachment to any particular period of theirs -- so why
> should you just write everything after 1987 off as being somehow 'mediocre'
> or 'inferior'?
Er, it is inferior. It's like new Coke. It sucks so bad everyone wants
the old one back but in this case it's impossible so hardcore fans just
accept it and live in denial that it all sounds so similar &
uninspiring. We'd have to get Franke & Haslinger or Schmoelling back.
The missing ingredients are two fresh band members. 3-4 people have so
many more ideas than only 2. As Captain Ron might say 'It shows boss.'
--
Dan J. Schulte
Rakinik Intertype-http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Dungeon/2140/
Progressive Electronic Music
http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/12/dan_j_schulte.html
From:
'Jared White' From: DJS
>
> My
> fandom for TD stopped after Rockoon. Everything since then has sounded
> the same (typical ho-hum Dream Mixes vein).
'Don't confuse me with the facts, my mind's made up.'
There's no arguing with you people!
BYE! :)
Jared
From:
goozer@xxxxxxx.xxx
Date: Tue Nov 16, 1999 12:03
am
Subject: Re: The Keep
(Deep lurk mode off)
Greetings all-
As someone who was at the final show of the UK '97 tour (Shepards Bush),
I can factually state that there were *no* Keep CD's left at the end of the
show. I bought one before the gig and tried to get another afterwards,
plus during the backstage party, Anja told Jerome that they had totally
sold out of said item. And as to there being 'tons' of Keep CD's available
on the tour, this too is in error. I was invited to the soundcheck for said
show,
and was there when they set up the stalls-there weren't that many availble
for sale. And a *lot* of fans were passing up on buying it due to it's 'high'
price! Whether or not there were only 150 pressed is something I didn't ask,
though 500 seems a reasonable amount (though I will not care what the
actual number is, nor will I state my speculation as fact!) And as to the band
'reneging' on the 'original deal' to offer 150 copies in a contest on their
page...GET OVER IT!! I'm sure that a few of the fans who don't have Internet
access, or who have lives that keep them away from 24-hr access are
certainly glad that the band magnanimously offed it on tour, albeit at a
premium price+ticket (and more than a few of you whiners wouldn't have
a copy!) A lot of you out there seem to think that everything the band says
is automatically an unbreachable contract, and that any time they change
their plans you feel your rights have been violated!! Sometimes I wonder
when we'll see a certain few of you leanding a march in Berlin demanding
the release of the Keep as your inalienable right! Some of you really need
to get over yourselves! The band doesn't owe you or anyone *ANYTHING*!!
Open and honest criticism and debate about the music and busness model
is one thing, but all of this continual whining invective cast in the language
of
victimization is pathetic, ignorant and self-serving.
Sorry if this is a little harsh, but I'm a little fed up of this tiresome
tirade. But in
no way do I wish to suggest that anyone shouldn't post on whatever they want
to.
I'll get over it.;)
goozer
(Deep lurk mode on)
Replies
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Yahoo! ID
Date
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Re: The Keep
Greg
Tue
11/16/1999
1 KB
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Re: The Keep
DJS
Tue
11/16/1999
2 KB
20664
Re: The Keep
twosheds
Tue
2/1/2000
1 KB
23659
The Keep
rbrown4856@a...
Wed
8/16/2000
1 KB
23661
The Fantasy Merchants KEEP CD
Steven Feldman
Wed
8/16/2000
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Re: The Keep
Antonio Nunes
Wed
8/16/2000
2 KB
33657
The Keep
Morgan Feldon
Tue
4/30/2002
2 KB
34561
The Keep
Admin
Fri
6/28/2002
2 KB
From:
Grant M Somerville From: 'Jared White'
>
> > From: Gustavo Jobim
> >
> > You (I mean, all the fans, including myself) have to face this: TD's
> golden
> > era was 1970-1987 (expanding a little here). The real golden era would be
> > 1974-1984 (including Quichotte and Poland), in my humble opinion. That's
> it!
>
> Um, no offense, but have you actually LISTENED to anything past 1987?
> Optical Race? Melrose? 220 Volt? Turn of the Tides? Goblin's Club? Dream
> Mixes I & II? Oasis? Architecture in Motion? Mars Polaris?
>
> Sure, TD's done some sub-par work the past 12 years or so. But they've also
> done some brilliant work, I mean BRILLIANT work. This kind of
> narrow-mindedness *really* irritates me.
>
> If you're such a new fan, I'm surprised at you. You don't have any
> particular emotional attachment to any particular period of theirs -- so why
> should you just write everything after 1987 off as being somehow 'mediocre'
> or 'inferior'?
>
> I think it's time for me to take a break again.
>
> See you all sometime soon,
>
> Jared
>
>
The guy is enthusiastic about the music.
Read some of his other mails.
Do you remember that buzz?
Re-arrange:- Some him slack cut.
Grant.
Grant M Somerville
Glasgow, Scotland.
Looking for Live Music Recordings...try
SOUNDCHECK
From:
Grant M Somerville From: Gabe Yedid
>
> On Mon, 15 Nov 1999 Synthhtnys@a... wrote:
>
> > From: Synthhtnys@a...
> >
> > In a message dated 11/15/99 7:10:12 PM !!!First Boot!!!,
> > gustavfj@m... writes:
> >
> > << >> NO price can justify the comparing of Edgar to the biggest mass
> > >> murderer of all times!
> > >
> > >Not to diminish Hitler's crimes, but I think Stalin was responsible for
> > >far more deaths in Russia during his years in power.> >>
> >
> > *In recent years, Pol Pot killed more Vietnamese than Hitler did Jews.
>
> Why can't we just all agree that genocide is inexcusable, no matter who is
> perpetrating it, who the victims are, or how many are killed?
>
> Gabe
>
Amen to that.
-- Kind Regards, Grant.
Grant M Somerville
Glasgow, Scotland.
Looking for Live Music Recordings...try
SOUNDCHECK
From:
'Jim Moore' The swap is basically in Georgia. I would like to challenge any fan to
> meet up with me at the Okeefenokee Swap 'trip' some day. I have not
> been there yet even though I live in Atlanta. But distance is relative,
> it's like going from Berlin to Munich? Let's make sure be bring along
> our portable CD player :-)
Sounds like a good idea (or as they say down south, 'idee'). Maybe I can
combine the trip with visiting some of my other south Georgian friends...
- jim
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
-
'The dream is always the same...' -- Joel, Risky Business
jimbo@v... -- Jim Moore, Atlanta, Georgia
Home Page: http://www.jimbo.vivid.net
From:
Vic Rek
From:
'twosheds'
From:
'twosheds' >We have Tom and James signed up so far. I think if we can get a group
>>of 7-8 or so we can make a good time of it!
>
>>So, how about Jim, Robert, Roger, Dell, Rick? Maybe we could do this in
>>the Spring of 2000. Any takers from Europe or beyond?
Make it a family event and I might actually show up... if I have the money.
Are we talking a camping trip, or just hanging out in the swamp?
Scott
Replies
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Yahoo! ID
Date
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19172
Re: : Re: Okefenokee trip?
Owens James
Tue
11/16/1999
1 KB
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Re: : Re: Okefenokee trip?
Gustavo Jobim
Wed
11/17/1999
1 KB
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Re: : Re: Okefenokee trip?
Vic Rek
Wed
11/17/1999
1 KB
From:
Quarlie@xxx.xxx
Date: Tue Nov 16, 1999 3:44
am
Subject: Re: Architecture in Motion - Thumbs Up!
In a message dated 11/15/99 4:20:38 PM, DJS wrote:
>I think TD fans more
>fond of the 'mellotron' days & the 'poland years' are more discerning. I
>also think they are usually older fans who have come to respect the more
>creative output of the band's earlier years. I mean, come on, even
>hardcore fans have to admit that TD's last several years of stuff sounds
>so similar it makes you wonder if they recorded it all in the same year
>& just took several years off pretending they've been in the studio.
I don't see why one would 'have to admit' that. Just because you can't tell
the difference between Tyranny of Beauty and Mars Polaris doesn't mean that
nobody can. (In fact, I find the thought laughable.)
>Er, it is inferior. It's like new Coke. It sucks so bad everyone wants
>the old one back but in this case it's impossible so hardcore fans just
>accept it and live in denial that it all sounds so similar &
>uninspiring.
Oh, so it IS inferior? Thanks for alerting those of us who had been under the
impression that it was good. Now that we know the truth, I'm sure we'll all
have better taste.
That was my cynical and ill-tempered way of saying that it's a matter of
opinion. I don't see why you would try to 'correct' someone else's musical
taste like that; it's not as though you're going to convince them of anything.
--Quarlie
NP: Covenant--'Tour de Force' single
From:
DJS
> From: 'twosheds'
>
> I think TD's contention was that the guestbook should be more of a 'Hey
> guys! Keep up the good work!' kind of forum rather than a place where we
> actually ask pointed questions. Of course, I can't believe that they really
> didn't expect people to do just that. Maybe if they would just give us
> honest answers to our questions.
Guestbooks are always full of weird stuff. The way I see it, TDI has a
stick up their butt (or in their case, a korg synth) and they've
overreacted. A guestbook is for anyone who visits the site to post
whatever they want. Why should anything in it be taken seriously? I'd
love to hear what Joe Bob Briggs would have to say about any of TDI's
decisions.
--
Dan J. Schulte
Rakinik Intertype-http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Dungeon/2140/
Progressive Electronic Music
http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/12/dan_j_schulte.html
From:
'Greg'
From:
t.h.o.m.a.s@xxxxx.xxx
Date: Tue Nov 16, 1999 5:43
am
Subject: Tadream.copfer.com
Anybody else having trouble with downloading this page? My browser stops at the
point where the server is checking out my computer settings and plugins.
http://tadream.copfer.com
Thomas
Sweden
Replies
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Yahoo! ID
Date
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19149
Re: Tadream.copfer.com
Quarlie@xxx.xxx
Tue
11/16/1999
1 KB
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Re: Tadream.copfer.com
joe shoults
Tue
11/16/1999
1 KB
From:
DJS
> From: 'Greg'
>
> When we see a price such as this $180 booster package.. the first thing
> we think is greed. How can it be so much?! All we are asking is to know
> why it costs so much.
TD is charging so much because they are losing money due to the fact
that their fanbase is shrinking which is due to the fact that their
current uninspiring output hasn't changed for a decade. ;-) They need as
much $$ as they can get (which also explains why Edgar went back on two
of his statements-never doing anymore soundtracks & never playing
festivals-both which they are currently doing or have done recently).
Face it, technology has caught up with them. There are dozens of
'bedroom musicians' doing what they do....better.
--
Dan J. Schulte
Rakinik Intertype-http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Dungeon/2140/
Progressive Electronic Music
http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/12/dan_j_schulte.html
From:
Quarlie@xxx.xxx
Date: Tue Nov 16, 1999 6:45
am
Subject: Re: Tadream.copfer.com
In a message dated 11/16/99 12:44:27 AM, t.h.o.m.a.s@t... wrote:
>Anybody else having trouble with downloading this page? My browser stops at
>the point where the server is checking out my computer settings and plugins.
>
>http://tadream.copfer.com
That happened to me on my computer at work (PC with Win98 and I think IE 5),
but my home computer (Mac with IE 4.5) was able to get past that point,
resulting in this page:
http://tadream.copfer.com/default2.htm
I tried that URL on the PC and it worked fine.
--Quarlie
NP: Sorcerer (just got this today--pretty good, but my favorite tracks are
too short)
From:
'Thomas' From: Quarlie@a...
>
>In a message dated 11/16/99 12:44:27 AM, t.h.o.m.a.s@t... wrote:
>
>>Anybody else having trouble with downloading this page? My browser stops at
>>the point where the server is checking out my computer settings and plugins.
>>
>>http://tadream.copfer.com
>
>That happened to me on my computer at work (PC with Win98 and I think IE 5),
>but my home computer (Mac with IE 4.5) was able to get past that point,
>resulting in this page:
>
>http://tadream.copfer.com/default2.htm
>
>I tried that URL on the PC and it worked fine.
>
>--Quarlie
...thanks for the input. My platform is similar to the one you use at work, so
I tried to install Netscape Navigator 4.61 instead, and it worked just fine. So
it must be some bug in IE5 methinks...
Thomas
np: Keller & Schönwälder 'Loops and Beats' - fantastic stuff!
From:
'Simon Slator'
From:
Nigbur D ----------
> From: Sean Montgomery[SMTP:sean@t...]
> Reply To: tadream@o...
> Sent: 15 November 1999 18:02
> To: tadream@o...
> Subject: Re: [tadream] Architecture in Motion - Thumbs Up!
>
> From: Sean Montgomery
>
> > [Having said that, I do think that 'Astrophobia' is one of TD **BEST
> > TRACKS EVER**--easily as good as anything from the '70s or '80s, in its
> > own way. It's the only track from _MP_ I can say this about, though.]
>
> Well, that *is* high praise! I don't quite agree, although a good remix
> that made it about 1/3 shorter and added more AiM style punch might make
> me a believer.
>
For some reason, Astrophobia makes me disengage from listening to MP, and I
don't get back into it at all. It reminds me very strongly of 'Jungle
Journey' in that respect...a very good track in itself, but somewhat
mis-placed in the context of the album. Placing it a bit more towards the
middle part of the CD might have helped this problem, but then again,
'Spiral Star Date' is my favourite piece on the disc, and I want it right
where it is at the moment!
> True, but for me the beauty of TD music has often been in the layering.
> Now, in the case of something like 'Sohoman', and especially 'Heritage
> Survival' from the TDI Keep CD, the layering of new over old is annoying
> as all hell. But here, the sounds mesh more successfully.
>
I thought the additions on 'Heritage Survival' actually added to the musical
experience quite a bit. It won't replace the original material, of course,
but I thought it was a nice interpretation.
Dennis
From:
Antonio Nunes escreveu:
> Does the digest mode has ALL the e-mails posted condensed in one only
> message?
Yes.
Antonio
np: Satsuma Nightmare - A few old bits
From:
Attila Gyory
From:
Nigbur D ----------
> From: Andrew J. Rozsa[SMTP:rozsa@p...]
> Reply To: tadream@o...
> Sent: 14 November 2000 04:42
> To: tadream@o...
> Subject: Re: [tadream] Architecture in Motion - Thumbs Up!
>
>
> From: 'Andrew J. Rozsa'
>
> I guess it is the price I pay for having listened to virtually everything
> TD has produced... been listening for 23 years...
>
> It would be so wonderful never to have heard any of it and just
> discovering
> the music from scratch.
>
> Oh, well... the thrill is gone... although the late 70s and early 80s
> music
> still makes my heart beat faster.
>
This is a very interesting take on the topic, which we cetrainly need to
take into account when beginning to slate TDs contemporary output. There is
no way in the world how the most recent releases could recreate the
excitement we all felt when first discovering TD music, which after all is
very different from a lot of other musical directions on the market. When we
all started collecting, TD was _different_, simply by being TD. After
umpteen years of collecting CDs, listening to boots, absorbing every bit of
information in books, on the telly, on the radio, and - let's face it - also
being able to discuss every minute detail of TD's music and history on this
list, it should not be surprising that the novelty is gone.
Maybe we are all caught up in ultra-high expectations towards new TD albums,
somehow hoping for them to induce the same feelings of excitement, novelty,
and genuine 'underground' interest in us as the older recordings did.
However, being so familiar with TD style and history by now, this
familiarity stands in the way of the explorer and discoverer spirit of the
first albums we bought. I got introduced to TD through Cyclone and Lily on
the Beach, and I have retained this novelty excitement about them despite
their controversial reputation. Similarly, someone who got introduced to TD
through Mars Polaris (which I think is a very good album), will probably
feel the same way about MP.
Dennis
From:
Nigbur D
From:
Nigbur D ----------
> From: Jared White[SMTP:jwhite@s...]
> Reply To: tadream@o...
> Sent: 12 November 1999 20:07
> To: tadream
> Subject: RE: [tadream] Architecture in Motion - Thumbs Up!
>
> From: 'Jared White'
>
> Don't get me wrong -- I still think MP is a fine album. But it's been
> pushed off my pedestal of being this incredible 'TD is BACK!!!'-type
> album. In a way, I think Oasis better fits that title, except TD doesn't
> seem to be continuing that line of composition these days. :(
>
I don't think it would be adequate to regard Oasis as a TD is back! album
for the reason that it was in itself a retrospective to Canyon Dreams,
integrated with the more contemporary elements from the Goblins Club era.
Although I thought that both GC and Oasis were very nice, the most
remarkable departure for TD stylistically (which is now continued in MP) was
on a much neglected album - Transsiberia!
This album is stylistically and instrumentally so similar to Mars Polaris,
and at the same time so different from its predecessors that it makes me
think that this might be an indication of the direction TD are going to take
from here. I can live with that quite happily.
Dennis
From:
'kayleigh'
From:
craig.cordrey@xxxx.xxx
Date: Tue Nov 16, 1999 2:06
pm
Subject: Re: Cd set
>From: 'kayleigh'
>
>But wanted to ask about this? I KNOW there is another box set, and some talk
>of some overpriced x-mas set that is out there now or something? BUT anyone
>seen this 'classic 3 Cd set' in a small box package for sale?
I think this is a Castle Communications (or whatever they're called these days)
boxed set of Electronic Meditation, Alpha Centauri and something else (either
Zeit or Atem). I don't think they're any different from the standard remastered
disks from Castle.
This just one of a number of 3-disk TD sets available from various
manufacturers : Virgin gave us Phaedra, Rubycon and Ricochet on Picture CD,
they also put out Encore, Force Majeure and Tangram, and Jive / Castle did
Tyger, Extracts from Poland and something else on gold CD.
--------------------------------------------------------------
Craig R. J. Cordrey craig.cordrey@g...
Senior Software Engineer 01383 828187
Alenia Marconi Systems
Integrated Systems Division
Donibristle, Fife, Scotland
--------------------------------------------------------------
From:
'joe shoults' -----Original Message-----
> From: Thomas [mailto:t.h.o.m.a.s@t...]
...
> >>Anybody else having trouble with downloading this page? My
...
> ...thanks for the input. My platform is similar to the one you
> use at work, so I tried to install Netscape Navigator 4.61
> instead, and it worked just fine. So it must be some bug in IE5
> methinks...
>
From:
'joe shoults' -----Original Message-----
> From: Vic Rek [mailto:torque19@i...]
> Subject: [tadream] Okefenokee trip? - A Proposition!
> ...
> I request all inclined to join this event, please respond to this list.
> I'll post a current participant list about once a month, just in case I
> missed an e-mail (which can happened from time to time).
>
> Heck, maybe TD will be interested too if we get a good gathering?!?
>
> If you believe, it can happen. Let's do it!
>
From:
';-Peter ;-Prisekin aka ;-Dusty ;-Chalk' Hey there all. Wanted to pop a quick note about a 'box set' of Tangerine
> Dream 'original 3 classics'. I saw this at a local Record Town about 4 days
> ago, AND almost picked it up, but it was $43 for the 3 Cds, and it was stuff
> I had NEVER HEARD OF before...
> But wanted to ask about this? I KNOW there is another box set, and some talk
> of some overpriced x-mas set that is out there now or something? BUT anyone
> seen this 'classic 3 Cd set' in a small box package for sale?
From:
'F.H. Dumay'
From:
'Lawry Simm' Me? Late with a review? Shocking, I know. (Heck, the last one I
wrote was so
> late I decided not to bother posting it.)
You think that's late Dan? You ain't seen nothing yet... my
D:Stratosfear to follow later today/tomorrow.... but I have had an
excuse...
To all... don't be afraid of posting late.... much better to arrive
late than to never arrive at all.
Regards,
Lawry
lawrysimm@u...
ICQ # 23267226
Instant Messenger - lawrysimm
From:
'Lawry Simm' Any way the real reason for the post is to ask if anyone has come
across
>Tangram on CD?
Orch, if you're still on The Wirral, you should find that HMV and the
Virgin Megastore in Liverpool both have this in for about £9.99 on the
Virgin SBM Remasters (Definitive Edition) range.
> P:S Does anyone know if Ian Body and the like are playing in the UK
anywhere
> soon ( a question for my Scottish counterparts I think )
> Cheers all Carl ' Orch '
A quote from the latest Groove Newsletter....
Some UK concerts:
11 Mar 2000 RMI & Under The Dome
22 Apr 2000 Paul Nagle & Arcane
13 May 2000 Airsculpture & Kubusschnitt/wEirD
?? Jun 2000 Asana
Jodrell Bank is south of Manchester, England, and is home to a pretty
huge radio telescope. The concerts will take place in the
planetarium.
It is a very nice place to watch (and play!) music.
Unquote.
Looks like it may be a good year for us UK EM fans... esp. those based
here in the North West!!! :-) Too bastard bad that I'm on holiday in
May and will completely miss the AirSculpture/Kubusschnitt/wEirD gig.
Huge bunch of arse.
regards,
Lawry
lawrysimm@u...
ICQ # 23267226
Instant Messenger - lawrysimm
From:
'Lawry Simm'
From:
'Lawry Simm'
From:
'Carl & Jacqui Kearney'
To:
Sent: Monday, November 15, 1999 8:41 AM
Subject: Re: [tadream] Transsiberia. Tangram Ian Body UK E Music
> From: craig.cordrey@g...
>
>
> >From: 'Carl & Jacqui Kearney'
> >
> >P:S Does anyone know if Ian Body and the like are playing in the UK
anywhere
> >soon
> 11 Mar 2000 RMI & Under The Dome
> 22 Apr 2000 Paul Nagle & Arcane
> 13 May 2000 Airsculpture & Kubusschnitt/wEirD
> ?? Jun 2000 Asana
> .
>
> For Flittermouse, and anyone else who doesn't know:
> Jodrell Bank is south of Manchester, England, and is home to a pretty
> huge radio telescope. The concerts will take place in the planetarium.
> It is a very nice place to watch (and play!) music.
Ah I new you would not let me down guys . Looks like I will be busy next
year. Thanks to all the people who posted a reply regarding this question
and the Tangram question to include the following Lawry, Grant, Joel,Nick
and of course Craig . Thanks Guys
Best regards Carl 'Orch '
From:
'twosheds' Face it, technology has caught up with them. There are dozens of
>'bedroom musicians' doing what they do....better.
So who are they? Name some bands/individuals who make better e-music than TD
now and whose CD's you might be able to find in a record shop somewhere. I
don't mean this as a challenge, just curious.
Scott
From:
DJS
> From: 'twosheds'
>
> Quoth Dan-O:
> >Face it, technology has caught up with them. There are dozens of
> >'bedroom musicians' doing what they do....better.
>
> So who are they? Name some bands/individuals who make better e-music than TD
> now and whose CD's you might be able to find in a record shop somewhere. I
> don't mean this as a challenge, just curious.
>
Just go to MP3.com and surf around the electronic genre. You'll find
lots of great artists there. Why, someone just posted a cover of
Monolight last week there & it was better than anything I've heard from
TD in a long time. Many of these artists have cds available through
their labels or if you really know what's going on you can order a DAM
cd.
--
Dan J. Schulte
Rakinik Intertype-http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Dungeon/2140/
Progressive Electronic Music
http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/12/dan_j_schulte.html
From:
Sean Montgomery Maybe we are all caught up in ultra-high expectations towards new TD albums,
> somehow hoping for them to induce the same feelings of excitement, novelty,
> and genuine 'underground' interest in us as the older recordings did.
Perhaps, although I'm beginning to think that part of the problem today is
in the sheer volume of new TD releases. It dilutes their impact, not
only because we're now getting a lot of repetitive material that they
would have left off the records in the past, but also because we don't
have to wait around hungering for a new album for very long. Familiarity
breeds contempt, as they say. Most bands only put out an album a year at
best, and often less than that. For comparison, during the 90s, we've had
5 from REM, 4 from U2, 5 from Madonna....TD: does anyone have a count?
25? 26? I know Edgar is famous for his unrelenting work ethic, but
that's just plain nutty.
> Similarly, someone who got introduced to TD through Mars Polaris (which
> I think is a very good album), will probably feel the same way about MP.
I'm curious as to how many new fans they're bringing in these days. They
get virtually no promotion, no radio airplay, spotty distribution in
record stores, and they're not doing big movie soundtracks - which is how
many of us (including myself) were introduced to them. Furthermore, their
music isn't what it once was. It's not 'underground' in any way. It's
not exploratory. It can be pretty, and occasionally energetic, but in
today's musical landscape it no longer stands out the way that Encore and
Tangram did in their day. And I don't say that because I'm nostalgic for
the good old days. I only started listening to TD in 1986, the year when
I feel they ceased to be an innovative force and just because producers of
(occasionally) nice music.
SEAN MONTGOMERY Animator
T O P I X / Mad Dog
http://www.topix.com/~sean
Replies
Name/Email
Yahoo! ID
Date
Size
19183
Re: The Debate Continues
DJS
Wed
11/17/1999
2 KB
19280
Re: The Debate Continues
Gustavo Jobim
Fri
11/19/1999
1 KB
From:
Owens James -----Original Message-----
> From: 'twosheds'
>
> Make it a family event and I might actually show up... if I have the
> money.
> Are we talking a camping trip, or just hanging out in the swamp?
>
From:
Owens James -----Original Message-----
> From: craig.cordrey@g...
> Jive / Castle did
> Tyger, Extracts from Poland and something else on gold CD.
>
From:
Gabe Yedid From: Nigbur D
>
> I am surprised that there are no notes about line-up and instrumentation in
> the MP inlay card. Specifically, does anyone know who plays the guitar part
> on 'Comets Figure Head'?
>
> Dennis
Not that my guess is better than anyone else's, but I'd say it's Jerome.
Gabe
From:
Owens James -----Original Message-----
> From: Sean Montgomery [SMTP:sean@t...]
> Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 1999 1:31 PM
> To: tadream@o...
> Subject: [tadream] The Debate Continues
>
> From: Sean Montgomery
>
> TD: does anyone have a count?
> 25? 26? I know Edgar is famous for his unrelenting work ethic, but
> that's just plain nutty.
>
>
Replies
Name/Email
Yahoo! ID
Date
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19178
Re: 90's TD count
Owens James
Tue
11/16/1999
1 KB
19189
Re: 90's TD count
Joel Mullen
Wed
11/17/1999
6 KB
19191
Re: 90's TD count
PNaunton@a...
Wed
11/17/1999
1 KB
19192
Re: 90's TD count
PNaunton@a...
Wed
11/17/1999
1 KB
19193
Re: 90's TD count
Joel Mullen
Wed
11/17/1999
2 KB
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Re: 90's TD count
Paul Fellows
Wed
11/17/1999
1 KB
19208
Re: 90's TD count
Owens James
Wed
11/17/1999
5 KB
19209
Re: 90's TD count
Joel Mullen
Wed
11/17/1999
2 KB
From:
'Patrik *'
From:
Owens James -----Original Message-----
> From: 'Patrik *'
>
>does anyone know who plays the guitar part
>on 'Comets Figure Head'?
> well it´s the old 'father and son'-thing, that means Edgar plays the
> guitar
> and Jerome is the drum-guy (mostly anyway)
>
From:
Owens James -----Original Message-----
> Destination Berlin Soundtrack
>
From:
Gustavo Jobim
>
>> From: Gustavo Jobim
>>
>> You (I mean, all the fans, including myself) have to face this: TD's
>golden
>> era was 1970-1987 (expanding a little here). The real golden era would be
>> 1974-1984 (including Quichotte and Poland), in my humble opinion. That's
>it!
>
>Um, no offense, but have you actually LISTENED to anything past 1987?
>Optical Race? Melrose? 220 Volt? Turn of the Tides? Goblin's Club? Dream
>Mixes I & II? Oasis? Architecture in Motion? Mars Polaris?
>
>Sure, TD's done some sub-par work the past 12 years or so. But they've also
>done some brilliant work, I mean BRILLIANT work. This kind of
>narrow-mindedness *really* irritates me.
>
>If you're such a new fan, I'm surprised at you. You don't have any
>particular emotional attachment to any particular period of theirs -- so why
>should you just write everything after 1987 off as being somehow 'mediocre'
>or 'inferior'?
>
>I think it's time for me to take a break again.
>
>See you all sometime soon,
>
>Jared
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Gustavo Jobim
From:
Gustavo Jobim From: 'twosheds'
>
>>>We have Tom and James signed up so far. I think if we can get a group
>>>of 7-8 or so we can make a good time of it!
>>
>>>So, how about Jim, Robert, Roger, Dell, Rick? Maybe we could do this in
>>>the Spring of 2000. Any takers from Europe or beyond?
>
>Make it a family event and I might actually show up... if I have the money.
>Are we talking a camping trip, or just hanging out in the swamp?
>
>Scott
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Gustavo Jobim From: Vic Rek
>
>To all TD fans and the Froeses and the great team from TDI!
>
>Well, all these responses sound exciting indeed!
>
>I'm keeping a list and I think that in April 2000, we can plan a great
>trip to southern Georgia - as a TD Fan Team (TFT). The airfares from
>Europe should still he cheap, but the swamp borders the Florida border
>so the weather should be very mild - even at 3AM ;-)
>
>I request all inclined to join this event, please respond to this list.
>I'll post a current participant list about once a month, just in case I
>missed an e-mail (which can happened from time to time).
>
>Heck, maybe TD will be interested too if we get a good gathering?!?
>
>If you believe, it can happen. Let's do it!
>
>Vic
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
DJS
> From: Sean Montgomery
>
> > Maybe we are all caught up in ultra-high expectations towards new TD albums,
> > somehow hoping for them to induce the same feelings of excitement, novelty,
> > and genuine 'underground' interest in us as the older recordings did.
Would be nice if they released something of older origins without
perverting it first with their mundane Korg bridges & tangentizations.
Most bands only put out an album a year at
> best, and often less than that. For comparison, during the 90s, we've had
> 5 from REM, 4 from U2, 5 from Madonna....TD: does anyone have a count?
> 25? 26? I know Edgar is famous for his unrelenting work ethic, but
> that's just plain nutty.
Well put.
--
Dan J. Schulte
Rakinik Intertype-http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Dungeon/2140/
Progressive Electronic Music
http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/12/dan_j_schulte.html
From:
AOutland@xxx.xxx
Date: Wed Nov 17, 1999 1:44
am
Subject: Re: Okefenokee trip?
In a message dated 11/14/99 9:16:02 PM Eastern Standard Time,
torque19@i... writes:
<< So, how about Jim, Robert, Roger, Dell, Rick? Maybe we could do this in
the Spring of 2000. >>
This is sounding really good. It would be great meeting TD fans I've
'talked' to via this list. I really hope we can work on this. Barring job
problems, family problems, travel problems; hmm, well, maybe it's a maybe.
8-) Dell
From:
'Thomas' From: Sean Montgomery
>
>Most bands only put out an album a year at best, and often less than that.
For comparison, during the 90s, we've had 5 from REM, 4 from U2, 5 from
Madonna....TD: does anyone have a count? 25? 26? I know Edgar is famous for
his unrelenting work ethic, but that's just plain nutty.<
You really nailed it Sean! That's what TD used to do in the seventies (almost
anyway). During the seventies we had:
1970 Electronic Meditation (LP)
1971 Alpha Centauri (LP)
1972 Zeit (2LP)
1973 Atem (LP)
1973 Green Desert (LP, rel.-86)
1974 Phaedra (LP)
1975 Rubycon (LP)
1975 Ricochet (LP)
1976 Stratosfear (LP)
1977 Encore (2LP)
1977 Sorcerer (LP)
1978 Cyclone (LP)
1979 Force Majeure (LP)
That makes 13 full length albums. (Did I forget any?) That's a more reasonable
amount of records put out, and I think just like Sean that it was much easier
to embrace each album.
It also makes for better artistic integrity IMO, to really have time to think
about every release. I guess someone will point out that today's technology is
so much smoother and easier to move around when a recording is made - and
that's exactely my point. Today they have such a multitude of sounds which they
can easily store away and bring up at any desired moment, almost to the point
that live doesn't sound much different from album. Back then they really had to
fine trim their instruments every time, and that automatically gave them the
time to think what sounds they wanted. That's my theory by the way.
Don't get me wrong here, I like a lot of the new stuff too, some of it is
incredibly good, like 'The Dream Mixes' and 'Goblins Club'. It's just that it
doesn't quite stand out as unique and AS innovative as it used to do. That's my
feeling.
Always, best intentions,
cheers,
Thomas
Sweden
PS. I started listening to TD in '94 - so I'm really a newcomer to this...
From:
Vic Rek
Date: Wed Nov 17, 1999 2:04
am
Subject: Re: : Re: Okefenokee trip?
>
> From: Owens James
>
> Camping sounds cool. My Wife and I love to camp. I was planning to bring
> her regardless.
>
> James
Of course a fan's wife is invited (children too). Maybe some TD fans can
bring their husband along too ;-)
We've got around a dozen people so far. I think we can make it happen.
Maybe we can even make it a mini EM trade fest? Hey even better, maybe
a few fans of EM professionals can show up and we can work a mini
concert? Marcel/Jens - what's your schedule look like?
Vic
From:
Vic Rek
Date: Wed Nov 17, 1999 3:31
am
Subject: Re: Okefenokee trip?
> From: AOutland@a...
This is sounding really good. It would be great meeting TD fans
I've
> 'talked' to via this list. I really hope we can work on this. Barring job
> problems, family problems, travel problems; hmm, well, maybe it's a maybe.
> 8-) Dell
Dell, don't worry about the details too much for now, I'm sure some 'TD
help' will come it's way ;-)
The idea is getting bigger and I think I am going to have to organize an
event that can at least get us Internet TD fans together. I invite all
fans and by early 2000 I should have an opinion from the fans on how
this event should happen... OK, let's do it, because I think it's
really 'DOable'. Vic
P.S. Who wants to bring the portable CD player? Oh, and I think we
should have some TD promo info when the 'PRESS' arrives. I think we need
to plan for that too... :-)
From:
Rudy Russo
Date: Wed Nov 17, 1999 3:39
am
Subject: Re: Okefenokee trip?
What are you guys planning to do at this place?
Rude
--- Vic Rek wrote:
> From: Vic Rek
>
> > From: AOutland@a...
> This is sounding really good. It would be
> great meeting TD fans
> I've
> > 'talked' to via this list. I really hope we can
> work on this. Barring job
> > problems, family problems, travel problems; hmm,
> well, maybe it's a maybe.
> > 8-) Dell
>
> Dell, don't worry about the details too much for
> now, I'm sure some 'TD
> help' will come it's way ;-)
> The idea is getting bigger and I think I am going to
> have to organize an
> event that can at least get us Internet TD fans
> together. I invite all
> fans and by early 2000 I should have an opinion from
> the fans on how
> this event should happen... OK, let's do it,
> because I think it's
> really 'DOable'. Vic
>
> P.S. Who wants to bring the portable CD player? Oh,
> and I think we
> should have some TD promo info when the 'PRESS'
> arrives. I think we need
> to plan for that too... :-)
>
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> editing original messages in your replies. TO
> UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed from this list), send a
> blank e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
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>
>
=====
From:
Joel Mullen
Date: Wed Nov 17, 1999 4:02
am
Subject: RE: 90's TD count
On Tuesday, November 16, 1999 3:41 PM, Owens James
[SMTP:james.e.owens@b...] wrote:
> From: Owens James
>
> 1990 Melrose Album
> Dead Solid Perfect Soundtrack
> Destination Berlin Soundtrack
> 1991 The Man Inside Soundtrack
> Canyon Dreams Soundtrack
> The Park Is Mine Soundtrack
> Rumpelstiltskin Soundtrack
> 1992 Tyger Re-worked
> Rockoon Album
> Deadly Care Soundtrack
> The Private Music of Tangerine Dream Compilation
> 1993 220 Volts Live Live
> 1994 Turn of the Tides Album
> Tangents Compilation
> Catch Me If You Can Soundtrack
> 1995 Tyranny of Beauty Album
> The Dream Mixes Remixes
> Zoning Soundtrack
> 1996 The Dream Mixes 2CD edition Remixes
> Goblin's Club Album
> Dream Roots Collection Compilation
> 1997 Tournado Live
> The Keep Special Edition Soundtrack
> Oasis Soundtrack
> Quinoa Extended Album
> Ambient Monkey Album
> 1998 Timesquare - Dream Mixes II Album/Remixes
> Transsiberia Soundtrack
> The Dream Encores Live(?)
> Hollywood Years Part 1 Soundtrack
> Hollywood Years Part 2 Soundtrack
> 1999 Valentine Wheels Live
> What a Blast Soundtrack
> Mars Polaris Album
> Sohoman Live
> 199? Jim & Pablo 'Der Meteor'
>
> Assuming that this is an exhaustive list, then the count is 36!!!!
> I'm including compilations or re-mixes with previously unreleased
> material only. Does anyone have anything to add?
>
> James
James-
I cleaned it up a bit. How do we determine when the work
was done? Some of the movies you list were pre-1990. What of
that? Do we just go buy when it was available for purchase? That
seems to be what you are doing. It makes sense because I am sure
it took some of their time to release it even if the work for the movie
was done previously
Missing----
Luminous Visions
Atlantic Walls (TDI)
Atlantic Bridges (TDI)
Canyon Dreams (video)
Three Phase (video)
Great Wall of China (will come in just under the wire)
And you talked about re-mixed, but what about re-mastered???
We have all 13 SBM remastered releases----
Phaedra- SBM Remastered
Rubycon- SBM Remastered
Ricochet- SBM Remastered
Encore- SBM Remastered
Stratosfear- SBM Remastered
Cyclone- SBM Remastered
Force Majeure- SBM Remastered
Tangram- SBM Remastered
Exit- SBM Remastered
Logos- Live at the Dominon- SBM Remastered
White Eagle- SBM Remastered
Hyperborea- SBM Remastered
Thief-Remastered
PLUS all the remastered Castle/Sequal releases too-----
Electronic Meditation- Remastered
Alpha Centauri- Remastered
Zeit- Remastered
Atem- Remastered
Pergamon (Quichotte)- Live at the P.D.R.- Remastered
Green Desert- Remastered
Poland- Remastered
Le Parc- Remastered
Underwater Sunlight- Remastered
Tyger- Remastered
Live Miles- Remastered
What about all the official (non-promo) singles? here is the list of
just the ones released on CD-
I Just Want to Rule My Own Life Without You
Rockoon Special Edition (w/ interview)
Dreamtime (CD Radio Edit w/ Vocal Version)
Turn of the Tides (w/ Story of the Brave)
Shepards Bush
Towards the Evening Star (Orb re-mix single) (digi)
Limited World Tour Edition 1997
Dream Dice Vol. 1-Silver Single
And I know you only mentioned re-mix and new material compilations but
they *MIGHT* have had some sort of a hand in these during the 1990's---
(((TDI released compilations listed above)))
From Dawn to Dusk 1973-1988
Dream Music
The Private Music of T.D.
The Story of Tangerine Dream (Double)
Atmospherics
Book of Dreams (double)
Dream Music Vol. 2
Tangerine Dream-T.D. (disky #1)
The Analogue Space Years 69-73 (gold) (double)
The Best of Tangerine Dream -The Blue Years
The Best of Tangerine Dream -The Pink Years
Tangerine Dream- T.D. (disky#2)
And I hate to bring this up, but if you count releases of the
same album with a bonus track as 'new music' then you
have to add in may of the same albums again (I am not
even going to do it) And if an album is released again
WITHOUT a track is it a '-1' release or is the first one a '+1'??
For sure I think Quinoa counts as 2 releases. Maybe even
the new Canyon Dreams too
And I am going to stay a million miles away from the picture
disc/ new artwork discussion, but I think it might be valid if
you consider that it takes up some of TD's time for Jerome to
boot up Photoshop... ;-)
How much do you think they made this decade?? ALOT from
me I can tell you.
I have a headache now.....
Joel
From:
PNaunton@a...
Date: Wed Nov 17, 1999 5:29
am
Subject: Re: SV: The Debate
In a message dated 16-11-1999 10:26:47 PM EST, t.h.o.m.a.s@t... writes:
<< Don't get me wrong here, I like a lot of the new stuff too, some of it is
incredibly good, like 'The Dream Mixes' and 'Goblins Club'. It's just that it
doesn't quite stand out as unique and AS innovative as it used to do. That's
my feeling.
Always, best intentions,
cheers,
Thomas >>
I'm sure that with the new technology available that it is totally
impossible to create the music the way that they did before. In days of yore,
there was most likely 99% experimentation and free form jamming going on.
Back then they worked with instruments which didn't cooperate with each other
like they do now. I'll bet that Edgar hasn't practiced on the Electric Coffee
Machine in years.
I DID notice that my new coffee maker and the toaster have a Midi
interface now. It's great. Coordinated breakfast.
Phil N.
From:
PNaunton@a...
Date: Wed Nov 17, 1999 5:31
am
Subject: Re: 90's TD count
In a message dated 16-11-1999 11:04:49 PM EST, joelm@p... writes:
<< Luminous Visions >>
What is this?
Phil N.
From:
PNaunton@a...
Date: Wed Nov 17, 1999 5:32
am
Subject: Re: 90's TD count
In a message dated 16-11-1999 11:04:49 PM EST, joelm@p... writes:
<< I have a headache now.....
Joel >>
You deserve it.
Phil N.
From:
Joel Mullen
Date: Wed Nov 17, 1999 5:51
am
Subject: RE: 90's TD count
On Tuesday, November 16, 1999 11:32 PM, PNaunton@a...
[SMTP:PNaunton@a...] wrote:
> From: PNaunton@a...
>
> In a message dated 16-11-1999 11:04:49 PM EST, joelm@p... writes:
>
> << Luminous Visions >>
>
> What is this?
>
> Phil N.
Assuming you are not kidding, it is a video of computer
generated 'morphing' type stuff. The soundtrack is all
TD. All of which can be found on other titles, except
sometimes Luminious Visions gets a shorter version
of the song.
Here is what you get with in the Luminous Visions CD-
(the 'same' means IDENTICAL to (not a remix) )
Luminous Visions
=============
1. Jungle Journey (reptile mix) (6:20)
-- the same as 'Dream Mixes' CD1 track 4
2. Towards the Evening Star (6:21)
-- the same as 'Goblins Club' track 1
3. Rough Embrace (5:30)
-- the same as 'Dream Mixes' CD1 track 2
4. Catwalk (black ink mix) (8:12)
-- the same as 'Dream Mixes' CD2 track 3
5. Touchwood (the forest mix) (4:02)
-- a shorter version of 'Dream Mixes' CD1 track 3 (7:00)
(It starts and ends the same, but they cut parts out of
the middle and threw them away. This track is SO
much better in it's full length version)
6. Change of the Gods (7:19)
-- the same as 'Dream Mixes' CD1 track 9
7. Bride in Cold Tears (the motown monk mix) (5:31)
-- the same as 'Dream Mixes' CD1 track 10
8. Little Blond in the Park of Attractions (the thai Dub) (4:09)
-- a shorter version of 'Dream Mixes' CD1 track 1 (7:17)
(The same comment as #5, it seems rushed along. )
9. Firetongues (the break freak mix) (6:18)
-- the same as 'Dream Mixes' CD1 track 6
10. Sojus (9:19)
-- the same as 'Dream Mixes' CD2 track 6
11. Flashflood (7:01)
-- the same as 'Oasis' track 1
12. Midwinter Night (4:36)
-- the same as 'Turn of the Tides' track 7
From:
'Andrew J. Rozsa'
Date: Wed Nov 17, 1999 6:01
am
Subject: RE: Architecture in Motion - Thumbs Up!
At 13:10 11/16/99 -0000, Dennis wrote:
>From: Nigbur D
[...........]
>all started collecting, TD was _different_, simply by being TD. After
>umpteen years of collecting CDs, listening to boots, absorbing every bit of
>information in books, on the telly, on the radio, and - let's face it - also
>being able to discuss every minute detail of TD's music and history on this
>list, it should not be surprising that the novelty is gone.
[...........]
Well put, Dennis. I am glad that you heard me. I was not belittling TD... I
was kinda talking, sotto voce, to myself. These are personal reflections,
which I choose to share with the only group of people who give a damn about
TD's music.
I was working one late night (1975) in the lab... graduate student... in an
extremely impecunious state, which meant no concerts, or fancy stereo
get-up... and the university station played the first track from Phaedra...
I dropped the experiment I was working on and became utterly enthralled...
caught myself holding my breath so as not to miss a single sound,
inflexion, or phrase.... a very emotional experience.
I was hounded by the sound for days, afterwards. Unfortunately, the DJ
wouldn't give me the LP, although I promised him my first-born. Several
months later, one of students I was teaching (taught a Sensation &
Perception course), hearing me talk so enthusiastically about TD while
lecturing on 'hearing' surprised me by bringing back from Germany tapes of
Rubycon, Ricochet, and Stratosphear. I was hooked, fanatically.
About the only similar experience I had was several years earlier when I
heard Pink Floyd's 'Meddle'... although during that experience my
consciousness was chemically altered, therefore unreliable. I hasten to add
that I feel the same way about later PF output as I do about TD's.
It may be a matter of interest to some that I find similar excitement today
listening to keyboard-driven electronic progressive rock. This genre is
definitely resurgent, given the many ProgRock festivals that seem to be
springing up all the time. My most favorite groups are After Crying and
Townscream, both from Hungary.
To all those who wondered how can I let a bunch of TD albums just sit on
the shelf... well, like it says on the T-shirt my wife got me: 'So much
good music; so little time to listen to it.' Why I bothered buying them?
Well, having collected them for so many years...it must be inertia. :-) I
am certainly drawing the line at the 'X-mas' package. In an ironic way, I
must thank TDI for bringing things in focus for me.
BTW, I read most of the stuff here, just as I have from the very beginning
of Dave Datta's list. Don't find much need to add my two-bits' worth. But I
will definitely entertain unusual offers such as Vic's. :-))
Happy listening, y'all. I really do envy all of you who are at the
beginning of your TD trip. It will be a trip like none other. I am sure. :-))
Andrew
P.S. Don't pay any attention to my ramblings or to anybody else's diatribe
on the worth or worthlessness of any particular album... just listen to
it.. if it moves you, it's a good one... if it does not, it's not. De
gustibus non disputandum est (do not argue about taste)... or as the French
say..... Chacun a son gout...
P.P.S. To the Hungarian contingent on this list:
Ha valaki megtalalna a 97-es TD Budapesti koncert plakatyat, szivessen jol
megfizetnem. :-) Ugyan ugy, eredeti After Crying, Townscream, vagy Korai
Orom-et.
From:
'Thomas'
Date: Wed Nov 17, 1999 6:24
am
Subject: SV: SV: The Debate
>From: PNaunton@a...
>
>Back then they worked with instruments which didn't cooperate with each other
>like they do now. I'll bet that Edgar hasn't practiced on the Electric Coffee
>Machine in years.
> I DID notice that my new coffee maker and the toaster have a Midi
>interface now. It's great. Coordinated breakfast.
>
>Phil N.
Where can you get such kitchen equipment??? LOL
My coffee machine always finishes ahead of the toaster, and I it's a major
pain... hahaha
But then again, I miss out on all the improvisation that has to take place so I
can have something to eat while I wait for the toast. And it's the improvising
that makes my breakfasts interesting...
Thomas
Sweden
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Glenn Folkvord (JMJ FKN)
Thu
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From:
fsp@w...
Date: Wed Nov 17, 1999 6:49
am
Subject: 90's count
>From: Owens James
>
>1990 Melrose Album
>Dead Solid Perfect Soundtrack
>Destination Berlin
>Soundtrack
>1991 The Man Inside Soundtrack
>Canyon Dreams Soundtrack
>The Park Is Mine Soundtrack
>Rumpelstiltskin Soundtrack
>1992 Tyger Re-worked
>Rockoon Album
>Deadly Care Soundtrack
>The Private Music of Tangerine Dream Compilation
>1993 220 Volts Live Live
>1994 Turn of the Tides Album
>Tangents Compilation
>Catch Me If You Can Soundtrack
>1995 Tyranny of Beauty
>Album
>The Dream Mixes
>Remixes
>Zoning Soundtrack
>1996 The Dream Mixes 2CD edition
>Remixes
>Goblin's Club Album
>Dream Roots Collection Compilation
>1997 Tournado Live
>The Keep Special Edition Soundtrack
>Oasis Soundtrack
>Quinoa Extended
>Album
>Ambient Monkey
>Album
>1998 Timesquare - Dream Mixes II Album/Remixes
>Transsiberia Soundtrack
>The Dream Encores
>Live(?)
>Hollywood Years Part 1
>Soundtrack
>Hollywood Years Part 2 Soundtrack
>1999 Valentine Wheels Live
>What a Blast Soundtrack
>Mars Polaris Album
>Sohoman Live
>199? Jim & Pablo 'Der Meteor'
Well, I've got around 7 or 8 from this list and I feel I've
got enough of the 90's work. :-)
And I even don't play those 7 or 8 CDs much...
But it doesn't mean that 90s TD is bad...if you like it then
there's nothing wrong or what? It's just not for me.
Marcel
Music-page :http://home.wxs.nl/~m1engels
Email :fsp@w...
From:
'Simon Slator'
Date: Wed Nov 17, 1999 9:18
am
Subject: Re: Gamma 1 (Tribute to Tangerine Dream)
It is clear that MP3.COM are accusing me of plagiarising some pieces of
Tangerine Dream's music and using them in the song 'Gamma 1'. This message
is going out to both MP3.COM and the Tangerine Dream mailing list where the
song was first promoted.
'Gamma 1' is a song that was *spontaneously improvised* at around 9:30pm
this Monday Evening. The song is merely DEDICATED to Peter Baumann and
Tangerine Dream and expands on some of the ideas they used on such
masterpieces as 'Zeit' and 'Sequent C'.
My point is - how can there be a conflict in copyright when the song went
straight from my brain to the keyboard!? If you listen to 'Sequent C', you
will see *similarities* between the songs, but the two pieces of music are
completely exclusive of each other. 'Sequent C' is more of a random piece of
music, whereas I tried with 'Gamma' to make something a little more
structured.
Should there be any further problems regarding this song and MP3.COM, I will
pull the song out and let another MP3 host get all the downloads. Preferably
one that can tell the difference between an hobbyist musician from Dudley
and the musical mastery of Tangerine Dream.
Regards,
Simon Slator.
----- Original Message -----
From: Time
From:
Nigbur D
From:
fsp@xxx.xx
Date: Wed Nov 17, 1999 1:29
pm
Subject: okefenokee trip
>From: Vic Rek
>
>Maybe we can even make it a mini EM trade fest? Hey even better, maybe
>a few fans of EM professionals can show up and we can work a mini
>concert? Marcel/Jens - what's your schedule look like?
Would be great!
Never been to America let alone Okefenokee.
Maybe we can borrow Ken Leonard mellotron then?
We'll have to get some serious power generators! :-)
What kind of music could best be played at Okefenokee?
We'll improvise all night long!
Let's make it a magical night.
Marcel
Music-page :http://home.wxs.nl/~m1engels
Email :fsp@w...
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From:
'Roger Smith' Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 20:41:20 -0500
> From: Vic Rek
>Subject: Okefenokee trip? - A Proposition!
>
>To all TD fans and the Froeses and the great team from TDI!
>
>Well, all these responses sound exciting indeed!
>If you believe, it can happen. Let's do it!
>
>Vic
Yo Vic!
This sounds like the retreat we talked about! Count me in, especially if we
plan an overnight canoe trip to make the experience worthwhile.
The name Okefenokee comes from the Indian word Owaquaphenoga, which means
'trembling earth.' It refers to the trembling of small bushes and water
weeds that float on the lakes of the Okefenokee, which is the largest swamp
in North America.
Perhaps if our friends from Berlin join us, there might be inspiration for
more of their special music.
Splash!
Roger
From:
'joe shoults' -----Original Message-----
> From: Simon Slator [mailto:in6471@w...]
...
> 'Gamma 1' is a song that was *spontaneously improvised* at around 9:30pm
> this Monday Evening. The song is merely DEDICATED to Peter Baumann and
> Tangerine Dream and expands on some of the ideas they used on such
> masterpieces as 'Zeit' and 'Sequent C'.
From:
AslanFan1@xxx.xxx
Date: Wed Nov 17, 1999 3:23
pm
Subject: Re: Digest Number 285
Whoever wrote here that they were thinking of getting Tangram and then
changed their mind and was considering Tangram, let me encourage you to
change your mind again and get Tangram. It's quite possibly their best
release. It's unique from everything else because of its structure and
timbres. Tangram is the most beautiful 'opus' like work I think TD has done.
If I were to make a list of the essential 10 TD CDs (based on my preference
of listening, not their historical relevance, it would be:)
Ricochet
Encore
Force Majeure
Tangram
Logos
Poland
Underwater Sunlight
Melrose
220 Volts
Dream Mixes 1
As for The Keep, I have one of the original TDI releases and I would like to
say that its way overated. The mystique created by its elusiveness runs far
above the content. I used to have the Blue Moon release, which sounded like
garbage. The TDI release at least sounds much better, but the music is not
anything to write home about. As many of stated, a lot of what's on the movie
doesn't even appear here. If you want to blow $180, be my guest, but having
heard it and owned it, I can't say it would be worth it.
Alan Cox
From:
TOMX01@xxx.xxx
Date: Wed Nov 17, 1999 3:27
pm
Subject: D: Studio (Stratosfear)
1) Stratosfear
The first time I heard this CD, I think it was about the time I discovered
the other 70's virgin albums, the thing that struck me most was the very
obvious structure the piece contains when compared to the earlier works. I
suppose that this is mainly due to the absence of the eerie slow beginning
common to most TD virgin albums.
So the main sequence ends at about 8.45, then and the opening riff is
repeated and varied to fade. Overall the first track represents more a
technical growth to me rather than an artistic one. Ironically my favourite
part of this piece is the last 30 seconds of the fade.
2) The Big Sleep In Search Of Hades
For me this track doesn't really get going until about 2.30 when we return
very much to Rubycon territory only to be returned to the first part again
before the sequence could develop. Then of course it fades, shame.
3) 3 AM
A lovely opening to the piece, quite reminiscent of the opening of Ennio
Morricones score to 'Once Upon A Time In The West'. The simple sequence also
reminds me of the Peter Baumann 'Phase by Phase' piece. Ok, so just after 2
minutes things get very strange, lots of nice mellotron and then the sequence
finds the next gear.
Another delightful flute solo leads into the next progression of the
sequence. Also the
very high frequency soft hi-hat sound proves the bands development in rhythm
programming.
So 7.40 the sequence dies and the harmonica motif returns. A strange but
beautiful piece, for me the standout track on the album.
4) Invisible Limits
A similar sequence to 3 Am opens this track and soon the backing chords and
flute return to compliment it. Then at 1.39 its all starts to mesh together
to become very suddenly a very cohesive sound. 2.56 the drums are
introduced.. then bang. Almost all stop, then we slowly return and then
introduce the faster sequence.
Then in classic TD style we slowly build and build to a point where the
sequence disappears behind some strange warping sounds at around 7 minutes.
So at 8.00 the album closing begins, a very eerie water dropping type sound
cascading with other similar sounds. Then at 9.00 we get the piano, which
after all the unnatural sounds is a lovely pure way to end the album.
Overall I would have to say that I don't class this album among my favourites
from the Virgin Years. Although I have to say that after listening to it
again to write this little review it has impressed me more than I remember.
Tom (Melrose)
From:
'twosheds' Most bands only put out an album a year at
>best, and often less than that. For comparison, during the 90s, we've had
>5 from REM, 4 from U2, 5 from Madonna....TD: does anyone have a count?
>25? 26? I know Edgar is famous for his unrelenting work ethic, but
>that's just plain nutty.
Well, I will say this: about half of my TD book covers the '90s, the rest
is... everything else!
Scott
From:
'Paul Fellows' > << Luminous Visions >>
>>
>> What is this?
>>
>> Phil N.
>
>Assuming you are not kidding, it is a video of computer
>generated 'morphing' type stuff. The soundtrack is all
>TD. All of which can be found on other titles, except
>sometimes Luminious Visions gets a shorter version
>of the song.
OK, a more technical question. There are 12 tracks on the CD, but only 11
on the video; which track is missed off? This is so I can update my web
page dedicated specially to this 'recording' (I think it deserves a grander
description, but I can't think of an appropriate word at the moment):
http://perso.club-internet.fr/pfellows/webpages/luminous.html
Cheers
Paul Fellows
From:
'twosheds'
From:
Olle.Rundgren@xxx.xx
Date: Wed Nov 17, 1999 4:00
pm
Subject: Question and Keep-package comment
Not exactly TD-oriented but anyway; I'd like to know if anyone on this list
could give me some info about a group called Brain Unlimited. Heard a piece
of their work during the late hours at a party recently and it really
sounded interesting.
Regarding the many inputs on the special $180 package I can easily
understand the frustration. However I am equally annoyed by the regular
compilations with bonus-tracks. This is in no way a TD-unique phenomenon but
nevertheless ugly. Why include the bonus-tracks if not to attract the old
fans who already have everything but these tracks.
In my most loyal TD-days I felt an urge to buy the 70-80 box because of the
three bonus-tracks. More have followed, I must have 'Wahn' on at least five
different discs by know.
Nowadays I find that the quality of their output doesn't motivate the
expense for compilations but I'm sure others do, though, and for them the
situation is tougher as the they tend to appear with shorter and shorter
intervals.
However instead of blaming the group for this one must act as a clever
customer and buy the music from the source that can offer the best price.
Regardless of who the source might be. Call it right, call it wrong but that
is how the market works.
Hej svejs!
Olle
____________________________________________________________________________
___
____________________________________________________________________________
___
From:
Owens James -----Original Message-----
> From: Joel Mullen
>
> James-
> I cleaned it up a bit. How do we determine when the work
> was done? Some of the movies you list were pre-1990. What of
> that? Do we just go buy when it was available for purchase? That
> seems to be what you are doing. It makes sense because I am sure
> it took some of their time to release it even if the work for the movie
> was done previously
>
> Missing----
>
> Canyon Dreams (video)
> Three Phase (video)
> Great Wall of China (will come in just under the wire)
>
Okay, I should have included these items.
> And you talked about re-mixed, but what about re-mastered???
> What about all the official (non-promo) singles? here is the list of
> just the ones released on CD-
>
> I Just Want to Rule My Own Life Without You
> Dreamtime (CD Radio Edit w/ Vocal Version)
> Shepards Bush
> Limited World Tour Edition 1997
> Dream Dice Vol. 1-Silver Single
>
> And I know you only mentioned re-mix and new material compilations but
> they *MIGHT* have had some sort of a hand in these during the 1990's---
> (((TDI released compilations listed above)))
>
> The Private Music of T.D. ---Included in my original list
>
>
Is there any new music in any of these that's not available as part
of the Dream Roots Collection or Tangents?
>The Story of Tangerine Dream (Double)
>Atmospherics
>Book of Dreams (double)
>The Analogue Space Years 69-73 (gold) (double)
>The Best of Tangerine Dream -The Blue Years
>The Best of Tangerine Dream -The Pink Years
As I said, maybe it would be best to count individual tracks that
are new or significantly altered (not just edits - any competent sound
engineer could handle that without input from the band). The re-mixing must
have been done by TD (Orb remixes don't count.) We could list track times
for each track (in the case of edits, use the longest edit time). That way
we could get a total time of music released by TD in the 1990's, without
worrying about whether the track was on a single and without counting stuff
like the un-altered tracks on the Tyger re-mix album and Canyon Dreams
twice.
James
From:
Joel Mullen From: 'Paul Fellows'
>
> Joel,
>
> >> << Luminous Visions >>
> >>
> >> What is this?
> >>
> >> Phil N.
> >
> >Assuming you are not kidding, it is a video of computer
> >generated 'morphing' type stuff. The soundtrack is all
> >TD. All of which can be found on other titles, except
> >sometimes Luminious Visions gets a shorter version
> >of the song.
>
> OK, a more technical question. There are 12 tracks on the CD, but only 11
> on the video; which track is missed off? This is so I can update my web
> page dedicated specially to this 'recording' (I think it deserves a grander
> description, but I can't think of an appropriate word at the moment):
>
Paul-
Even though I have the VHS and the DVD and have watched it
a few times I cannot answer you question off the top of my head. It is
not as simple as 'what track' gets left off because the video is 45 minutes
long and the soundtrack is 73 minutes long if I recall correctly. There
are some shortened ones too. And all the titles of the video cuts are
different than the songs behind them. Perhaps someone else might have an
answer for you.
Regards,
Joel
From:
Owens James -----Original Message-----
> In a message dated 16-11-1999 11:04:49 PM EST, joelm@p... writes:
>
> << Luminous Visions >>
>
> What is this?
>
> Phil N.
>
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From:
Gabe Yedid From: Owens James
>
> Is this what they did at the Klangart Concert? If not, then how do you
> know?
At the concert, Gerald Gradw**l (oo? oh?) played all the guitar, much of
it in places where there is no guitar on the album versions.
> James
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: 'Patrik *'
> >
> >does anyone know who plays the guitar part
> >on 'Comets Figure Head'?
>
> > well it´s the old 'father and son'-thing, that means Edgar plays the
> > guitar
> > and Jerome is the drum-guy (mostly anyway)
Well, Jerome plays the guitar too, sometimes.
And the guitar on 'Comet's Figure Head' is, IMO, too 'clean' sounding to
be Edgar. I would believe that Edgar is playing on 'Deep Space Cruiser'
and 'Spiral Star Date'--Jerome's sound is more of a clean, keening wail,
whereas I'd describe Edgar's sound as more of a throaty howl.
All of the playing is very out of character for either of them--Jerome
sounds, for once, like he's NOT trying to keep up with the Satriani crowd,
and there are no really developed guitar lines anywhere on the album, not
even where Edgar is playing.
Gabe
From:
Gabe Yedid From: 'twosheds'
>
> What's the difference between What a Blast and Architecture in Motion? Is
> one better than the other? I still have yet to see them in a store around
> here.
>
> Scott
As far as I can tell, _WaB_ is the TDI version and contains 1 extra track,
'Stoneyard', that's not on the Miramar-released _AiM_. I'd guess the
cover art is different, too ;) (I have _WaB_)
Gabe
From:
DJS
> My point is - how can there be a conflict in copyright when the song went
> straight from my brain to the keyboard!? If you listen to 'Sequent C', you
> will see *similarities* between the songs, but the two pieces of music are
> completely exclusive of each other.
Well, you can legally use 6 notes from a song phrase (in order of
course). Any more than that and it's a copyright infringement. So,
unless you actually did swipe a good portion of the song, I see no
reason for their action. How similar is it?
--
Dan J. Schulte
Rakinik Intertype-http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Dungeon/2140/
Progressive Electronic Music
http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/12/dan_j_schulte.html
From:
Gustavo Jobim Maybe we are all caught up in ultra-high expectations towards new TD albums,
>somehow hoping for them to induce the same feelings of excitement, novelty,
>and genuine 'underground' interest in us as the older recordings did.
>However, being so familiar with TD style and history by now, this
>familiarity stands in the way of the explorer and discoverer spirit of the
>first albums we bought. I got introduced to TD through Cyclone and Lily on
>the Beach, and I have retained this novelty excitement about them despite
>their controversial reputation. Similarly, someone who got introduced to TD
>through Mars Polaris (which I think is a very good album), will probably
>feel the same way about MP.
>
>Dennis
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Sean Montgomery Well, you can legally use 6 notes from a song phrase (in order of
> course).
Is that the legal number? Wow, for a lot of dance (and, for that matter,
rock) music, 6 notes comprise a whole song.
SEAN MONTGOMERY Animator
T O P I X / Mad Dog
http://www.topix.com/~sean
From:
Sean Montgomery
From:
Owens James
From:
Gustavo Jobim
From:
Grant M Somerville
From:
Vic Rek From: Rudy Russo
>
> What are you guys planning to do at this place?
Easy: We meet at a hotel/motel in the area - then go to dinner - have a
few beers (optional for those that don't drink) - get to know each other
and talk about TD - then make a plan, which will include the 3AM swamp
visit. Now the caviat: I'm being a bit vague, because it depends on the
personalities of the crowd. I don't believe in a fixed agenda when it
come to having fun and persuing your passion. But I'm sure all involved
will have some interesting memories. Also, in terms of the fans with
families, please send me some suggestions because I believe this will
still be a family event. Vic
P.S. Let me know if you're in!
Replies
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19221
Re: Okefenokee trip?
Vic Rek
Thu
11/18/1999
1 KB
19227
Re: Okefenokee trip?
DJS
Thu
11/18/1999
2 KB
19228
Re: Okefenokee trip?
Joel Mullen
Thu
11/18/1999
1 KB
19253
Re: Okefenokee trip?
AOutland@xxx.xxx
Fri
11/19/1999
1 KB
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Re: Okefenokee trip?
Joel Mullen
Fri
11/19/1999
2 KB
19255
Re: Okefenokee trip?
DJS
Fri
11/19/1999
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Re: Okefenokee trip?
Joe Shoults
Fri
11/19/1999
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tom george
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tom george
Fri
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From:
Vic Rek This sounds like the retreat we talked about! Count me in, especially if we
> plan an overnight canoe trip to make the experience worthwhile.
Roger, you're in! Good to hear from you!
Vic
From:
Vic Rek
Date: Thu Nov 18, 1999 1:52
am
Subject: Re: okefenokee trip
> From: fsp@w...
> Would be great!
> Never been to America let alone Okefenokee.
> Maybe we can borrow Ken Leonard mellotron then?
> We'll have to get some serious power generators! :-)
> What kind of music could best be played at Okefenokee?
> We'll improvise all night long!
> Let's make it a magical night.
Hey Marcel, here's your moment! I think an EM show can be set up in a
hotel conference room or maybe a local catfish shack - who knows right
now?..
And for those that don't know Marcel... He's a great EM musician,
computer guru, and a a great person to be around in general. Marcel, I
really hope you can make it here. Atlanta or Orlando are probably the
best places to fly into. Vic
From:
Vic Rek >Maybe we can even make it a mini EM trade fest? Hey even better, maybe
> >a few fans of EM professionals can show up and we can work a mini
> >concert? Marcel/Jens - what's your schedule look like?
I feel that we should encourage an EM artist participation, but I would
like to show some up front support for any EM musicians willing to take
the chance in this event in its preliminary planning stages. So I will
make an offer that for any EM musician that would like to perform, I'll
donate $50 to their expenses. I hope that the rest of us that plan to
attend can contribute some king of donation too (no matter how small).
Vic
From:
'Glenn Folkvord (JMJ FKN)' From: PNaunton@a...
> I'm sure that with the new technology available that it is totally
>impossible to create the music the way that they did before. In days of yore,
>there was most likely 99% experimentation and free form jamming going on.
So what you are saying is that TD today are slaves of current technology? I can
understand that from listening to some of their 90s releases............
If they were any good with their equipment, they would adopt another attitude
and keep experimenting and jamming!!
This is just MHO of course.
All the best,
Glenn
From:
'Glenn Folkvord (JMJ FKN)'
From:
Quarlie@a...
Date: Thu Nov 18, 1999 3:34
am
Subject: Re: mp3 player
In a message dated 11/17/99 7:36:49 PM, Grant.Somerville@V... wrote:
>Sorry for the off topic,
>Can anyone suggest an mp3 player for the Mac other than Quicktime?
I like SoundApp. It's a little bare-bones by some standards (no 'skins' or
anything), but so far it's been enough for me. It plays other formats as well.
http://www-cs-students.stanford.edu/~franke/SoundApp/
(If I was supposed to reply off-list, then I too apologize for being off
topic.)
--Daniel (Quarlie)
NP: Savatage--the Wake of Magellan
From:
DJS
Date: Thu Nov 18, 1999 4:28
am
Subject: Re: Re: Okefenokee trip?
Vic Rek wrote:
>
> From: Vic Rek
>
> > This sounds like the retreat we talked about! Count me in, especially if we
> > plan an overnight canoe trip to make the experience worthwhile.
I'll be in Florida by then but I don't know if my wife would let me go.
;-p. She says they have signs up that say 'if you run out of gas stay in
your car'. Everyone might be eaten by alligators or suffer a fate worse
than death, confrontation with butt-hungry cajuns. Also, that's a hell
of a big swamp. How are ya gonna know where TD actually was at 3am? For
all we know they took 'fan' boats to the middle of the swamp and hung
out at some cajun shanty. Well, Eli wants me to go to take pictures
either way for his wallet so count me in if we're settled by then.
--
Dan J. Schulte
Rakinik Intertype-http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Dungeon/2140/
Progressive Electronic Music
http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/12/dan_j_schulte.html
From:
Joel Mullen
Date: Thu Nov 18, 1999 5:06
am
Subject: RE: Re: Okefenokee trip?
On Wednesday, November 17, 1999 10:28 PM, DJS [SMTP:rakinik@g...] wrote:
> From: DJS
> I'll be in Florida by then but I don't know if my wife would let me go.
> ;-p. She says they have signs up that say 'if you run out of gas stay in
> your car'. Everyone might be eaten by alligators or suffer a fate worse
> than death, confrontation with butt-hungry cajuns.
True, check out the 'The Alligator Forecast' page of the Okefenokee hompage.
http://www.okefenokee.com/gators.htm
Take a look at the Canoe trails! Yikes!
Joel
From:
PNaunton@a...
Date: Thu Nov 18, 1999 5:29
am
Subject: Never Trust Anyone Over Thirty!!
In a message dated 17-11-1999 10:23:34 AM EST, AslanFan1@a... writes:
<< As for The Keep, I have one of the original TDI releases and I would like
to
say that its way overated. The mystique created by its elusiveness runs far
above the content. I used to have the Blue Moon release, which sounded like
garbage. The TDI release at least sounds much better, but the music is not
anything to write home about. As many of stated, a lot of what's on the
movie
doesn't even appear here. If you want to blow $180, be my guest, but having
heard it and owned it, I can't say it would be worth it.
Alan Cox >>
The movie is also overrated. Michael Mann or not. It is a grade C
occult/horror flick at best. Bad acting, bad special effects, bad content,
bad thematic line, bad editing. It's not even horrible enough to be camp,
unfortunately.
When I first heard the TD 'KEEP' theme in the soundtrack, it was
mired down in noise and bad mixing, but I knew it was TD. I thought,
initially that is was sampled from some old TD albums, but I was shocked to
find that it was commissioned. I still am shocked. I think that this is the
worst TD effort at a soundtrack that I have ever heard; bar none.
Just another fool's opinion. Take it for what it is worth. I'm still
kicking myself in the A$$ for buying the Blue Moon version. Never again.
Completist or not, I think this is a travesty, and the bucks stop here.
I think that they (whoever 'they' are) could have done a really good
job with a really Special set of limited recordings as a Jubilee issue for a
few hundred bucks. Fandom in general would have liked to see the Millennium
go out with some meaning attached to it instead of repackaged, recycled
garbage as a memento.
Maybe it's not too late. How about it Edgar? Jerome? Anyone? Someone?
Phil N.
From:
'Thomas'
Date: Thu Nov 18, 1999 5:52
am
Subject: SV: Blue Years
>From: Gustavo Jobim
>
>I want to explore the pre-Phaedra albums - I know, it's a little strange -
>but is the 'Analogue Space Years 1969-1973' the best way to do this? Or
>should I buy all five albums?
>
>pre-thanks
>gfj
Gustavo,
the Pink Years (note: pre 'Phaedra' is called the Pink Years) are strange, but
nontheless the records released contain some wonderful stuff. If you're looking
at 'The Analogue Space Years 1969-1973', I would have to say it's a good place
to start, if you decide you really like the stuff you can always buy more some
day. It does serve as a nice introduction to the music of 'The Pink Years', but
is not entirely complete. Buying all five albums is of course more expensive.
But buying 'The Analogue Space Years 1969-1973' would make you miss out on the
wonderful fourpiece 'Zeit' which really needs to be heard in it's entirety. I
suppose it's up to you to decide, these are just my thoughts. The tracklisting
is as follows:
Disc 1
04,00 - Ashes to Ashes (Electronic Meditation)
17,00 - Zeit (Zeit)
20,24 - Atem (Atem)
19,27 - Green Desert (Green Desert)
05,56 - Genesis (Electronic Meditation)
Disc 2
22,04 - Alpha Centauri (Alpha Centauri)
07,07 - Astral Voyager (Green Desert)
04,30 - Wahn (Atem)
05,51 - Circulation of Events (Atem)
17,49 - Nebulous Dawn (Zeit)
So it has about two tracks from each album, and it covers the entire period
that way (except for the 7'single 'Ultima Thule). Good luck in your hunting!!!
Cheers,
Thomas
Sweden
From:
Steven Feldman Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:29:14 EST
>Subject: Re: [tadream] Never Trust Anyone Over Thirty!!
>From: Tangerine Dream mailing list
>Really-From: PNaunton@a...
>
>In a message dated 17-11-1999 10:23:34 AM EST, AslanFan1@a... writes:
>
>>As for The Keep, I have one of the original TDI releases and I would
>>like to say that its way overated. [. . .]
The TDI release isn't rated very highly by very many people.
As for the film itself, most critics rate it a BOMB.
>>[. . .] The mystique created by its elusiveness runs far above the
>>content. I used to have the Blue Moon release, which sounded like
>>garbage. The TDI release at least sounds much better, but the music is
>>not anything to write home about. [. . .]
Well, only the two-minute version of 'Theme from the Snowman' is
on the Blue Moon CD, after all.
> The movie is also overrated. [. . .]
By who? Tangerine Dream fans? Except for fans of the HIGHLANDER
series, this film doesn't have too many fans outside of TD-dom. In
fact, it doesn't even rate as highly as BLADE RUNNER, which I think is
probably the most overrated film since STAR WARS (any/all of them).
>[. . .] Michael Mann or not. [. . .]
Except for THIEF, what has he done that's really so all-fired good,
anyways? LAST OF THE MOHICANS was okay, but HEAT was pretty lame.
>[. . .] It is a grade C occult/horror flick at best. [. . .]
I dunno. It has some pretty outstanding visuals, in places.
>[. . . ] Bad acting [. . .]
Sir Ian McKellan recently got an Oscar for GODS AND MONSTERS, so
he can't suck *too* badly. And Jurgen Prochnow is never less than
excellent no matter what he's in. And Robert Prosky is always good.
And when did Gabriel Byrne ever do a bad job? As for Scott Glenn --
he was *supposed* to play an inscrutable, zombie-like guy.
>[. . . ] bad special effects [. . .]
?!? The scene where we see smoke seeping into Molasar's face,
in between his glowing red eyes, is one of the coolest things *I've*
ever seen in a film.
>[. . . ] bad content, bad thematic line [. . .]
Sorry, but among my favorite fantasy characters are Elric of
Melnibone and Nemesis the Warlock -- so I disagree.
> When I first heard the TD 'KEEP' theme in the soundtrack, it was
>mired down in noise and bad mixing, but I knew it was TD. I thought,
>initially that is was sampled from some old TD albums, but I was
>shocked to find that it was commissioned. I still am shocked. I think
>that this is the worst TD effort at a soundtrack that I have ever heard;
>bar none.
What, you like DEADLY CARE, CATCH ME IF YOU CAN, ZONING and
TRANSSIBERIA that much? ;)
-- Steven Feldman
Replies
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Yahoo! ID
Date
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19233
Re: THE KEEP 'is Overrated'? By Whom?
DJS
Thu
11/18/1999
1 KB
From:
Steven Feldman
From:
DJS >that this is the worst TD effort at a soundtrack that I have ever heard;
> >bar none.
Stevo replied:
> What, you like DEADLY CARE, CATCH ME IF YOU CAN, ZONING and
> TRANSSIBERIA that much? ;)
Wow, great selection of horrendous TD OSTs Steve. I don't think any
serious TD fans can disagree with that! The Keep worse than Deadly Care?
Sure, & 8-track tapes will make a huge comeback.
--
Dan J. Schulte
Rakinik Intertype-http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Dungeon/2140/
Progressive Electronic Music
http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/12/dan_j_schulte.html
From:
Steven Feldman
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Date
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19235
Re: MARS POLARIS better than WHAT A BLAST? You b
Heiko Heerßen
Thu
11/18/1999
2 KB
From:
'Heiko Heerßen' WHOOP, WHOOP, WHOOP: FLAMEBAIT ALERT! DUCK AND COVER!
Too late!
> Okay, it seems that -- much like the case of OASIS and TIMESQUARE
> (where OASIS had only one great track, and TIMESQUARE had only one weak
> track) -- WHAT A BLAST has only one great track ('Art of Destruction'),
> while MARS POLARIS has only one weak track ('Dies Martis'). Can I truly
> be the only one here who feels this way?
What?!! x%$&§!!grrr....
Oasis has NO weak tracks....are you trying to insult me? ;-)
Timesquare is great, I have to agree there with you..
What a blast has only one great track..are we talking of the same album here?
Mars Polaris has only one weak track....o.k., I'm not really fond of the last 2
tracks to be honest. But the rest is great.
Heiko
From:
'Simon Slater'
From:
'Yensen, Stephen' >
I didn't actually. I've been offered 70 UKP tops (about US $114).
Any more offers? If I there is no more interest then I'll close the
deal on Monday of next week.
The reason why I'm selling this is that I need the money and so
I'm selling the only thing that has any real value ... putting it in
another way I can triple my car's value by sitting in the driver's
seat with the CD in my pocket ...!
;-)
Cheers,
Steve.
============ STEVE YENSEN ===============
Home: syensen@i...
http://www.innotts.co.uk/~syensen/
(the internet in nottingham)
Work: Stephen.Yensen@s...
(Siemens Communications)
No animals were harmed in the production and
transmission of this e-mail ...
From:
'twosheds'
From:
'twosheds'
From:
Steven Feldman
Replies
Name/Email
Yahoo! ID
Date
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19241
Re: Node - What is Their Total Output?
Poulton, Larry
Thu
11/18/1999
2 KB
From:
'Poulton, Larry'
Hi,
Does anyone here have a discography for this band? I have their
self-titled CD and the EMMA I & II LIVE CD that has one track of theirs,
but other than the TERMINUS EP, I am not sure what else they've done.
-- Steven Feldman
Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing original
messages in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed from this list), send
a blank e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
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From:
'joe shoults' -----Original Message-----
> From: twosheds [mailto:twosheds@g...]
...
> Here's more info:
> http://www.gorp.com/gorp/resource/us_nwr/ga_okefe.htm
>
> Scott
>
From:
'joe shoults' -----Original Message-----
> From: Steven Feldman [mailto:AR402004@B...]
...
> I just heard an ad (I was typing online and didn't turn to look until I
> recognized the music style) on the Weather Channel cable channel for
> something called 'Web MD.' The music was much like on CANYON DREAMS and
> THE KEEP, and some other TD recordings. Could it be that TD did the
> music for this ad, or did some TD imitator do it???
From:
Glenn Reinicke From: PNaunton@a...
>I think that they (whoever 'they' are) could have done a really
good job with a really Special set of limited recordings as a Jubilee issue
for a few hundred bucks. >fandom in general would have liked to see the
Millennium go out with some meaning attached to it instead of repackaged,
recycled garbage as a memento.
>
My workload has finally lessened for the moment so I can actually
participate again on the list again. The above post excerpt runs along the
lines of something I've been thinking about for some time. I'm a relative
newcomer to Klaus Schulze's work and after acquiring some of his best CDs
and looking over the web site, there's some stark differences to how he
approaches his fans vs. TDI. It also seems that Klaus is into churning out
tons of material and makes it available to his fans at reasonable prices.
I'm not sure about past history on his part but it seems he treats his fans
a bit better than TD. Maybe some comments from the hardcore Schulze fans on
this would be interesting.
As far as X-mas special, I read it, I laughed, I was bummed that the
stuff they said would be released wasn't going to be, I put my wallet away
and that was that. Bidness as usual for the TDI group. It didn't surprise me
in the least. What would surprise me is the following: (are you reading,
TDI?)
A box set from TD that had, say, double CDs of all the Virgin Years
tours. The box set could be made up of the 1974 tour with the some of the
Reims Cathedral show, a 75, 76, 77, 78, 80, 81, 82, and 86 CDs with maybe
the last CD having excerpts from Franke farewell concert in Berlin in 87.
Maybe throw in a bonus disk of unreleased studio material (Antique Dreams??)
call it the Anorak Years or something and charge around $200US for it.
Include a nice picture book of tour photos similar in quality to the book in
Tangents, and don't even think about cutting, pasting, adding drum loops or
tangentizing the heck out of the music.
My chin would hit the floor and my credit card would immediately
make an appearance. Until then, I'd rather support other musicians than fill
the shelves with yet another TD soundtrack. I'm sad to say that Wall of
China will be the first TD work in close to 20 years of support that I'm
passing on. Still love TD, still listen to all their stuff, just not very
enthused about anymore soundtracks.
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Date
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19246
Re: TDI vs Schulze
Radu Velicescu
Thu
11/18/1999
2 KB
19247
Re: TDI vs Schulze
Marcel Engels
Thu
11/18/1999
2 KB
19266
Re: TDI vs Schulze
Heiko Heerßen
Fri
11/19/1999
2 KB
19274
Re: TDI vs Schulze
Bert.Hulshoff@xx.xxx.xx
Fri
11/19/1999
3 KB
19276
Re: TDI vs Schulze
Craig Chambers
Thu
11/18/1999
1 KB
From:
craig.cordrey@xxxx.xxx
Date: Thu Nov 18, 1999 5:00
pm
Subject: Re: Blue Years
>From: Gustavo Jobim
>
>I want to explore the pre-Phaedra albums - I know, it's a little strange -
>but is the 'Analogue Space Years 1969-1973' the best way to do this? Or
>should I buy all five albums?
I think this is the best Pink Years (not Blue Years - that's 1984 to 1987)
compilation I have heard. It has full versions of the tracks it includes, not
just misleading excerpts. It still leans quite heavily toward Green Desert
(perhaps the most 'melodic' of the pre-Virgin albums), but offers a good view
of the early work.
Go for it,
--------------------------------------------------------------
Craig R. J. Cordrey craig.cordrey@g...
Senior Software Engineer 01383 828187
Alenia Marconi Systems
Integrated Systems Division
Donibristle, Fife, Scotland
--------------------------------------------------------------
From:
Radu Velicescu A box set from TD that had, say, double CDs of all the Virgin Years
> tours. The box set could be made up of the 1974 tour with the some of the
> Reims Cathedral show, a 75, 76, 77, 78, 80, 81, 82, and 86 CDs with maybe
> the last CD having excerpts from Franke farewell concert in Berlin in 87.
> Maybe throw in a bonus disk of unreleased studio material (Antique Dreams??)
> call it the Anorak Years or something and charge around $200US for it.
> Include a nice picture book of tour photos similar in quality to the book in
> Tangents, and don't even think about cutting, pasting, adding drum loops or
> tangentizing the heck out of the music.
WOW!! Now THAT would be a Millennium Booster! Not the K**p package we're
presented with. Klaus Schulze seems more interested in making his music
available, TDI seems to be more interested in profit. Obviously both are
also in this for profit but I would definitely drop my credit cards in a
flash if the above set would be available. Heck, I'd even pay $300, maybe
even more. Besides, with the 1974, 75 & 76 concerts there were no real
already released songs being played live, there would be no copyright
issues (would there?).
Such a set would be the biggest Tangerine Dream of all, sadly it may never
come through. At the rate of one 'vintage' concert a year, and that one
tangentized, who knows... Bravo to KS for making his music available,
it's a good feeling to support him. Sorry to say the opposite about
TDI...
Radu
np - Glasgow 1974
From:
'Marcel Engels'
Date: Thu Nov 18, 1999 7:28
pm
Subject: RE: TDI vs Schulze
> From: Glenn Reinicke
>
> A box set from TD that had, say, double CDs of all the Virgin Years
> tours. The box set could be made up of the 1974 tour with the some of the
> Reims Cathedral show, a 75, 76, 77, 78, 80, 81, 82, and 86 CDs with maybe
> the last CD having excerpts from Franke farewell concert in Berlin in 87.
> Maybe throw in a bonus disk of unreleased studio material
> (Antique Dreams??)
> call it the Anorak Years or something and charge around $200US for it.
> Include a nice picture book of tour photos similar in quality to
> the book in
> Tangents, and don't even think about cutting, pasting, adding
> drum loops or
> tangentizing the heck out of the music.
>
> My chin would hit the floor and my credit card would immediately
> make an appearance. Until then, I'd rather support other
> musicians than fill
> the shelves with yet another TD soundtrack. I'm sad to say that Wall of
> China will be the first TD work in close to 20 years of support that I'm
> passing on. Still love TD, still listen to all their stuff, just not very
> enthused about anymore soundtracks.
Exactly!
Now that would be a perfect Xmas gift!!!
But it will probably never happen...or does it?
Imagine having good quality CDs instead of bad tapes/CDRs etc...
Marcel
Music-page :http://home.wxs.nl/~m1engels
Email :fsp@w...
From:
'Carl & Jacqui Kearney'
Date: Thu Nov 18, 1999 8:42
pm
Subject: Re: Re: Gamma 1 (Tribute to Tangerine Dream)
----- Original Message -----
From: Simon Slator
To: Time
From:
'Lawry Simm'
Date: Thu Nov 18, 1999 10:01
pm
Subject: D: [Studio] Stratosfear
Do I get the prize for the most tardy review? :-)
Stratosfear (1976)
1. Stratosfear
2. The big sleep in search of Hades
3. 3am at the border of the marsh from Okefenokee
4. Invisible Limits
As I like to note such things, the recording credits are
Franke/Froese/Baumann - implying that this album is mainly Chris' work
(even the personnel are listed in this order - Edgar taking a back
seat for a change?). Given the excellent sequencer segments, and the
fact that they drive the whole album along, this isn't too hard to
believe.
The gearlist (one of the things I miss with the new albums.. no
gearlists) shows
Franke: moog synthesizer, organ, percussion, loop mellotron,
harpsichord
Froese: mellotron, moog synthesizer, twelve and six string guitar,
grand piano, bass, guitar, mouth organ
Baumann: moog synthesizer, project electronic rhythm computer, fender
e piano, mellotron
Some people say that gear lists serve no purpose. I love them. You
see, it lets me know sometimes, who plays what. Is this important?
Well, I don't know, but I do like being able to attribute certain
phrases and licks with individual musicians. Easy to do a rock band..
Fred plays drums, Joe plays bass, Harry plays rhythm guitar, Tom plays
lead guitar, Dick sings... etc etc... not so simple with the sort of
music that TD play, where all members use primarily synths. At least
knowing some of the parts origins helps me understand each of the guys
a bit better (especially as I have no Franke or Baumann solo works to
compare styles with).
Being so late with my review, pretty much everything has been said
that can be said about this music. It's been analysed from all angles.
Nonetheless, I'm still going to bore you with mine! :-)
Stratosfear - A lovely picked guitar intro, with choral string sounds
over it drift us shortly but sweetly to the relentless bass sequence
that makes this track what it is. A humdinger of a classic! A great
selection of sounds (both melody and rhythm) and a great mix. This is
my personal favourite style of composition in EM. A very short intro
to a faded up sequence, which batters on forever! I'm not very keen
on those dragged out 30 minutes of ambience before a sequence starts
style of track that pops up all the time these days. Development my
arse. Lets just get in there and rock! I do find that the timing is a
little off in places, but that's great too... so much better than the
regulated 'no chance of a note out of place' computerised tosh that is
churned out so many times these days (not that I dislike all of the
recent TD output, nor do I think computers shouldn't have a very
prominent place in composition). I just love the 'rolling' notes
within the sequences.. a very effective trick, and one that adds great
interest to the track for me by it's very randomness. A solid 5AS for
this track.
The Big Sleep In Search Of Hades - I can't listen to this song without
hearing the reggae version in my mind from that midi file that one of
our listmembers created (still here?) with band in a box. (It's
great - it should still be on www.thisolehouse.freeserve.co.uk/midi if
you wish to download it...! ). Still, back to the original, and the
start of this track is probably the most intricate stuff so far from
TD, simple arpeggios on the harpsichord, but a very animated melody
with the flute sound. This is a great start, but I'm afraid I don't
like the segment that arrives all too soon after just one minute. It
just breaks the flow and beauty created by the opening. Things take a
great turn for the better at around 2:30 when the loud irritating
chords have taken a break, and at 3:25 when the 'intro' is replayed
the change is so dramatic that given the 1 second break between the
segments, you would believe was an entirely different track. A 4AS for
the intro / outro, and a 2AS for the middle section.
3am At The Border Of The Marsh From Okefenokee - Strange to hear a gob
iron in electronic music, especially in the mid seventies I would
assume. However, I think it does help create the right atmosphere of a
swamp in the dark... though it also brings up visions of Lee Van Cleef
and Clint Eastwood to me... from the 2 minute mark, this track becomes
very dark and oppressive temporarily, until the slow bass sequence,
and bass melody take over, at which point it becomes a chill out stomp
fest (tm). Great mellotron flute work. This is another track by TD
that could be said to have an almost military march feel to it. The
electric piano bit at about 4:52 is sublime... such a contrast to the
other sounds in the track. Masterful composition. And at 5:25, the
greatest sound ever heard echoes and 'delays' its way repetitively
into your brain. A much more raw and distorted electric piano at
around 6:08 gives a brief, rocky contrast to the slow, wispy melody.
I think this track would have benefited from not having the harmonica
reprise at the end. I think everything before this had been enough.
Still, a 4AS (would have been a five without the oppressive section
and the reprise).
Invisible Limits - The sounds that come into the background on this
track at about the 1:43 mark (and come more to the front thanks to a
change in the filter shortly after the 2 minute mark - you know the
one... the little plinky plonky sound) is the highlight of the track
for me. I could just sit there with this segment on repeat, making
plinky plonky noises myself with my mouth (here they are again at 3:57
but a bit more frantic now). The guitar line that arrives now is for
the main part amateurish to my ears apart from the odd little lick
that sneaks in now and again. I sounds as though Ed wasn't really
comfortable playing the notes... maybe it was improvised at the
recording session, which would explain the hesitancy some times, and
is certain possible. It's now at 5:15 and we are cooking with gas! I
defy anyone that hasn't yet slipped off their mortal coil to not start
drumming along on the desk to this rhythm. Too bad it only lasts for a
couple of minutes though, I'd like to hear a good, live, everyone
jamming 20 minute version of this part! The ending of the track on
grand piano (Edgar)doesn't really seem to fit with the rest of the
track. Though, it is quite nice. It certainly shows off Edgar's
talents as a pianist (I used to dismiss Ed's piano skills in deference
to Paul's and Johannes, but he shows here that he _can_play. More
mellotron flute (wonder why they stopped using a real one) makes for a
'different' ending to a quite sequence driven and rocky album. 4AS
Overall, this is probably in my top 10 TD albums, probably not in my
top 5, but a solid 4AS
Next Stop - Encore!
Regards,
Lawry
lawrysimm@u...
ICQ # 23267226
Instant Messenger - lawrysimm
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Gustavo Jobim
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From:
'Jens Peschke' From: Vic Rek
>
>Maybe we can even make it a mini EM trade fest? Hey even better, maybe
>a few fans of EM professionals can show up and we can work a mini
>concert? Marcel/Jens - what's your schedule look like?
I'd love coming over but my schedule doesn't look too good, sadly.
I'll be staying in northern Denmark for two weeks in April,
March will be the Alfa2000 festival incl. Mind~Flux, my fave group of the
90s.
Then there's the Jodrell Bank gig in England we'll be playing in
May, which needs some preparation as well. Not forgetting my day job,
I'll be running a huge projects in 2000 between all those holiday and
musical activities. ;-)
It's a question of time on my side. Sorry but it looks I've to pass on the
trip.
Hey, should I block a week in April 2001 ? I still haven't visited Andrew I
promised
a while ago. Not forgetting the parts of my family living in the USA.
Anyway, hope you enjoy the trip! :-) I'm sure it will happen as you're
organizing it, Vic. :-)
Best Regards
Jens
From:
Vic Rek
From:
Vic Rek Anyway, hope you enjoy the trip! :-) I'm sure it will happen as you're
> organizing it, Vic. :-)
Yes, it will happen - I will (I'll) even jepordize my new promotion to
make it happen. We all take a chance to participate in the experience
(whatever it will be). This is an event that we'll meet at..., most
likely party, and have every individual TD fan enjoy their experience in
their own special way...
I hope somebody knows how to take good videos of 'fan' events. Vic
From:
AOutland@xxx.xxx
Date: Fri Nov 19, 1999 2:11
am
Subject: Re: Re: Okefenokee trip?
In a message dated 11/17/99 11:24:45 PM Eastern Standard Time,
rakinik@g... writes: Dano:
<< Everyone might be eaten by alligators or suffer a fate worse
than death, confrontation with butt-hungry cajuns. >>
ROFL, you are in the wrong swamp, darlin'. Cajuns are in Louisiana. We
are speaking of the great Okeefenokee where most of the gators are either
behind cages in gator farms or so far back in the swamp, you may never see
one. The only thing you're going to be eaten by is the mosquitoes, which are
so large they may feel like a gator chomping on your ass. 8-) Dell
From:
Joel Mullen From: AOutland@a...
>
> In a message dated 11/17/99 11:24:45 PM Eastern Standard Time,
> rakinik@g... writes: Dano:
>
> << Everyone might be eaten by alligators or suffer a fate worse
> than death, confrontation with butt-hungry cajuns. >>
> ROFL, you are in the wrong swamp, darlin'. Cajuns are in Louisiana. We
> are speaking of the great Okeefenokee where most of the gators are either
> behind cages in gator farms or so far back in the swamp, you may never see
> one. The only thing you're going to be eaten by is the mosquitoes, which are
> so large they may feel like a gator chomping on your ass. 8-) Dell
Wrong!
http://www.okefenokee.com/gators.htm
It will add to the excitement!
From:
DJS
> From: AOutland@a...
>
> In a message dated 11/17/99 11:24:45 PM Eastern Standard Time,
> rakinik@g... writes: Dano:
>
> << Everyone might be eaten by alligators or suffer a fate worse
> than death, confrontation with butt-hungry cajuns. >>
> ROFL, you are in the wrong swamp, darlin'.
Heh, I know but after you watch the movie Southern Comfort it's fun to
fantisize the adventure of escape! Ever since that film I've always
associated Cajun's with swamps. Damn those films influencing
stereotypes!
Cajuns are in Louisiana. We
> are speaking of the great Okeefenokee where most of the gators are either
> behind cages in gator farms or so far back in the swamp, you may never see
> one. The only thing you're going to be eaten by is the mosquitoes, which are
> so large they may feel like a gator chomping on your ass. 8-) Dell
Well, make sure Vic springs for the Bug-Off, heh.
--
Dan J. Schulte
Rakinik Intertype-http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Dungeon/2140/
Progressive Electronic Music
http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/12/dan_j_schulte.html
From:
'Joe Shoults' are speaking of the great Okeefenokee where most of the gators are either
> behind cages in gator farms or so far back in the swamp, you may never see
> one. The only thing you're going to be eaten by is the mosquitoes, which
are
> so large they may feel like a gator chomping on your ass. 8-) Dell
...
From:
'Andrew J. Rozsa' From: 'Jens Peschke'
[........]
>It's a question of time on my side. Sorry but it looks I've to pass on the
>trip.
>Hey, should I block a week in April 2001 ? I still haven't visited Andrew I
>promised
>a while ago. Not forgetting the parts of my family living in the USA.
>
[......]
:-(( I sure was hoping that this will be the thing to get you over here...
but, if, instead your going to make beautiful music like my lil'
'Kubusschnitt' treasure, by all means, carry on. Priorities. :-)
You will be with us in spirit and we are gonna raise a stein of good German
beer to your health.
Warm regards,
Andrew
From:
'tom george' Heh, I know but after you watch the movie Southern Comfort it's fun to
>fantisize the adventure of escape! Ever since that film I've always
>associated Cajun's with swamps. Damn those films influencing
>stereotypes!
Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com
From:
'tom george' From: 'Joe Shoults'
>
>has anybody actually watched Shy People? I saw it in the store, but haven't
>rented it yet. It's about cajuns, right? (too lazy to go to imdb.com to
>look it up)
Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com
From:
'tom george' From: 'Andrew J. Rozsa'
>
>At 23:20 4/18/00 +0200, Jens wrote:
>>From: 'Jens Peschke'
>
where can i get this Kubusschnitt i keep hearing about? if it's that good i
must have it. tom
>
>:-(( I sure was hoping that this will be the thing to get you over here...
>but, if, instead your going to make beautiful music like my lil'
>'Kubusschnitt' treasure, by all means, carry on. Priorities. :-)
>
>You will be with us in spirit and we are gonna raise a stein of good German
>beer to your health.
>
>Warm regards,
>
>Andrew
>
>>Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing original messages
in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed from this list), send a blank
e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
>Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
>
>
Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com
From:
jwhite@s...
Date: Fri Nov 19, 1999 5:41
am
Subject: Misc.
OK, I'm posting this from the Web because I just subscribed to the 'Web'-only
version of this list to take a quick look at the archives, and found that there
was too much stuff I wanted to respond to for me to remain 'off' the list
completely right this moment. (Did that make any sense?) Anyway, here are the
things I wanted to say:
A. Regarding the guitar on Comet's Figure Head and other tracks on MP, I'm
almost totally positive it's all synths. I've have some experience with synths,
so I can usually tell a synth instrument from a real one. Listen to the attack.
A real guitar's attack would be slightly varied on each note, whereas the
guitar on MP sounds pretty uniform. Also, the pitch bends sound pretty 'synthy'
to me, not like a real guitar. However, overall, I think they did an
*excellent* job of making a good synth guitar, if it really is a synth. It's
actually pretty hard to tell!
B. Dan J. Schulte wrote in response to Scott (twosheds):
<< Just go to MP3.com and surf around the electronic genre. You'll find
lots of great artists there. Why, someone just posted a cover of
Monolight last week there & it was better than anything I've heard from
TD in a long time. Many of these artists have cds available through
their labels or if you really know what's going on you can order a DAM
cd. >>
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Don't get me started!!! This is one of the
funniest things I've heard in a LONG time, and I've heard some pretty funny
things! I don't want to offend those few good musicians here on this list and
elsewhere who are on MP3.com, but that site has gotta be one of the biggest
cess pools of CRAP posing as music I've ever come across! What a huge pile of
JUNK!!! Granted, there's a lot there I haven't listened to, but most of it is
so awful I can't stand wading through it. Craig Padilla, our own Simon Slater,
and a very few other people on there are good, but the rest of it I don't even
want to think about! And I've heard that version of Monolight. It's a joke! The
melodies are completely wrong! I can't BELIEVE that you, a so-called hardcore
TD fan, would even contemplate posting a message to this list saying that
that's better than anything TD's put out in a long time!
You can say you don't like TD's recent output, and I'll be OK with that. But
when I actually read someone saying Timesquare, or AiM, or MP isn't as good as
a lot of stuff on MP3.com, I see RED!!! DONT'T CONFUSE OPINION WITH FACT! (Yes,
Gabe, you *can* discuss music objectively!)
Sorry, I didn't mean to get this emotional, but I'm like practically in a state
of shock here! You shouldn't have mentioned MP3.com!!! :)
I may jump in from time to time if I see something interesting in the archives,
but basically I won't be subscribed to this list in e-mail form. If you really
want me to see something, it would probably be best to CC to me personally or
just write me privately.
OK, take care folks....
Jared
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jwhite@xxxxx.xxx
Fri
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From:
DJS
Date: Fri Nov 19, 1999 6:20
am
Subject: Re: Re: Okefenokee trip?
Joe Shoults wrote:
>
> From: 'Joe Shoults'
>
> has anybody actually watched Shy People? I saw it in the store, but haven't
> rented it yet. It's about cajuns, right? (too lazy to go to imdb.com to
> look it up)
> -joe
No no Joe, go rent Southern Comfort. ;-p
--
Dan J. Schulte
Rakinik Intertype-http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Dungeon/2140/
Progressive Electronic Music
http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/12/dan_j_schulte.html
From:
'Andrew J. Rozsa'
Date: Fri Nov 19, 1999 6:13
am
Subject: Re: Shopping for E-music [was: okefenokee trip]
At 00:23 11/19/99 -0500, tom wrote:
>From: 'tom george'
[...]
>where can i get this Kubusschnitt i keep hearing about? if it's that good
i must have it. tom
Like much of the electronic music created by some wonderfully talented
musicians who have taken up the genre where some others left it [snicker]
there are many sites that will feed your hunger.....
My personal preference is Groove in Netherlands (Ron Boots and Kees Aerts
run it... terrific e-musicians themselves): http://www.groove.nl/ where the
'The Case' is available for $15.95
But I would be remiss if I didn't mention a site run by yet another of the
readers of this list (David Law), in England - Neu Harmony's 'The Synth
Music Direct' at: http://www.neuharm.demon.co.uk/index.htm (the price for
the CDR is $21.48)
If anyone is curios, I wrote a little piece with commentaries about
shopping for e-music from the US... it's a bit dated (a year or so), but
you may find it useful anyway (see 'GoldTri Guide'). A totally awesome list
of ordering by mail-order is D. Evans' 'Online Music Sources' link. Both
are on the E-Prog site's link page: http://www.e-prog.net/links.htm
There is so much excellent e-music out there...no reason to settle for
left-overs. Honest.
As a minor aside... some of the newbies may not know that among us, on this
list and on the Beyond_EM list, dozens of incredible musicians lurk and
produce wonderful sounds. Betcha Dano's 'Nominal Gain' will knock the socks
off of many of you. He is too modest to brag. Ask him.... (oh, BTW, under
no circumstance are you to ask him about or even mention the words: ''Till
All Are One,' TF:TM,' Vince DiCola, or BotCon '97...or any years, as a
matter of fact).
If you feel venturesome, ask around and see if anyone is willing to burn
you a copy of either volume of the (by now probably defunct -- oh, RIP)
GoldTri compilations.
BTW...y'all are warned...do not...I repeat....DO NOT venture and start
looking around the E-Prog site... don't read the reviews of the bands....
or follow the links to music bytes... lest you should fall into the grip of
e-prog mania and end up poor.... like so many of us....
How is all this related to TD? Well, many years ago, they were the pioneers
of the genre. That's how. (How's that for an oblique dig?)
Andrew
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From:
DJS
Date: Fri Nov 19, 1999 6:22
am
Subject: Re: okefenokee trip
'Andrew J. Rozsa' wrote:
>
> From: 'Andrew J. Rozsa'
>
> >
> You will be with us in spirit and we are gonna raise a stein of good German
> beer to your health.
If you don't mind Jens, I'll raise a mexican beer to you, cuz that's all
I drink. But it's okay though because Dos Equis was actually brewed &
founded by a German in Mexico anyway.
--
Dan J. Schulte
Rakinik Intertype-http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Dungeon/2140/
Progressive Electronic Music
http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/12/dan_j_schulte.html
From:
DJS
Date: Fri Nov 19, 1999 6:55
am
Subject: Re: Misc.
jwhite@s... wrote:
>Many of these artists have cds available through
> their labels or if you really know what's going on you can order a DAM
> cd. >>
>
> HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Don't get me started!!!
Why not, it's what I do best. ;-)
This is one of the funniest things I've heard in a LONG time, and I've
heard some pretty funny things!
Cool, I'm thinking of doing some comedic circuits when I move to
Florida. Hey Duncan, any good laugh factorys there?
I don't want to offend those few good musicians here on this list
Er, too late.
What a huge pile of JUNK!!! Granted, there's a lot there I haven't
listened to, but most of it is so awful I can't stand wading through it.
Do you know how to use a search engine? Put in Tangerine Dream & you'll
see hundreds of artists inspired by or creating music in that vein. Of
course, with your 150mhz comp you probably get impatient waiting for the
downloads. I'd give up too & slam everything I hadn't heard.
Craig Padilla, our own Simon Slater, and a very few other people on
there are good, but the rest of it I don't even want to think about! And
I've heard that version of Monolight. It's a joke!
Well, I'd love to see what you can do with a synth or even a piano.
Actually, I don't think I would.
The melodies are completely wrong! I can't BELIEVE that you, a
so-called hardcore TD fan, would even contemplate posting a message to
this list saying that that's better than anything TD's put out in a long
time!
A cover doesn't have to follow note for note & I admire his effort &
talent. Also, I'm not a so-called fan. I've been listening to them since
1983 (technically before, I just didn't know who it was). So who are
you? Some teen who doesn't know what Robert Moog is famous for? I was
part of the TDIFC (know what that stands for fanboy?), joined BTH when
it started up & before they became a label, I've seen them on several
tours, became part of Dave's Tadream when people were still forced to
pay hourly rates on AOL and have consistantly composed & produced EM
with inspirational roots from what I believe to be the best EM band in
the world (last 9 years output aside). It is not I that is a so-called
fan, it is you. I don't like their new stuff, but I still like them as
people AND I highly respect them as historic pioneers of EM.
> Sorry, I didn't mean to get this emotional, but I'm like practically in a
state of shock here! You shouldn't have mentioned MP3.com!!! :)
Calm down dude. What will the next magic word be that inspires you to
pinch a loaf and wet yourself? Give me a list, I'll try to avoid saying
them.
Dano
--
Dan J. Schulte
Rakinik Intertype-http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Dungeon/2140/
Progressive Electronic Music
http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/12/dan_j_schulte.html
From:
'Heiko Heerßen'
Date: Fri Nov 19, 1999 7:30
am
Subject: Re: TDI vs Schulze
Glenn Reinicke wrote:
> ..... It also seems that Klaus is into churning out tons of material and
makes it available to his fans at reasonable prices.
> I'm not sure about past history on his part but it seems he treats his fans
> a bit better than TD. Maybe some comments from the hardcore Schulze fans on
> this would be interesting.
Now just guess TD would do the same with releasing old live material as Klaus
Schulze did (or in this case his Manager, Klaus D Mueller). Just consider the
possibility to get 50 CDs with all kinds of
unreleased or rare, mostly live material from TD!. Each CD would be crammed up
to the limit like the Schulze CDs are (78 minutes). If you buy the 'Ultimate
edition' from Klaus Schulze you have to
pay 900 Deutsche Mark in Germany (that's ca. 500 US Dollars or 300 British
Pounds, correct me if I'm wrong). In return you get over 60+ hours (!!) of
music. We all know that Edgar has almost every
show on tape and some of you know that there's a lot of great live music from
TD that hasn't been (or never will be) released officially. It's all there but
we will only see some tangentized glimpses
like Sohoman or Soundmill Navigator.
Heiko
From:
DJS
Date: Fri Nov 19, 1999 7:26
am
Subject: Re: Shopping for E-music [was: okefenokee trip]
'Andrew J. Rozsa' wrote:
>
>
> As a minor aside... some of the newbies may not know that among us, on this
> list and on the Beyond_EM list, dozens of incredible musicians lurk and
> produce wonderful sounds. Betcha Dano's 'Nominal Gain' will knock the socks
> off of many of you. He is too modest to brag. Ask him....
Thanks for the plug bud. I stopped drinking Mountain Dew so my music
will now consist of Yanni-like melodies & Enya enhanced spiritual hymns.
Well okay, maybe not. If anyone wants a sample you can find a couple
tracks from NG at that Mp3 website which has no talented musicians
according to Jared. Some of you will think it sucks, some will hopefully
like it but in any case thanks for at least looking. BTW, Dell & Andy, I
now have new covers for NG. If you'd like them lemme know, I'll send
them to ya, FOC. You can see the final cover for NG at my site.
(oh, BTW, under
> no circumstance are you to ask him about or even mention the words: ''Till
> All Are One,' TF:TM,' Vince DiCola, or BotCon '97...or any years, as a
> matter of fact).
Heh, it's always a pleasure to get that second disc in anyone's hands. I
won't even send the first one to make sure the 2nd one gets listened to.
;-)
>
> BTW...y'all are warned...do not...I repeat....DO NOT venture and start
> looking around the E-Prog site...
Make sure you all check out the new Eprogeny CD that's coming out very
soon! I've sampled every track on the site & it sounds like it's gonna
rock!
The Dan
--
Dan J. Schulte
Rakinik Intertype-http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Dungeon/2140/
Progressive Electronic Music
http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/12/dan_j_schulte.html
From:
'Heiko Heerßen'
Date: Fri Nov 19, 1999 8:01
am
Subject: TD in 1976
I was reading the reviews of 'Stratosfear' with great interest and I
think everything has been said about that classic and great album. Did
anyone read about the difficulties TD had when they recorded the album?
There got new electronic gear that wasn't working, a console or
something went up in smoke and overall it was very frustrating for them
to make the record. Some synths had to be repaired and for that reason
they were forced to take a break for a couple of days. In fact Edgars'
mouth organ one can hear at the beginning of '3 AM..' (oh no, I'm not
talking about the Okefenokee trip here ;-) was made out of pure
frustration, they were just hanging around and had nothing else to do
(you can read this in the 'Tangents' booklet).
After all, 1976 was one of the best and most productive years for TD,
releasing Stratosfear and scoring the Sorcerer soundtrack (which was
released in 1977) They toured 3 times and gave almost 40 concerts, made
some standout compositions like the one that will soon be released as
Soundmill Navigator (27.06.1976, Berlin) or the Nottingham Usher Hall
gig.
Also, Edgar released his 'Macula Transfer' which is a landmark release
(IMHO), maybe his finest solo work. And Peter Baumann produced his first
solo album Romance '76 which was also released in 1977.
Heiko
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From:
fsp@w...
Date: Fri Nov 19, 1999 7:53
am
Subject: okefenokee trip
>From: 'Jens Peschke'
>
>Covering up with e-mails...
>
>> From: Vic Rek
>>
>>Maybe we can even make it a mini EM trade fest? Hey even better, maybe
>>a few fans of EM professionals can show up and we can work a mini
>>concert? Marcel/Jens - what's your schedule look like?
Well, as far as I know I don't have any plans, apart from the Alfa2000 festival
of course. (in March).
It's all a question of time and money.
I can probably even pay for the trip, because I'll sell my car next week so
I've got some money left (after moving out of the house).
Don't know how my financial situation will be next year though :-).
I really like the idea I must say...playing in a swamp, as long the instruments
don't get sucked into the ground :-).
I even have 'ideas' for the music...swamps just sound mystic to me, we don't
have them over here. (we've got some other things over here, Vic knows :-))
IF (and it's still an if) I'll go I'll probably make a 2 week vacation of it,
but where the hell can I put all my instruments in those 2/3 weeks???
Plus, how much does it costs to get everything over there? :-)
Well, we've got some time to think about it.
>I'd love coming over but my schedule doesn't look too good, sadly.
>I'll be staying in northern Denmark for two weeks in April,
>March will be the Alfa2000 festival incl. Mind~Flux, my fave group of the
>90s.
>Then there's the Jodrell Bank gig in England we'll be playing in
>May, which needs some preparation as well. Not forgetting my day job,
>I'll be running a huge projects in 2000 between all those holiday and
>musical activities. ;-)
Thats really too bad!
I definitely need one or two other musicians to make improvised music.
Marcel
Music-page :http://home.wxs.nl/~m1engels
Email :fsp@w...
From:
Synthhtnys@a...
Date: Fri Nov 19, 1999 8:53
am
Subject: Re: okefenokee tripping
In a message dated 11/19/99 7:58:58 AM !!!First Boot!!!, fsp@w... writes:
<< Thats really too bad!
I definitely need one or two other musicians to make improvised music.
*Well if you can make it over from Europe, I'd make the trek from Washington
(state, mind you!) with a car full of synths!
;-)
Paul Ellis
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From:
'Simon Slator'
From:
'Hassinen Ami' I was reading the reviews of 'Stratosfear' with great interest and I
>think everything has been said about that classic and great album. Did
>anyone read about the difficulties TD had when they recorded the album?
>There got new electronic gear that wasn't working, a console or
>something went up in smoke and overall it was very frustrating for them
>to make the record. Some synths had to be repaired and for that reason
>they were forced to take a break for a couple of days. In fact Edgars'
>mouth organ one can hear at the beginning of '3 AM..' (oh no, I'm not
>talking about the Okefenokee trip here ;-) was made out of pure
>frustration, they were just hanging around and had nothing else to do
>(you can read this in the 'Tangents' booklet).
You must remeber that it is mainly Edgar´s view on the Stratosfear sessions
that you´re referring to. They had more than their share of technical
difficulties in the studio, for sure. But for example, Chris has stated in
an interview or two that he has very fond memories about making the music of
Stratosfear. I wonder what would be Peter´s view on the matter. After all,
his then brand-new Projekt Electronic sequencer seems to be all over on the
album...
>After all, 1976 was one of the best and most productive years for TD,
>releasing Stratosfear and scoring the Sorcerer soundtrack (which was
>released in 1977) They toured 3 times and gave almost 40 concerts, made
>some standout compositions like the one that will soon be released as
>Soundmill Navigator (27.06.1976, Berlin) or the Nottingham Usher Hall
>gig.
>Also, Edgar released his 'Macula Transfer' which is a landmark release
>(IMHO), maybe his finest solo work. And Peter Baumann produced his first
>solo album Romance '76 which was also released in 1977.
I totally agree.
Ami @ work
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From:
Synthhtnys@xxx.xxx
Date: Fri Nov 19, 1999 9:43
am
Subject: Re: TD in 1976
In a message dated 11/19/99 9:27:02 AM !!!First Boot!!!,
ami.hassinen@e... writes:
<< You must remeber that it is mainly Edgar´s view on the Stratosfear sessions
that you´re referring to. They had more than their share of technical
difficulties in the studio, for sure. But for example, Chris has stated in
an interview or two that he has very fond memories about making the music of
Stratosfear. I wonder what would be Peter´s view on the matter. After all,
his then brand-new Projekt Electronic sequencer seems to be all over on the
album...>>
*Good point. I found the interviews with Chris on Phaedra and Rubycon
to be very illuminating. Do you know anywhere that would have the
interviews you mentioned posted?
Poly
From:
Bert.Hulshoff@xx.xxx.xx
Date: Fri Nov 19, 1999 11:35
am
Subject: RE: TDI vs Schulze
I'll hope it will not happen, $500 at once is to big for me, I'll hope that
it will be possible to buy it in smaller portions.
That was also my problem with the 'ultimate edition' of Schulze. :-(
but it would be wonderful to get those albums.
Greetings
Bert
> ----------
> From: Heiko Heeren[SMTP:heiko.heerssen@h...]
> Sent: Friday, November 19, 1999 08:30
> To: tadream@o...
> Subject: Re: [tadream] TDI vs Schulze
>
> From: 'Heiko Heerßen'
>
>
>
> Glenn Reinicke wrote:
>
> > ..... It also seems that Klaus is into churning out tons of material and
> makes it available to his fans at reasonable prices.
> > I'm not sure about past history on his part but it seems he treats his
> fans
> > a bit better than TD. Maybe some comments from the hardcore Schulze fans
> on
> > this would be interesting.
>
> Now just guess TD would do the same with releasing old live material as
> Klaus Schulze did (or in this case his Manager, Klaus D Mueller). Just
> consider the possibility to get 50 CDs with all kinds of
> unreleased or rare, mostly live material from TD!. Each CD would be
> crammed up to the limit like the Schulze CDs are (78 minutes). If you buy
> the 'Ultimate edition' from Klaus Schulze you have to
> pay 900 Deutsche Mark in Germany (that's ca. 500 US Dollars or 300 British
> Pounds, correct me if I'm wrong). In return you get over 60+ hours (!!) of
> music. We all know that Edgar has almost every
> show on tape and some of you know that there's a lot of great live music
> from TD that hasn't been (or never will be) released officially. It's all
> there but we will only see some tangentized glimpses
> like Sohoman or Soundmill Navigator.
>
> Heiko
>
> > Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing original
> messages in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed from this list),
> send a blank e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
> Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
>
From:
'Heiko Heerßen'
From:
'Craig Chambers' I'm not sure about past history on his part but it seems he treats his fans
>a bit better than TD. Maybe some comments from the hardcore Schulze fans on
>this would be interesting.
I think the difference between KS and TD attitudes towards fans purely
resides in the wonderful Klaus D. Mueller, who has been KS's manager since
the Big Bang, but who appears to have always been a fan first and foremost.
I get the feeling KDM treats us as he would like to be treated. He controls
the website and its contents, he is responsible for all of the 'Editions'
(words, packaging, promotion...not music), and he knows that KS biggest fans
are his long term fans...and they will be the ones that keep the boat
'floating' , so to speak.
Craig C.
From:
Richard Bílek
I understand, that some titles were not released on CD, but I already saw in
past
all of them on CD-R, probably from analog sources.
If anyone is interested in trade (or other ways of deal), please e-mail me
off list.
Thanx
Richard Bilek, Praha
From:
'joe shoults' -----Original Message-----
> From: tom george [mailto:eloy-usa@a...]
>
>
> yeah joe i have watched it several times. in fact i bought it at
> blockbusters for 5.00. it is pretty lame but the music fits the
> scenes well. tom
>
>
>
>
From:
Rainer Rutka Baumann/Koek:
.... and again: This is not (!) Peter Baumann! This LP was made by
Wolfgang Baumann from Kempten/Germany. The other guy is Eta Koeck.
They are in no realation with TD!
BTW: I'll update my Tangerine Dream page ASAP and will add a special
'Baumann/Koeck'-Error page for an explanation because a lot of people
are thinking this LP was made by Peter Baumann.
Rainer
rainer@k...
---------------------------------------------------------------------
TD-page: http://home.t-online.de/home/rutka
new: This site will be expanded and moved very soon (stay tuned)
---------------------------------------------------------------------
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From:
Gustavo Jobim > > Maybe we are all caught up in ultra-high expectations towards new TD
albums,
>> > somehow hoping for them to induce the same feelings of excitement,
novelty,
>> > and genuine 'underground' interest in us as the older recordings did.
>
>Would be nice if they released something of older origins without
>perverting it first with their mundane Korg bridges & tangentizations.
I think we'll have something like that... Antique Dreams, or Twilight
something... isn't it?
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Gustavo Jobim Luminous Visions is a video/dvd release (which included a bonus CD of just
>the music tracks in some cases) with cool computer animation set to TD
>music. My wife really liked it.
>It a neat vid. There is no new music though. All the tracks are mid to
>late 90s tracks from various sources. Most are edited to be shorter to
>match the length of the animation segment.
>
>James
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Gustavo Jobim >From: Gustavo Jobim
>>
>>I want to explore the pre-Phaedra albums - I know, it's a little strange -
>>but is the 'Analogue Space Years 1969-1973' the best way to do this? Or
>>should I buy all five albums?
>>
>>pre-thanks
>>gfj
>
>Gustavo,
Ah yes! They're the PINK, not the blue years... well, it's all colors.
>the Pink Years (note: pre 'Phaedra' is called the Pink Years)
>Cheers,
>
>Thomas
>Sweden
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
jwhite@xxxxx.xxx
Date: Fri Nov 19, 1999 6:19
pm
Subject: Re: Misc.
To Dan:
Gee, it's amazing how much some people assume here on the list. According to
some people here, I'm a millionaire, have a 150mhz computer, don't have any
synthesizers, and don't have any musical talent -- when, in reality, I'm rather
broke at the moment, have a rather snappy 350mhz computer (with a half-way
decent 56K modem), have several high-end synthesizers, and am a professional
musician with a Celtic ensemble that performs across the Western United States.
You can check out our Web site if you like, at .
You did get one thing right. I am a teenager. But don't let that fool you. :)
Regards,
Jared
From:
TOMX01@a...
Date: Fri Nov 19, 1999 7:57
pm
Subject: D: Live (Encore)
Encore, rather than simply review the whole album which would be terribly
tedious to do as well as read I just thought I would extract some of my
favourite parts of this wonderful CD.
1: Cherokee Lane
The first time I heard this track, well at least an extract was on the Dream
Sequence compilation. It really blew me away.
Anyway, a very 'phaedra' intro to this track, although far more abstract.
Then at 3.15 the Dream Sequence extract begins. I think I liked this
originally because it was very dark and moody, with a slowly intensifying
sequence which is later complemented by a far more powerful though more
simple sequence at about 6.45.
Melodies intertwine proving their musical growth that only the undertaking of
such a large tour could nourish.
About 11.30 in we get some wonderful variations upon the well established
rhythm which then leads to the main sequence becoming more aggressive with
more purpose, changing and progressing all the time. Then at about 13.30 we
lose the heavy sequence and are left with just the original higher sequence
which then also fades down to reveal the ending of a very taut piece of music.
2: Monolight
Here we have an fairly aggressive piano intro which leads into a far more
relaxed piano solo after about a minute, very reminiscent of the opening of
Ricochet part two, with the backing synths slowly surfacing, then into a more
aggressive abstract cascading section which leads us into some strange sound
effects, partly percussion, part white noise which introduces us to the drum
pattern at about 3.45 then this leads into what is probably the most melodic
piece of music the band had published up to that point. Although i didn't
realise it at the time I had already heard this track as a sequenced demo on
the Ample Music System. However after some heavy white noise, we build into
the second sequence of this track. This one takes it time and slowly builds
to a multi-layerd sequence, which at about 10.30 really starts to come alive.
This is then developed a la stratosfear into a very interesting piece.
3) Coldwater Canyon
Straight down to business on this track with a powerful sequence and the
usual Edgar Froese heavily effected guitar sound. Amongst over effects there
is a very slight vocoder effect in there also. Not much more to say about
this track .. not one of my favs, I guess some of the others will have more
to say about this one.
4) Desert Dream
I love the opening to this track ... I remember playing it on my personal CD
player in a plane over New Mexico at night ... a wonderful mystic intro. Its
beautifully realised the image of the the city of alburquerque glowing in the
middle of the desert.
About 11 mins in theres a lovely almost film soundtrack like love theme A
beautiful way to close this strange album
Overall, I have to say that this is my third favourite live album, behind
Ricochet and Livemiles, but then a lot of my top favourites are live albums.
Tom (Melrose)
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From:
Gustavo Jobim
Date: Fri Nov 19, 1999 7:44
pm
Subject: e-pioneers was Re: Shopping for E-music [was: okefenokee trip]
I think we should say TD were ONE OF the pioneers of the genre, isn't it?
Must I name some other pioneers?
>How is all this related to TD? Well, many years ago, they were the pioneers
>of the genre. That's how. (How's that for an oblique dig?)
>
>Andrew
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Gustavo Jobim
Date: Fri Nov 19, 1999 7:59
pm
Subject: Re: TD in 1976
1976 was indeed a great year for the classical electronic music.
Stratosfear was recorded and released, and we had all that TD activity
Heiko talked about, Jean-Michel Jarre released his debut album, Oxygene, in
France (international release was in 77), and Klaus Schulze released his
Moondawn.
Anything else?
gfj
>From: 'Heiko Heerßen'
>
>After all, 1976 was one of the best and most productive years for TD,
>releasing Stratosfear and scoring the Sorcerer soundtrack (which was
>released in 1977) They toured 3 times and gave almost 40 concerts, made
>some standout compositions like the one that will soon be released as
>Soundmill Navigator (27.06.1976, Berlin) or the Nottingham Usher Hall
>gig.
>Also, Edgar released his 'Macula Transfer' which is a landmark release
>(IMHO), maybe his finest solo work. And Peter Baumann produced his first
>solo album Romance '76 which was also released in 1977.
>
>Heiko
>
>--------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ----------------------------
>
> GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU!
p.s. I don't care about the gator! :)
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Gustavo Jobim
Date: Fri Nov 19, 1999 7:24
pm
Subject: Re: D: [Studio] Stratosfear
>The gearlist (one of the things I miss with the new albums.. no
>gearlists) shows
The SBM releases also doesn't have the gearlist.
>Some people say that gear lists serve no purpose. I love them.
I like them too.
And that part which begins at 5:15 from Invivisble Limits is really
amazing! The piano ending and this part are the best from this track, IMO.
gfj
p.s.: next stop - Force Majeure (haven't bought Encore and Cyclone yet)
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Glenn Reinicke
Date: Fri Nov 19, 1999 8:09
pm
Subject: RE: TD in 1976
[snip]
From: Gustavo Jobim
> 1976 was indeed a great year for the classical electronic music.
> Stratosfear was recorded and released, and we had all that TD activity
> Heiko talked about, Jean-Michel Jarre released his debut album, Oxygene,
> in
> France (international release was in 77), and Klaus Schulze released his
> Moondawn. Anything else? ]snip]
>
Sequencer from Synergy/Larry Fast was released which is an
incredible work. If your stereo can handle it, skip to Cybersports or
Classical Gas and turn it up! I highly recommend this album if you want to
hear what Moog gear can do when properly beaten into submission.
Then check out his web site at http://www.eclipse.net/~synergy/ for
more information.
From:
Owens James
Date: Fri Nov 19, 1999 9:07
pm
Subject: RE: opinionated arguments...
Jared says:
'I absolutely cannot tolerate intolerance.'
Dano says:
'What do you young whippersnappers know about music?'
I say:
'Agree that you have different opinions and get over it!'
James - lightly amused by the whole thing...
From:
Owens James
Date: Fri Nov 19, 1999 9:10
pm
Subject: Synergy (was: 1976)
I was wondering if there were any other Synergy fans around here.
Audion and Metropolitan Suite are my faves. I occasionally sleep to
'Computer Experiments volume 1' - nice ambient stuff there.
James
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Glenn Reinicke
>
> Sequencer from Synergy/Larry Fast was released which is an
> incredible work. If your stereo can handle it, skip to Cybersports or
> Classical Gas and turn it up! I highly recommend this album if you want to
> hear what Moog gear can do when properly beaten into submission.
> Then check out his web site at http://www.eclipse.net/~synergy/ for
> more information.
>
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From:
'Nico de Kok'
Date: Fri Nov 19, 1999 9:31
pm
Subject: Unsubscribe confirmation
Hi there,
Since I am a true fan of TD I am interested in information about there
music, but...
I find it very annoying that I receive about 40-50 emails every day about
fans searching for every TD item. I am not interested in receiving their
info.
So please unsubscribe me.
Thank you.
Best regards, Nico de Kok
From:
Gustavo Jobim
Date: Fri Nov 19, 1999 9:41
pm
Subject: Unsubscribing, briefly I hope.
Hello all members of the Tadream, TangerineDream and ElectronicMusic
ONElist lists
I'm sorry to inform you that i'll have to unsubscribe (very briefly, I
hope) to these lists, due to severe shortage of money.
Translating: damn phone company is too expensive (government sold it
recently), so I'm disconnecting from the Internet for a while.
If you want to contact me online (I'll try to manage to keep my free email
account), I can be found at gustavofj@h... .
See you soon. :((
gustavo ferreira jobim
p.s.: to Tadream list: I will post my reviews on F.Majeure, Pergamon, White
Eagle and Poland!
p.s.2: I'll be at Okefenokee Swamp! (In spirit !!!! :)
p.s.3: three p.s.'s !! :)
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
'Patrik *'
Date: Sat Nov 20, 1999 3:30
am
Subject: Re: Synergy (was: 1976)
I was wondering if there were any other Synergy fans around here.
Audion and Metropolitan Suite are my faves. I occasionally sleep to
'Computer Experiments volume 1' - nice ambient stuff there.
James
-----------
Hi James, and everybody out there!
I really like Synergy/Larry Fast, especially Chords from 1978.
Heavy Oberheim synths and a lot of Moog, a very special sound indeed on this
album.
Patrik, Stockholm, Sweden
From:
'Carl & Jacqui Kearney'
Date: Sat Nov 20, 1999 12:01
am
Subject: WAB
Hi Folks just had to post this self indulgent message .
I seriously thing that this album ( What a Blast ) is the best thing TD have
done 5 years or so . I tried to put it away for a month or two but I still
cant stop playing it over and over and over especially Timesquare a truly
amazing piece of work , hey and the wife likes it too.
Best Regards ' Orch '
From:
Gary Davis I was wondering if there were any other Synergy fans around here.
>Audion and Metropolitan Suite are my faves. I occasionally sleep to
>'Computer Experiments volume 1' - nice ambient stuff there.
Definitely a Synergy fan here. Audion is my favorite with Cords being a
very close second. I also find Computer Experiments to be an excellent
ambient album, very relaxing.
Larry Fast recently recorded a brand new track, his interpretation of
Ravel's Pavane, for a Kosovo benefit collection. He also did a new original
track on another collection which I don't have yet, but expect to have in my
hands soon. Hopefully a full album will be coming from him soon. It's
definitely overdue.
Gary
**************************************************************
Gary Davis
The Artist Shop The Other Road
http://www.artist-shop.com artshop@a...
phone: 330-929-2056 fax:330-945-4923
SUPPORT THE INDEPENDENT ARTIST!!!
**************************************************************
Check out the latest Artist Shop newsletter at
http://www.artist-shop.com/news.htm
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From:
Vic Rek I really like the idea I must say...playing in a swamp, as long the
instruments don't get sucked into the ground :-).
:-)
> I even have 'ideas' for the music...swamps just sound mystic to me, we don't
have them over here. (we've got some other things over here, Vic knows :-))
> IF (and it's still an if) I'll go I'll probably make a 2 week vacation of it,
but where the hell can I put all my instruments in those 2/3 weeks???
At my house of course!
> Plus, how much does it costs to get everything over there? :-)
No clue, I'd call KLM (the airlines of course, not KDM ;-) and try to
get a good handle on this. Ask for insurance too.
Vic
From:
Vic Rek << Thats really too bad!
> I definitely need one or two other musicians to make improvised music.
>
> *Well if you can make it over from Europe, I'd make the trek from Washington
> (state, mind you!) with a car full of synths!
> ;-)
>
> Paul Ellis
From:
'Patrik *'
From:
EFroese@xxxxx.xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx)
Date: Sat Nov 20, 1999 2:43
am
Subject: 2manyFreakinEmails
I have to agree with the comments on the number of td-list emails that
are posted each day. i have to log on-line about every two days just to
keep my mailbox from getting full. i end up reading a couple of
messages, and deleting another 50 unread.
also, some of the crap that's posted should be sent directly between
members, and not posted to the list.
maybe if we all stop responding to 10 messages each a day...anyway,
sorry to waste up more space on your harddrives,but i just needed to
vent.
i like the list, i'm just getting sick of this email bombardment.
steve
From:
'Hassinen Ami' *Good point. I found the interviews with Chris on Phaedra and Rubycon
>to be very illuminating. Do you know anywhere that would have the
>interviews you mentioned posted?
>Poly
Hello!
I´m not sure if they´re on the net somewhere, but here´s what Chris said in
an excellent article in 'Sound on Sound' mag, december 1994:
--------
Chris Franke has happier memories: 'A special favourite, Stratosfear. I
especially like it because it has a feeling of open space. We tried out a
new location, Audio Studios in Berlin, which was used for orchestral
recordings. I remember playing music for up to two hours at a time non-stop
- it was so fluid. Usually, improvising electronic music is a process of
planning, starting and stopping, but on Stratosfear we really got into these
long phases. We also brought back some acoustic sounds, bit by bit to add
more coclur. It was really the blend of all the possible material we could
play. For me, Startosfear was the next big step after Phaedra.'
--------
cheers,
Ami
np:
Spirits Burning: 'New worlds by design'
From:
Klaus Beschorner
From:
'Lawry Simm'
From:
Steven Feldman Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 15:07:05 -0600
>Subject: Re: [tadream] RE: opinionated arguments...
>From: Tangerine Dream mailing list
>Really-From: Owens James
'opinionated arguments'? Did someone just call my name? No?
Never mind.
;)
-- Steven Feldman
- - - - - - -
Quip: 'Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.' --Albert Einstein
Another: 'Science is to investigate the unexplained, not to 'explain' the
univestigated.' --Stanton Friedman (nuclear physicist and UFO researcher)
From:
'Steven Le Vine' From: Quarlie@a...
>
> In a message dated 11/17/99 7:36:49 PM, Grant.Somerville@V... wrote:
>
>>Sorry for the off topic,
>>Can anyone suggest an mp3 player for the Mac other than Quicktime?
>
> I like SoundApp.
SoundApp is EXCELLENT!
siberkat
From:
PENFOLD
From:
'Jim Moore'
From:
Richard Ford , Jim Moore
writes
>From: 'Jim Moore'
>
>Right now I'm listening to the HEAT soundtrack, and there seem
>to be many parallels between this collection and the THIEF
>soundtrack. For example, there is the same style of slow buildup
>in the opening theme as there is in 'Diamond Diary' (which was
>the opening piece to THIEF, if I remember correctly). 'New Dawn
>Fades' corresponds to 'Confrontation', etc., etc...
>
Sorry if I have missed the thread on this...Did TD do the soundtrack for
HEAT?
--
Richard Ford
From:
TOMX01@xxx.xxx
Date: Sun Nov 21, 1999 4:02
pm
Subject: Re: THIEF and HEAT
No TD had nothing to do with Heat, but the directors use of various synth
music is reminiscent of TDs score for Thief.
Tom (Melrose)
From:
'Michael A Jean'
From:
'Michael A Jean'
> I was wondering if there were any other Synergy fans around here.
> Audion and Metropolitan Suite are my faves. I occasionally sleep to
> 'Computer Experiments volume 1' - nice ambient stuff there.
>
> James
> -----------
>
From:
'Paul Fellows'
From:
Glenn Reinicke From: 'Michael A Jean'
>
> I used to be, but not much anymore...I still have the lps around
> somewhere..I haven't heard thie cds...
>
Larry Fast just remastered all of his Synergy titles and re-released
them on CD. He's also replaced some of the songs with slightly different
mixes, like on Games. For those of you wanting a great all purpose
anthology, I'd pick up Semiconductor. If you want to start collecting his
titles, you really can't go wrong with anything since they are all
masterpieces, but I'd get Computer Experiments last or at least after
acquiring Games, Audion, Sequencer, and Cords. These titles are some of the
best EM you'll find anywhere.
From:
Gustavo Jobim Larry Fast just remastered all of his Synergy titles and re-released
>them on CD. He's also replaced some of the songs with slightly different
>mixes, like on Games. For those of you wanting a great all purpose
>anthology, I'd pick up Semiconductor. If you want to start collecting his
>titles, you really can't go wrong with anything since they are all
>masterpieces, but I'd get Computer Experiments last or at least after
>acquiring Games, Audion, Sequencer, and Cords. These titles are some of the
>best EM you'll find anywhere.
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Grant M Somerville From: Quarlie@a...
>
> In a message dated 11/17/99 7:36:49 PM, Grant.Somerville@V... wrote:
>
> >Sorry for the off topic,
> >Can anyone suggest an mp3 player for the Mac other than Quicktime?
>
>
Hi All
Thanks to all who replied re the mp3s'
-- Kind Regards, Grant.
Grant M Somerville
Glasgow, Scotland.
Looking for Live Music Recordings...try
SOUNDCHECK
From:
Vic Rek Russia Agrees to Strengthen Copyright Protection for EU Music
>
>
>Brussels, Oct. 18 (Bloomberg) -- Russia agreed to enact copyright laws for
>European music recorded before 1995, cracking down on pirated recordings of
>the Beatles and other popular artists, the European Commission said.
>
>Under an agreement with the European Union, Russia will extend its existing
>copyright legislation, which covers Russian recordings dating back to 1943
>but only protects European music produced since 1995, said the commission,
>the EU's executive agency.
>
>Current Russian law allows older European music to be ``copied and sold
>freely on the Russian market, resulting in major revenue losses for
>European companies,'' the commission said. The new rules will help record
>companies like EMI Plc, which holds the rights to recordings by the
>Beatles, the Rolling Stones and Pink Floyd, to boost sales in Russia.
>
>The International Federation of the Phonographic Industry, a music industry
>trade group, estimated earlier this year that the unauthorized
>manufacturing of CDs and cassettes cost the industry as much as $10 billion
>in lost sales in 1998.
>
>``We're very happy and welcome the steps that have been taken by the
>Russians and the European Commission to improve the copyright situation,''
>said Yolanda Smits, IFPI's Brussels-based trade adviser. ``In Russia at the
>moment there is no retroactive protection for foreign recordings.''
>
>The IFPI estimates that about 80 percent of all international recordings
>sold in Russia are pirated, Smits said.
>
>Under the agreement with the EU, Russia will amend its copyright
>legislation to include older recordings by July of next year, Smits said.
>Russia will also change its criminal codes to ensure strict enforcement of
>anti-piracy laws and comply with World Trade Organization rules, she said.
--
Linda forever,
aya.
ICQ# 42296931
From:
Vic Rek
From:
DJS
> From: Vic Rek
>
> I know the this thread took a lot of bandwidth in the last week, but
> here is the current update:
>
> The trip is planned for sometime in late March or April year 2000.
>
> Here is the list of members that expressed interest in attending:
>
> Andrew Rozsa Alabama
> Dell Florida
> Dan Schulte California
Actually, I'll be living in Florida by then. I'm already designing a
fanboat rigged with keyboards from all sides so I can drive & play at
the same time.
> Marcel Engels The Netherlands (Live music?)
If Marcel shows up with gear I'll bring some too. In fact, maybe I'll
even spring for some new monitors so we can blast the swamp air with
analog leads! Of course, my wife's expecting in March so I might be
cutting it close. We'll need a cameraman too so we can sell video copies
of the event to pay for the trip. I think we need to call this meeting
'Swampfest 2000'. What do you think? Hehehe.
--
Dan J. Schulte
Rakinik Intertype-http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Dungeon/2140/
Progressive Electronic Music
http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/12/dan_j_schulte.html
From:
Joel Mullen
From:
yannick.edom@xxxx.xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx)
Date: Mon Nov 22, 1999 7:22
am
Subject: Re: The Baumann/Koeck error!
> Baumann/Koek:
>.... and again: This is not (!) Peter Baumann! This LP was made by
>Wolfgang Baumann from Kempten/Germany. The other guy is Eta Koeck.
>They are in no realation with TD!
You forgot that Conny Plank recorded and produced it.
If you don't know yet Conny Plank is Conrad Schnitzler
Yannick Edom
Mirage Créations
Champlain B7 A 101
47 Chemin de Pelleport
31500 TOULOUSE
FRANCE
e-mail : yannick.edom@s...
From:
'Heiko Heerßen' You forgot that Conny Plank recorded and produced it.
> If you don't know yet Conny Plank is Conrad Schnitzler
????
Correct me if I'm wrong but Conny Plank died some years ago and Conrad
Schnitzler is (hopefully) still alive.
Heiko
From:
Rainer Rutka Edom Yannick wrote:
> > You forgot that Conny Plank recorded and produced it.
> > If you don't know yet Conny Plank is Conrad Schnitzler
> ????
> Correct me if I'm wrong but Conny Plank died some years ago and Conrad
Schnitzler is (hopefully) still alive.
> Heiko
Hi!
Heiko's right. Conny Plank was a producer in the 70ies. He was
famous for his work together with Cluster, Roedelius, Can and many others.
Wolfgang(!) Baumann told me, he was very proud to got his record produced
by him.
Conny Plank is still alive. I get an email from him last week!
Bye...
Rainer
---------------------------------------------------------------------
TD-page -> http://home.t-onlind.ed/home/rutka
comming soon: http://www.rutka.de/td
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Replies
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Yahoo! ID
Date
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19324
Re: The Baumann/Koeck error
Rainer Rutka
Mon
11/22/1999
1 KB
From:
Bert.Hulshoff@xx.xxx.xx
Date: Mon Nov 22, 1999 10:06
am
Subject: RE: Conny/Conrad was The Baumann/Koeck error
Was Dieter Dierks not the one that died?
he was also a famous producer
groetjes
Bert
aka Phrozenlight
my Homepage http://phrozenlight.findhere.org/
(still under construction)
please listen to my spacesongs and send me an review ;-)
> Rainer Rutka wrote
>
> On Mon, 22 Nov 1999, Heiko Heerßen wrote:
>
> > Edom Yannick wrote:
> > > You forgot that Conny Plank recorded and produced it.
> > > If you don't know yet Conny Plank is Conrad Schnitzler
> > ????
> > Correct me if I'm wrong but Conny Plank died some years ago and Conrad
> Schnitzler is (hopefully) still alive.
> > Heiko
> Hi!
> Heiko's right. Conny Plank was a producer in the 70ies. He was
> famous for his work together with Cluster, Roedelius, Can and many others.
> Wolfgang(!) Baumann told me, he was very proud to got his record produced
> by him.
> Conny Plank is still alive. I get an email from him last week!
>
> Bye...
>
> Rainer
>
From:
Klaus Beschorner You forgot that Conny Plank recorded and produced it.
>If you don't know yet Conny Plank is Conrad Schnitzler
Yannick, please check your calendar, this is not April 1st.
If there were a price for the most ridiculous rumour
of the year, you'd win !
Besides, the cover sais 'mixed by Conny Plank studio', which
most certainly means one of his apprentices did it. No
mention of him being the producer.
For those of you who still won't belive it: two members of
this list have actually met Wolfgang Baumann and verified
the story right at the source.
Of course, it shows that he liked the TD style of the era,
and I bet the slight ambiguity about the name was by no
means accidental ;-) It worked ;-)
regards,
klaus
From:
Rainer Rutka Conny Plank is still alive. I get an email from him last week!
Merde! That is what I call a Freudian mistake!
No, Conny is dead (sadly) - but Conrad(!) is alive and well
;-) sorry for the confusion!
Rainer
From:
'Poulton, Larry'
From:
'Heiko Heerßen' From: 'Poulton, Larry'
>
> 1) Cherokee Lane
>
> Swirling synths in a sea of passion emerge into a beefy sequencer drive -
> pure groove!!
Stir them rapidly....to me that sounds like a recipe. ..but you're right, it's
pure groove and ectasy.
Sequencers galore!
> 2) Monolight
>
> Lovely piano
And the 1st prize to the shortest description of a TD song in the [tadream] D.
... discussion
goes to ....Larry Poulton!!
But yes, it has a lovely piano. So what do I complain!?
> 3) Coldwater Canyon
>
> EDGAR - you do love that guitar! Mental, funky rhythms. Best played LOUD!!
YEAH!!
Or even better...listen to the 'Edgar beyond' guitar solo in Detroit,
31.03.1977. He must've thought about Detroit's hero, the Stooges' guitarist
Ron Asheton while he was playing this.
> 4) Desert Dream
>
> Nice 'bring you down' music
Talk about a smart bloody ending theme...the last 1 or 2 minutes to end 'Desert
dream' are just out of this world.
> Overall - an immensely enjoyable album of contrasts, well crafted and nicely
> recorded - wish I could've been there.
Yep..must have been very impressive to see our threesome behind huge walls of
snythesizers. I guess some of our Tadream members have had the luck to be there
in 1977?
It would be most enjoyable to read about their impressions with TD and their
Laserium show!
Heiko
From:
Rainer Rutka Besides, the cover sais 'mixed by Conny Plank studio', which
> most certainly means one of his apprentices did it. No
> mention of him being the producer.
Damm' right!
OK, and there's a title called 'TD-Mem'. But he wan't!
Wolfgang told me very proudly it was prduced in Connys' studio.
But - Klaus is right - not by Conny himself.
> For those of you who still won't belive it: two members of
> this list have actually met Wolfgang Baumann and verified
> the story right at the source.
Right. If I finish my new homepage (next week on: www.rutka.de/td)
I'll make a Baumann/Koeck page with scanns and photos of Wolfgang(!)
Baumann.
BTW: There was a german music-magazine called 'POP'. Wolfgang did some
comic-strips for it. It was called 'The Popper' about a little man
and his troubles with music. If I find an old POP magazine I'll include
one of the strips. But it's so far ago....
> Of course, it shows that he liked the TD style of the era,
> and I bet the slight ambiguity about the name was by no
> means accidental ;-) It worked ;-)
Right, too. That was what he wanted. He was as crazy in electronic
lmusic as me. He allways had the newest Schulze, Cluster and TD records
in his shop in Kempten (Francoise Records). Sometimes he saved some
rare items for me (Force Majeure in clear vinyl). He was (or is?) a
very nice guy. Don't konw what he's doing now. I lost the connections
at the beginning of the 80ies.
Rainer
From:
Gary Davis Hmmm, I got interested in this Synergy (I've seen many CDs for sale, but
>never listened to anyone).
>Can you compare his music with anything from Jarre?
>Because I only know the full JMJ discography. I have only 8 albums from TD,
>and 2 from Oldfield, and 3 from Kraftwerk.
Larry 'Synergy' Fast really has his own sound. I couldn't really compare
his work to that of other synthesists or electronic music groups like JMJ,
TD, Kraftwerk, Vangelis, etc. He takes a very classical approach to
composition.
I've got some Synergy soundbites you can check out at
.
Gary
**************************************************************
Gary Davis
The Artist Shop The Other Road
http://www.artist-shop.com artshop@a...
phone: 330-929-2056 fax:330-945-4923
SUPPORT THE INDEPENDENT ARTIST!!!
**************************************************************
Check out the latest Artist Shop newsletter at
http://www.artist-shop.com/news.htm
From:
Tom Richmond
From:
'Michael A Jean' -----Original Message-----
> From: Joe Shoults [mailto:shoults@s...]
> Sent: Thursday, November 18, 1999 9:42 PM
> To: tadream@o...
> Subject: RE: [tadream] Re: Okefenokee trip?
>
>
> From: 'Joe Shoults'
>
> has anybody actually watched Shy People? I saw it in the store,
> but haven't
> rented it yet. It's about cajuns, right? (too lazy to go to imdb.com to
> look it up)
> -joe
>
From:
Marcelo Gutierrez
To: tadream@o...
Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 9:07 PM
Subject: [tadream] Okefenokee Trip? - Current List 11/21/99
>From: Vic Rek
>
>I know the this thread took a lot of bandwidth in the last week, but
>here is the current update:
>
>The trip is planned for sometime in late March or April year 2000.
>
>Here is the list of members that expressed interest in attending:
>
>Andrew Rozsa Alabama
>Dell Florida
>Dan Schulte California
>Marcel Engels The Netherlands (Live music?)
>Joe Shoults Wisconsin?
>Joel Mullen Wisconsin
>Michael Jean Illinois
>James Owens Alabama
>Roger Smith Florida
>Rudy Russo ?
>Paul Ellis Washington (Live music?)
>Tom George ?
>Scott 'twosheds' ?
>Vic Rek Georgia
>
>Let me know off-list if I missed your name or if you'd like to be added
>to the list. This list does not include any family members or friends
>either.
>
>I'll give an update after the holidays!
>
>Vic
>
>>Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing original
messages in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed from this list), send
a blank e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
>Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
>
From:
James Joystick
From:
Glenn Reinicke From: Gary Davis
>
> Larry 'Synergy' Fast really has his own sound. I couldn't really compare
> his work to that of other synthesists or electronic music groups like JMJ,
> TD, Kraftwerk, Vangelis, etc. He takes a very classical approach to
> composition.
>
I'd second that but his classical approach is different from
Tomita's. He does cover some classics but still in his own style and
arrangements.
The first synth musician I heard was JMJ on Oxygene and Equinoxe.
After hearing Synergy's Sequencer and Cords the JMJ stuff started gathering
dust. I was trying to think of anything that Larry Fast's work reminds me of
and the only thing is 'In Search Of', the TV show with Leonard Nimoy. The
theme from that show nails his style.
From:
James Joystick
From:
'twosheds' I'm driving to visit my cousin in Orlando, FL for the upcoming
>holidays. I think on the way back I'll make a detour and stop by The
>Swamp and get an assesment of what is possible. Maybe I'll even post a
>few pics on my website if I have time. I still want to post the one I
>have with Martin Kay & Ania (from TDI) and Jerome of course! Jerome is
>truly a cool and happy guy! Maybe we can pull off the impossible or
>improbable still (hint hint)?
>I'm motivated enough to make this happen - no doubt!
If we invite the band, we'd probably have to ante up for their airfare. What
we might want to do is collect some gear from people who will be there for
the band to use, so they won't have to drag it along with them. Perhaps this
might morph into some sort of E-music festival...
Scott
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Mon
11/22/1999
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Mon
11/22/1999
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Vic Rek
Tue
11/23/1999
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Tue
11/23/1999
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From:
Sean Montgomery If we invite the band, we'd probably have to ante up for their airfare.
This remark just brought a thought to mind. I wonder what TD includes on
their rider when they tour? (For those who don't know, a rider is a
contract that specifies what the band needs/wants from each venue on their
tour. This can range from technical requirements like access to enough
electricity, to quirky requests like a bowl of blue M&Ms) Would they want
directions to a good Indian food restaurant? German beer?
SEAN MONTGOMERY Animator
T O P I X / Mad Dog
http://www.topix.com/~sean
From:
DJS
> From: 'twosheds'
Maybe we can pull off the impossible or
> >improbable still (hint hint)?
> >I'm motivated enough to make this happen - no doubt!
Perhaps if you can convince Edgar to make a limited edition 2-track
Okefenokee CD single & charge us each $1000 for it they might consider
it. The idea of meeting in a swamp at 3am (all because of a track title
no less, heh) is silly enough (which is fine because we're all somewhat
crazy in our own way) but the thought that the band might actually
journey 1000's of miles out of their country to hang with a bunch of
rabid fans at 3AM in the middle of a swamp is pretty laughable. Come on
guys, time to get a little back to reality. Heh heh, picture it:
Edgar while sipping beer in some pub in Germany and scoping onelist
happenings on his laptop:
'Oh look Jerome, ah fans ah getting togahther in Okefenokee at 3AM.
What silly people these ahmericahns are. Don't they know thaat der are
alligators that will chahmp on der behind? Foolish ahmericans. Oh wait,
it's get bahtter. They want us to go out der ahnd meet dem. I just know
it's a setup. Dey hit our head and take all ah gear. Well dey can
forgaht it!'
Jerome sitting across from his pa:
'Yah.'
Heh, you guys crack me up.
--
Dan J. Schulte
Rakinik Intertype-http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Dungeon/2140/
Progressive Electronic Music
http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/12/dan_j_schulte.html
From:
'Jens Peschke' From: DJS
>
> Heh, you guys crack me up.
Yo Dano, you made my day. :-)
Funniest thing I've been reading here for a while.
Hey, just got an idea !
Btw, if you (not you , Dan ! ;-)) really wanna help TD touring the US
how about paying one buck for each CDR/fan tape you own and
put it somewhere onto an US bank account (to avoid high transaction costs),
choose an account which offers at least 3% per year extra.
Tangerine Dream Aid, anyone ?
TD won't get the money until they tour the states, of course !
Best Regards
Jens
From:
Vic Rek From: 'twosheds'
>
> >I'm driving to visit my cousin in Orlando, FL for the upcoming
> >holidays. I think on the way back I'll make a detour and stop by The
> >Swamp and get an assesment of what is possible. Maybe I'll even post a
> >few pics on my website if I have time. I still want to post the one I
> >have with Martin Kay & Ania (from TDI) and Jerome of course! Jerome is
> >truly a cool and happy guy! Maybe we can pull off the impossible or
> >improbable still (hint hint)?
> >I'm motivated enough to make this happen - no doubt!
>
> If we invite the band, we'd probably have to ante up for their airfare. What
> we might want to do is collect some gear from people who will be there for
> the band to use, so they won't have to drag it along with them. Perhaps this
> might morph into some sort of E-music festival...
>
> Scott
From:
electriccafe@xxxxx.xxx
Date: Tue Nov 23, 1999 12:59
am
Subject: TD's Heat Robinson and Lion's Share
Hey Folks, I'm new to this post,though I know a few of you. Quickquestion:
whatever became of TD's'Heat Robinson' and 'Lion's Share'projects? Did they
incorporate theminto other projects or just changethe names? Synthmaniac
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Re: TD's Heat Robinson and Lion's Share
Michael A Jean
Tue
11/23/1999
2 KB
From:
'Michael A Jean' -----Original Message-----
> From: electriccafe@w... [mailto:electriccafe@w...]
> Sent: Monday, November 22, 1999 6:59 PM
> To: tadream@o...
> Subject: [tadream] TD's Heat Robinson and Lion's Share
>
>
> From: electriccafe@w...
>
> Hey Folks, I'm new to this post,though I know a few of you.
> Quickquestion: whatever became of TD's'Heat Robinson' and
> 'Lion's Share'projects? Did they incorporate theminto other
> projects or just changethe names? Synthmaniac
>
> > Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing
> original messages in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed
> from this list), send a blank e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
> Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
>
>
From:
Gustavo Jobim
From:
Gustavo Jobim Then, The piano is
>superseded by noises of many kinds, including the famous 'Chris' Eagle'.
Chris' Eagle?? Is this 'eagle' that ever present sound from Midnight in
Tula, which appears after those 3 notes? If this is it, then this sound is
really famous.
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Gustavo Jobim
From:
electriccafe@xxxxx.xxx
Date: Tue Nov 23, 1999 3:37
am
Subject: 'Heat Robinson' and 'Lion's Share'
Whatever happened to TD's 'HeatRobinson' and 'Lion's Share'?Were they
incorporated into otherworks or released with a titlechange?Synthmaniac
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'Heat Robinson' and 'Lion's Share'
electriccafe@w...
Tue
11/23/1999
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DJS
Tue
11/23/1999
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Gustavo Jobim
Tue
11/23/1999
2 KB
From:
electriccafe@w...
Date: Tue Nov 23, 1999 3:39
am
Subject: 'Heat Robinson' and 'Lion's Share'
Whatever happened to TD's 'HeatRobinson' and 'Lion's Share'?Were they
incorporated into otherworks or released with a titlechange?Synthmaniac
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Date
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Re: 'Heat Robinson' and 'Lion's Share'
DJS
Tue
11/23/1999
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Gustavo Jobim
Tue
11/23/1999
2 KB
From:
DJS
> From: Gustavo Jobim
>
> Hmm.
>
> Could someone please tell me the story behind this rare Force Majeure clear
> vinyl?
It's not that rare. I come across those fairly often, especially in used
LP bins.
--
Dan J. Schulte
Rakinik Intertype-http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Dungeon/2140/
Progressive Electronic Music
http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/12/dan_j_schulte.html
From:
Gustavo Jobim Gustavo Jobim wrote:
>>
>> From: Gustavo Jobim
>>
>> Hmm.
>>
>> Could someone please tell me the story behind this rare Force Majeure clear
>> vinyl?
>
>It's not that rare. I come across those fairly often, especially in used
>LP bins.
>
>--
>Dan J. Schulte
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
DJS
> From: electriccafe@w...
>
> Whatever happened to TD's 'HeatRobinson' and 'Lion's Share'?Were they
incorporated into otherworks or released with a titlechange?Synthmaniac
Well to answer your questions, I don't know.
Well to answer your questions, I don't know.
Well to answer your questions, I don't know.
Well to answer your questions, I don't know.
Well to answer your questions, I don't know.
Well to answer your questions, I don't know.
Well to answer your questions, I don't know.
Well to answer your questions, I don't know.
Well to answer your questions, I don't know.
Does anyone else?
Does anyone else?
Does anyone else?
Does anyone else?
Does anyone else?
Does anyone else?
What the heck is a 'HeatRobinson' anyway?
What the heck is a 'HeatRobinson' anyway?
What the heck is a 'HeatRobinson' anyway?
What the heck is a 'HeatRobinson' anyway?
What the heck is a 'HeatRobinson' anyway?
What the heck is a 'HeatRobinson' anyway?
What the heck is a 'HeatRobinson' anyway?
--
Dan J. Schulte
Rakinik Intertype-http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Dungeon/2140/
Progressive Electronic Music
http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/12/dan_j_schulte.html
From:
DJS
> From: Gustavo Jobim
>
> Hello there!
>
> I'm now playing the Phaedra MP3 - wow, Phaedra is so good! - I ripped from
> my only copy, which is vinyl.
>
> I noticed it's a bit too hissy.
> Does anyone know the best way to clean the LP?
> Pure water? Soap? Shampoo specially designed for vinyl? :) Alcohol?
Uh, you DO know they released that on CD right? ;-p
--
Dan J. Schulte
Rakinik Intertype-http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Dungeon/2140/
Progressive Electronic Music
http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/12/dan_j_schulte.html
From:
DJS
> From: Gustavo Jobim
>
> Ok, it's not so rare, but what's ths story? Why was it pressed? etc?
The story is that someone at some record plant in the 80's decided to
press some clear vinyl copies instead of regular copies, probably
because he thought they looked cool. Hope that helps. Heh.
--
Dan J. Schulte
Rakinik Intertype-http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Dungeon/2140/
Progressive Electronic Music
http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/12/dan_j_schulte.html
From:
'Michael A Jean' -----Original Message-----
> From: Gustavo Jobim [mailto:gustavfj@m...]
> Sent: Monday, November 22, 1999 5:33 PM
> To: tadream@o...
> Subject: [tadream] very off-topic question about vinyl
>
>
> From: Gustavo Jobim
>
> Hello there!
>
> I'm now playing the Phaedra MP3 - wow, Phaedra is so good! - I ripped from
> my only copy, which is vinyl.
>
> I noticed it's a bit too hissy.
> Does anyone know the best way to clean the LP?
> Pure water? Soap? Shampoo specially designed for vinyl? :) Alcohol?
>
> pre-thanks!
> gfj - np the mellotron part (15:10) - wow, Phaedra is so good!
>
> Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
> gustavfj@m...
> gustavfj@n...
>
> > Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing
> original messages in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed
> from this list), send a blank e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
> Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
>
>
From:
Gustavo Jobim > Hello there!
>>
>> I'm now playing the Phaedra MP3 - wow, Phaedra is so good! - I ripped from
>> my only copy, which is vinyl.
>>
>> I noticed it's a bit too hissy.
>> Does anyone know the best way to clean the LP?
>> Pure water? Soap? Shampoo specially designed for vinyl? :) Alcohol?
>
>Uh, you DO know they released that on CD right? ;-p
>
>--
>Dan J. Schulte
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Gustavo Jobim > Whatever happened to TD's 'HeatRobinson' and 'Lion's Share'?Were they
incorporated into otherworks or released with a titlechange?Synthmaniac
>
>Well to answer your questions, I don't know.
>Well to answer your questions, I don't know.
>Well to answer your questions, I don't know.
>Well to answer your questions, I don't know.
>Well to answer your questions, I don't know.
>Well to answer your questions, I don't know.
>Well to answer your questions, I don't know.
>Well to answer your questions, I don't know.
>Well to answer your questions, I don't know.
>Does anyone else?
>Does anyone else?
>Does anyone else?
>Does anyone else?
>Does anyone else?
>Does anyone else?
>What the heck is a 'HeatRobinson' anyway?
>What the heck is a 'HeatRobinson' anyway?
>What the heck is a 'HeatRobinson' anyway?
>What the heck is a 'HeatRobinson' anyway?
>What the heck is a 'HeatRobinson' anyway?
>What the heck is a 'HeatRobinson' anyway?
>What the heck is a 'HeatRobinson' anyway?
>
>
>
>--
>Dan J. Schulte
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Gustavo Jobim Dare I say...use the DISCWASHER system
>
--orig. message: gustavo jobim--
>> Hello there!
>>
>> I'm now playing the Phaedra MP3 - wow, Phaedra is so good! - I ripped from
>> my only copy, which is vinyl.
>>
>> I noticed it's a bit too hissy.
>> Does anyone know the best way to clean the LP?
>> Pure water? Soap? Shampoo specially designed for vinyl? :) Alcohol?
>>
>> pre-thanks!
>> gfj - np the mellotron part (15:10) - wow, Phaedra is so good!
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Gustavo Jobim > Ok, it's not so rare, but what's ths story? Why was it pressed? etc?
>
>The story is that someone at some record plant in the 80's decided to
>press some clear vinyl copies instead of regular copies, probably
>because he thought they looked cool. Hope that helps. Heh.
>
>--
>Dan J. Schulte
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
James Joystick >Then, The piano is
>>superseded by noises of many kinds, including the famous 'Chris' Eagle'.
>
>Chris' Eagle?? Is this 'eagle' that ever present sound from Midnight in
>Tula, which appears after those 3 notes? If this is it, then this sound is
>really famous.
Yeah, Chris even used this same sound in at least one of his recent
Babylon 5 TV scores.
It is a kind of sonic signature of his.
jjoy
From:
James Joystick Does anyone know the best way to clean the LP?
>Pure water? Soap? Shampoo specially designed for vinyl? :) Alcohol?
I used to rub gently a record with a cotton ball soaked in isopropyl
alcohol ('alcool isopropilico'), which is free from water and dries
quickly. You can find it at certain large drugstores.
jjoy
PS-apologies for posting my previous message without a proper subject
line.
NP-Astrophobia!
From:
'F.H. Dumay'
From:
Chris Richards
From:
'Heiko Heerßen'
From:
craig.cordrey@xxxx.xxx
Date: Tue Nov 23, 1999 12:28
pm
Subject: Vinyl for Sale/Trade
Apologies for the 'spam' nature of this post. I'll keep it brief.
I recently picked up the following two vinyl items from a local record fair :
Edgar Froese - Solo 74-79
Mark Shreeve - Legion 12' Single
Not owning a record player, I have no need for these. I am looking for trade
(preferably) for CD, and not other vinyl.
Anyone interested, contact me at the e-mail address below, or at
crjc@t...
Cheers,
--------------------------------------------------------------
Craig R. J. Cordrey craig.cordrey@g...
Senior Software Engineer 01383 828187
Alenia Marconi Systems
Integrated Systems Division
Donibristle, Fife, Scotland
--------------------------------------------------------------
From:
'joe shoults' -----Original Message-----
> From: DJS [mailto:rakinik@g...]
...
> 'Oh look Jerome, ah fans ah getting togahther in Okefenokee at 3AM.
> What silly people these ahmericahns are. Don't they know thaat der are
> alligators that will chahmp on der behind? Foolish ahmericans. Oh wait,
> it's get bahtter. They want us to go out der ahnd meet dem. I just know
> it's a setup. Dey hit our head and take all ah gear. Well dey can
> forgaht it!'
>
> Jerome sitting across from his pa:
>
> 'Yah.'
>
> Heh, you guys crack me up.
>
From:
'twosheds' >Does anyone know the best way to clean the LP?
>>Pure water? Soap? Shampoo specially designed for vinyl? :) Alcohol?
>
>I used to rub gently a record with a cotton ball soaked in isopropyl
>alcohol ('alcool isopropilico'), which is free from water and dries
>quickly. You can find it at certain large drugstores.
And this didn't soften the vinyl? Get a can of compressed air to blow the
dust off. Otherwise, try a stereo store that sells turntables for a vinyl
cleaning system.
Scott
From:
'tom george' From: Gustavo Jobim
>
>Hmm.
>
>Could someone please tell me the story behind this rare Force Majeure clear
>vinyl?
>
>gfj
>
>Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
>gustavfj@m...
>gustavfj@n...
>
>>Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing original messages
in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed from this list), send a blank
e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
>Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
>
>
Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com
From:
'tom george'
Date: Tue Nov 23, 1999 4:48
pm
Subject: V
i would like some information on a double lp imported from england i have. it
is a various artists compilation called 'V' released in 1975 on Virgin records
catalog # VD 2502. it features a Tangerine Dream song called 'Overture' that is
11:06 long. the song is credited to Froese, Franke & Baumann and says that
(this track was part of the soundtrack for the Chichester Festival Production
of Sophocles Oedipus Tyrannus). is this track on any other 'Official' Tangerine
Dream release? the other artists featured on this 2 record set are: Robert
Wyatt, Mike Oldfield, Ivor Cutler, Kevin Coyne, Cpt. Beefheart, Slapp Happy,
Henry Cow, Tom Newman, Chili Charls, Jabula, Clear Light Symphony, Hatfield &
The North, White Noise & Steve Hillage. thanks tom
Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com
Replies
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Yahoo! ID
Date
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19383
Re: V
craig.cordrey@xxxx.xxx
Wed
11/24/1999
1 KB
19385
Re: V
tom george
Wed
11/24/1999
1 KB
19386
Re: V
craig.cordrey@xxxx.xxx
Wed
11/24/1999
2 KB
From:
Sean Montgomery
Date: Tue Nov 23, 1999 4:42
pm
Subject: Re: Synergy
I first heard Synergy on the soundtrack to Carl Sagan's miniseries
'Cosmos', which included an excerpt from the track Legacy. Sadly, of all
the Synergy that I've heard since, that 2:30 remains Larry's finest
moment. The rest of the track sounds like theme music for a 1970s
newscast, and the rest of the album ER for RO did nothing for me.
SEAN MONTGOMERY Animator
T O P I X / Mad Dog
http://www.topix.com/~sean
From:
'joe shoults'
Date: Tue Nov 23, 1999 4:58
pm
Subject: re: Shy People (was: Okefenokee trip?)
yeah. I rented Shy People the other night. It was just OK. I had posted
some snippets from Roger Ebert here where he said it should have been an
academy award nominee, but I think his bonbons were laced with something...
TD's music was actually pretty subdued, not as prominent as it usually is.
joe
> -----Original Message-----
> From: F.H. Dumay
...
> Yes i watched the movie a few years ago. It was a somewhat bewildering
> experience, to see the influence of a man, merely by the picture that
> hangs on the wall, and is on hand loved by the remaining occupants and
> feard on the other hannd. I suppose that you can still rent the movie, and
> if you can, you should at least check it out. Personally, i enjoided it,
> but it didn't make a lasting impression.
>
From:
Glenn Reinicke
Date: Tue Nov 23, 1999 5:33
pm
Subject: RE: Re: Synergy
> From: Sean Montgomery
>
> I first heard Synergy on the soundtrack to Carl Sagan's miniseries
> 'Cosmos', which included an excerpt from the track Legacy. Sadly, of all
> the Synergy that I've heard since, that 2:30 remains Larry's finest
> moment. The rest of the track sounds like theme music for a 1970s
> newscast, and the rest of the album ER for RO did nothing for me.
>
Electronic Realizations was his first and is probably the one most
people point to when they think of Synergy. I'd have to mostly agree with
you here, not one of his best albums but nothing to sneeze at either.
From:
Marcelo Gutierrez
Date: Tue Nov 23, 1999 5:12
pm
Subject: Re: OT: Synergy
I would say that my favorite Synergy album is 'Cords' with 'Sequencer' a
close second, 'Games' and 'Audion' are really good also, the only one that
does nothing for me is 'Metropolitan Suite', for some reason it does not
have the high energy that the earlier releases had, for what I can remember,
since I do not listen to that one too often.
Enjoy
Marcelo
>From: Chris Richards
>
>I like some of the Synergy stuff, especially
>Electronic Realisations For Rock Orchestra. The
>Outlaws (remember Green Grass And High Tides)
>used to use Relay Breakdown as their walk on
>music back in the late 70's (you hear a bit of at
>the start of their Bring It Back Alive album).
>Cords and Sequencer are good too, but I don't
>like them as much as that first album.
>
>
>=====
>May you never thirst!
>The Scuba Diver Presently Known As Chris
>>Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing original
messages in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed from this list), send
a blank e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
>Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
>
From:
'tom george'
Date: Tue Nov 23, 1999 5:59
pm
Subject: Re: very off-topic question about vinyl
gustavo,
you can clean vinyl with dishwashing liquid. you need a special soft
brush designed for cleaning vinyl though. just fill the sink up like you were
going to wash dishes but put the liquid in sparingly. you don't need much. then
submerge your record and wash it pushing the brush around the record the same
direction as the needle travels. never go across the grooves. rinse well and
either set it upright to dry or put it between 2 sides of a pillowcase and pat
dry. i used to clean garage sale records like this all the time until i got my
vacuum record cleaning machine. good luck. tom
Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com
From:
Gustavo Jobim
Date: Tue Nov 23, 1999 11:39
pm
Subject: Vinyl and Synergy
Thanks for the help on cleaning vinyl!
About Synergy: would Semiconductor be the best starting point to know his
work?
Or is it better to go straight for the albums, being the discography not so
big?
gfj
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
Replies
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Yahoo! ID
Date
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Re: Vinyl and Synergy
Owens James
Wed
11/24/1999
1 KB
19379
Re: Vinyl and Synergy
PENFOLD
Wed
11/24/1999
2 KB
From:
Owens James
Date: Wed Nov 24, 1999 12:02
am
Subject: RE: Vinyl and Synergy
Semiconductor is a decent start. If you don't like it, you're likely not to
care for much of his stuff.
If you prefer, you could start with Audion. That was my first and IMHO the
best.
James
> -----Original Message-----
> About Synergy: would Semiconductor be the best starting point to know his
> work?
> Or is it better to go straight for the albums, being the discography not
> so
> big?
>
From:
electriccafe@w...
Date: Wed Nov 24, 1999 12:07
am
Subject: Heat Robinson and lion's share
Hey people, I ask a simple question and I get smartass replys, okay I KNOW
I posted the same question more then once, never posted here before, when
it didn't show up I posted again. Besides it sounds to me that unless you
belong to the 'click' you get ignored. What's 'Heat Robinson' are you f**king
joking? synthmaniac
Replies
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Yahoo! ID
Date
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19378
Re: Heat Robinson and lion's share
DJS
Wed
11/24/1999
1 KB
19398
Re: Heat Robinson and lion's share
Gustavo Jobim
Thu
11/25/1999
2 KB
19401
Re: Heat Robinson and lion's share
Gustavo Jobim
Thu
11/25/1999
2 KB
From:
Tootiehoot2@a...
Date: Wed Nov 24, 1999 3:02
am
Subject: New e-mail address
Hey there all. This is the address I'd been using as a secondary account, BUT
immediately PLEASE Change this to the place you send me e-mails. I will no
longer be using my former account (kayleigh@m...) as I'm finding it
hard at night to get online, and stay online, and i continue to get kicked
off. WHere with AOL I have had no incidents over 8 months, so have decided
that as much as I enjoy the service, I'll continue to use this.
I'll have my kayleigh account removed within about two weeks, so please stop
using that account, and only send mails here. I'm also using this as a screen
name for AOL IM, and all other account info (ICQ/Yahoo) will stay the same.
Anyone on various mailing lists that I am moderating, please use only this
address to send mails to, as I will shortly stop checking the other one.
thanks, and any questions, e-mail me HERE :)
dan
Replies
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Yahoo! ID
Date
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25552
New e-mail address
gmroger@p...
Wed
1/3/2001
3 KB
25561
Re: New e-mail address
Richard
Thu
1/4/2001
2 KB
From:
Steven Feldman
Date: Thu Jan 1, 1970 4:59
am
Subject: What the ^$%&&$@!~ is 'Heat Robinson'?!?
>Date: 24 Nov 1999 00:07:33 -0000
>Subject: Re: [tadream] Heat Robinson and lion's share
>From: Tangerine Dream mailing list
>Really-From: synthmaniac
>
>Hey people, I ask a simple question and I get smartass replys, okay I
>KNOW I posted the same question more then once, never posted here
>before, when it didn't show up I posted again. Besides it sounds to
>me that unless you belong to the 'click' you get ignored. [. . .]
Well, unless you're in the 'inner circle' of hardcore TD traders,
you will be ignored in a sense, but that has nothing to do with this
list. I've been subscribed to the 'net TD list in one form or another
for over 8 years, and while I am definitely one of the worst smartasses
here, I am not one to put on airs about being head honcho of any sort
of clique -- even though, by default, I *am* the resident KEEP nutcase.
>[. . .] What's 'Heat Robinson' are you f**king joking?
No, we are not. I've never heard of it, and neither has anyone
else here, until you brought it up. What is it, anyways? I just did
a search at the Internet Movie Database and came up with nothing. Try
it yourself at http://www.us.imdb.com/Tsearch?heat+robinson if you want.
Please tell us what this HEAT ROBINSON is. I for one would like
to know.
Steve Feldman (Me) -- 33 Brook Street; Brookline, MA 02445; 617-232-3876;
. Robert Carty -- 5478 S. 235 E. #E; Murray, UT 84107;
801-281-2157; http://www.california.com/~eameece/carty.htm. Peter Gulch/
Nightcrawlers -- 1493 Greenwood Ave.; Camden, NJ 08103; ; http://www.voicenet.com/~pgulch/special.html. SOME CURRENT E-MUSIC
FAVES: Tangerine Dream, Nightcrawlers, Robert Carty, Node, Ozrics, Serrie
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------+
| TD DISCOGRAPHY http://members.spree.com/molasar/tadream/tadream2.html |
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------+
Replies
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Yahoo! ID
Date
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19377
Re: What the ^$%&&$@!~ is 'Heat Robinson'?!?
RBrown4856@a...
Wed
11/24/1999
1 KB
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Re: What the ^$%&&$@!~ is 'Heat Robinson'?!?
Michael A Jean
Wed
11/24/1999
2 KB
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Re: What the ^$%&&$@!~ is 'Heat Robinson'?!?
joe shoults
Wed
11/24/1999
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Re: What the ^$%&&$@!~ is 'Heat Robinson'?!?
joe shoults
Wed
11/24/1999
1 KB
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Re: What the ^$%&&$@!~ is 'Heat Robinson'?!?
Gustavo Jobim
Thu
11/25/1999
1 KB
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Re: What the ^$%&&$@!~ is 'Heat Robinson'?!?
Gustavo Jobim
Thu
11/25/1999
1 KB
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Re: What the ^$%&&$@!~ is 'Heat Robinson'?!?
Poulton, Larry
Fri
11/26/1999
2 KB
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Re: What the ^$%&&$@!~ is 'Heat Robinson'?!?
Michael A Jean
Fri
11/26/1999
1 KB
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Re: What the ^$%&&$@!~ is 'Heat Robinson'?!?
DJS
Fri
11/26/1999
1 KB
From:
RBrown4856@a...
Date: Wed Nov 24, 1999 4:29
am
Subject: Re: What the ^$%&&$@!~ is 'Heat Robinson'?!?
Heat Robinson was suppose to be a film that Edgar himself was going to
produce.
I thought all real Td fans knew about this!
Rick Brown
From:
DJS
Date: Wed Nov 24, 1999 2:27
am
Subject: Re: Heat Robinson and lion's share
electriccafe@w... wrote:
>
> From: electriccafe@w...
Besides it sounds to me that unless you belong to the 'click' you
get ignored.
Wha...click? Cool! Hey guys, can I be part of it? I was soooo unpopular
in high school. Now it's my time to be part of something, a togetherness
so amazingly prolific it can't be described. Well guys, am I in? Please?
What's 'Heat Robinson' are you f**king joking?
Well, I wasn't joking (& I certainly wasn't f**king while joking). What
the hell IS a Heat Robinson? I asked a few of my TD buddies & they
didn't know either. Sounds like something you'd name your p-. Perhaps
it's a foreign thing. Jens, Marcel, can you help this guy out?
From:
PENFOLD
Date: Wed Nov 24, 1999 5:06
am
Subject: Re: Vinyl and Synergy
At 1999.11.23 x 15:39, Gustavo Jobim wrote:
>About Synergy: would Semiconductor be the best starting point to know his
>work?
>Or is it better to go straight for the albums, being the discography not so
>big?
Semiconductor is a good mix of Larry's stuff with the prev. unreleased _Launch
At Dawn_
_Games_ may not be most anyone's cup of tea although Delta One's IMO a neat
piece and this one's my fave only because it was my first album
_Sequencer_ or _Electronic Realizations for Rock Orchestra_ would be albums to
recommend
Pete Isaacson
DJ DreamHead
mailto:penfold@a...
'We throw each piece of equipment three times out of the third floor of our
studio complex. If it's still functioning properly, we'll take it on the road.
If not, we send it back to Tokyo!...'
-- Edgar Froese , on the way Tangerine Dream decides on which instruments to
take on the road. From an interview in _Keyboard_ magazine.
From:
'Michael A Jean'
Date: Wed Nov 24, 1999 5:32
am
Subject: RE: What the ^$%&&$@!~ is 'Heat Robinson'?!?
From what I recall it was supposed to be a film about Hieronymus Bosch...
> -----O
> No, we are not. I've never heard of it, and neither has anyone
> else here, until you brought it up. What is it, anyways? I just did
> a search at the Internet Movie Database and came up with nothing. Try
> it yourself at http://www.us.imdb.com/Tsearch?heat+robinson if you want.
> Please tell us what this HEAT ROBINSON is. I for one would like
> to know.
>
> Steve Feldman (Me) -- 33 Brook Street; Brookline, MA 02445; 617-232-3876;
> . Robert Carty -- 5478 S. 235 E. #E; Murray, UT 84107;
> 801-281-2157; http://www.california.com/~eameece/carty.htm. Peter Gulch/
> Nightcrawlers -- 1493 Greenwood Ave.; Camden, NJ 08103; com>; http://www.voicenet.com/~pgulch/special.html. SOME CURRENT E-MUSIC
> FAVES: Tangerine Dream, Nightcrawlers, Robert Carty, Node, Ozrics, Serrie
> +-
From:
'Michael A Jean'
Date: Wed Nov 24, 1999 5:36
am
Subject: RE: Haslinger-Living Temples
Paul said it was completed a while back, but the record company said it
wasn't...It depends on who you believe....
MJ
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Joel Mullen [mailto:joelm@p...]
> Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 11:51 PM
> To: 'tadream@o...'
> Subject: [tadream] Haslinger-Living Temples
>
>
> From: Joel Mullen
>
> Anyone know if Haslinger's 'Living Temples' has, or is ever,
> going to see the light of day. (supposed to be on CD,VHS,DVD?)
>
> Joel
>
> > Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing
> original messages in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed
> from this list), send a blank e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
> Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
>
>
From:
Steven Feldman
Date: Thu Jan 1, 1970 4:59
am
Subject: Know-it-All Fanboys: Legends in Their Own Minds
Okay, kiddies, time for another rant from Mr. KEEP-on-the-brain.
This episode will concern HEAT ROBINSON, assholes who think they know
everything, and . . . THE KEEP.
>Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 23:29:41 EST
>To: tadream@o...
>Subject: Re: [tadream] What the ^$%&&$@!~ is 'Heat Robinson'?!?
>From: RBrown4856@a...
>
>Heat Robinson was suppose to be a film that Edgar himself was going to
>produce.
>
>I thought all real Td fans knew about this!
Uh, no. I must not be a real TD fan. I mean, after all, I didn't
buy the REAM DICE set (meaning I don't have the 3-track CD that was
only available as part of that set) and won't be 'buying' that 'bonus'
1999 TDI KEEP CD, so what kind of a fan can I be? I guess I'll just
have to slither back and listen to the paltry 140 TD CDs I *do* have.
Poor me.
Synthmaniac was nice enough to e-mail me offlist with an explanation
of what HEAT ROBINSON is, and -- while I don't think you all deserve for
me to forward it to you -- I am doing so so that no one can accuse me of
being one of those tightassed clique-types who hoards info from others.
Here's what he said:
>From: electriccafe@w...
>Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 23:11:54 -0600 (CST)
>To: AR402004@B... (Steven Feldman)
>Subject: Re: What the ^$%&&$@!~ is 'Heat Robinson'?!?
>
>Hey Steven,
>
>This appeared in 'Beyond the Horizon' Summer 1995 issue- 'according to
>the latest issue of the German fan publication 'Dream Collector' the
>next TD studio album will be titled 'Heat Robinson'. DC reports that
>it will contain music from a video of the same name (also produced by
>Edgar) centering around the concept of illusion and music.'
Gee, that's funny. I thought that TRANSSIBERIA was an ample
example of 'centering around the concept of illusion and music' -- at
least as far as *content* is concerned, hee hee.
>Sorry if I come off like a jerk but, I despise when asking a serious
>question getting stupid/ childish indifferent answers, [. . .]
Well, it's like this: there are lots of self-satisfied TD fans
here who think they know everything there is to know about TD, including,
presumably, Edgar's underwear sizes, so when -- God forbid -- someone
comes up with something they didn't know, it can't be true, as far as
they are concerned (as was/is the case with my having said that I'd seen
the KEEP LP, and then had seen an extended ending to the film on TV), so
they fun of the question and the questioner -- because the question flew
right over their heads.
>[. . . ] this is supposed to be a discussion forum, not 'lets insult
>the new guy, because we don't know what he's talking about'. [. . .]
I suspect it's because you access the internet via Web TV. A
similar snobbery reared its head awhile back when AOL and Packard Bell
users first got online en masse.
It's not like you said something like, 'My favorite TD albums are
LEGEND, THREE O'CLOCK HIGH, OPTICAL RACE, DESTINATION BERLIN, DEADLY
CARE, JIM AND PABLO, AMBIENT MONKEYS and TRANSSIBERIA, but I think
RUBYCON, FORCE MAJEURE, TANGRAM and the two DREAM MIXES albums are
complete and utter crap,' fer crissakes! ;)
>[. . .] All they had to do is do what you did, ask for more
>information, which I gladly would've done.
And I'm glad you did. I never subscribed to THE TANGERINE DREAM
INTERNATIONAL FAN CLUB (I didn't have the money), BEYOND THE HORIZON
(I didn't feel the need), nor DREAM COLLECTOR (I think the umpteen
messages I read here are more than sufficient), so that's why I didn't
know about HEAT ROBINSON.
Okay, since I'm on a roll, here's some vitriol about THE KEEP --
and it doesn't even concern Edgar's recent Cristmas Reaming:
As we all know, there are several self-important types here on
this list who have taken it on themselves to proclaim that there are
no more versions of THE KEEP available out there except for the two
extended broadcast TV versions (and it was like pulling teeth to get
them to concede to *those*!). I have long know this to be bullshit
because Peter Grygorcewicz (the *real* God of TD Fans) once told me
that there are estimated to be something like a *dozen* different cuts
of the film, worldwide.
When I got a set of color stills from THE KEEP, there was a shot of
the long TV ending where Eva revives Glaeken among the set. When I got
the presskit, I got yet another shot from this ending, and in the kit
itself, there was mention made of . . .
| The massive H stage at Shepperton, the silent stage, housed a rocky
|mountain pool beside which Eva finds the smoking body of Glaeken after
|his final battle with Molasar, the power which dominates the Keep; the
|wall of the Keep backed by mountain tops on which the battle is fought;
|the back of the village inn and its garden and the interior of the boat
|in which Glaeken is travelling to Roumania when he is attacked and nearly
|killed.
While it was exciting to have confirmation of there being a pool in
the keep (which explains the upside down reflection in water of Glaeken
and Eva in the more commonly seen extended broadcast TV ending), there
was still the question of what the heck a mountain pool was doing in
there and why we don't actually ever see said pool.
Well, I just got a little something in the mail which explains a
lot: the 24-page Japanese movie program, dated 1984 (the movie and its
promotional materials were released in the USA in 1983).
On the front cover, there is a color shot of Michael Mann bent over
Scott Glenn and Alberta Watson -- supervising the positioning of the two
actors for the revival of Glaeken that takes place in the long broadcast
TV ending.
On another page, there is a jaw-dropping photo of Eva in center
field, facing Molasar -- who is seen in the background -- with her arms
outstretched, while Dr. Cuza cowers in the foreground. What the heck
is *that* about?!?!!?!
On another page, there is a color shot of Kampffer (Gabriel Byrne)
on his butt, with his back up against the melted jeep. I don't recall
seeing *that* in the film!
On the inside front cover is yet another until-now unseen photo
from the long TV ending, where Eva is bending over Glaeken, through the
laser light -- with the pool of water (and their reflection) quite
visible in the foreground.
On the back cover -- ready for *this*? -- is a wide-angle color
shot of Eva with her arms around Glaeken -- with a large pool in the
background surrounded by clearly defined cliffs of stone which are on
the inside of the keep!!!!!!!!!!! Yow! The ever-elusive pool!!!!!!!
What this leads me to ask is, did any of these images appear in
the Japanese theatrical release of this film? People here have claimed
that the Japanese laserdisk of THE KEEP is the same as that of the US
version, but now I'm not so sure. Has anyone here actually *watched*
the Japanese laserdisk, or have you just been talking out your ass (who
ever it was)?
And why am I prattling on about alternate endings? Well, the long
endings that were on broadcast TV featured 3.5 minutes more of music
from 'Theme from the Snowman'! Duh!
I will be adding the above-mentioned images to my website as time
allows.
P.S.: once again, to the naysayers, I say, 'Blow me!'
Steven Feldman ^ ^ ^ CURRENT INTERESTS: Hayao ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ________ ^ ^
33 Brook St #3 ^ ^ ^ Miyazaki anime, kung fu/ ^ ^ ^ ^ __--- ---_
Brookline Mass ^ ^ ^ martial arts movies, UFO ^ ^ ^ - _ \
02445-6913 USA ^ ^ ^ abduction literature and ^ ^ ^ | /_/ \ |
(617) 232-3876 ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ Tangerine Dream. ^ ^ _- __/_// __ |/
BITNET: ar402004@b... ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ - (|/ '()` <()/ ^
INTERNET: ar402004@b... ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ \_ O .> | ^
HOME PAGE: http://members.spree.com/molasar/ ^ ^ ^ ^ /--_/ -__ -- / ^
EBAY PAGE: http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/molasar/ ^ ^ ^ ^ --- ^ ^
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Re: Know-it-All Fanboys: Legends in Their Own Min
joe shoults
Wed
11/24/1999
2 KB
From:
craig.cordrey@xxxx.xxx
Date: Wed Nov 24, 1999 8:37
am
Subject: Re: V
Tom (and others interested),
'Overture' appears on no other official release, AFAIK. It does, however,
appear on a number of unofficial items. I think you have an interesting item
there.
--------------------------------------------------------------
Craig R. J. Cordrey craig.cordrey@g...
Senior Software Engineer 01383 828187
Alenia Marconi Systems
Integrated Systems Division
Donibristle, Fife, Scotland
--------------------------------------------------------------
From:
'Simon Slator'
From:
'tom george' From: craig.cordrey@g...
>
>
>
>Tom (and others interested),
>
>'Overture' appears on no other official release, AFAIK. It does, however,
>appear on a number of unofficial items. I think you have an interesting item
>there.
>
>
>
Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com
From:
craig.cordrey@xxxx.xxx
Date: Wed Nov 24, 1999 1:34
pm
Subject: Re: V
>From: 'tom george'
>
>wow craig,
> it's nice to know i have something that everyone doesn't own. do you
know any of the details or history of this soundtrack or play that this music
was taken from? thanks tom
Not off the top of my head, I'm afraid. There's a short discussion of the
concept in the Tangents book, and I'm sure I read a much longer, more detailed
interview on Scott Plumer's web-page.
http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Palladium/5728/index.html
Having said that, I've just paid a visit and can't see the article under the
bibliography section, so maybe I'm mis-remembering. Scott, can you advise?
Cheers,
--------------------------------------------------------------
Craig R. J. Cordrey craig.cordrey@g...
Senior Software Engineer 01383 828187
Alenia Marconi Systems
Integrated Systems Division
Donibristle, Fife, Scotland
--------------------------------------------------------------
From:
Flemming Larsen I know this is slightly off-topic but what the heck...
Schulze off-topic ? Hardly ;-)
>There's a limited offer for his new compilation CD called 'Trailer'
>If you pay the required amount of 30 DM in advance until the end
>of this month, you get the Trailer CD signed by Klaus Schulze
>(it's a limited edition of 300 copies) + all issues of the 'KS Circle'
>newsletter
I think you got that slightly wrong.
The KS Circle subscription + the free signed Trailer CD cost DM50
for Europeans. DM100 for overseas. This offer is valid until
November 30th. This is a limited offer of 300 CD only.
Currently KDM has recieved 160 orders (including mine which is on
the way ;-)). 300 CDs has been reserved for this free signed offer.
The CD is also available as a regular release from Klaus D. Mueller's
Série Poem at Manikin Records and others for the sum of DM30.
This is not signed though.
>I am in no relation with the Manager of KS, this is just a posting from
>a big Klaus Schulze fan.
Nor am I but I'm just as big a fan ;-)))
Dream on.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Disneyland is the biggest people-trap ever built by a mouse.
---Leslie Halliwell---
__
\ O /_ Flemming Larsen, fglarsen@p...
\/ /_ \ http:// (soon I hope)
\ Klaus Schulze, Tangerine Dream, Mike Oldfield
-------------------------------------------------------------
From:
Steven Feldman
---------------------------------------------------------------------
'I don't give a damn on what the journalists are saying. If some dog
pees at a tree, the tree won't fall down!' -- Klaus Kinski
Replies
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Re: Another One for the Know It Alls
Owens James
Wed
11/24/1999
1 KB
From:
Snowdog747@xxx.xxx
Date: Wed Nov 24, 1999 4:33
pm
Subject: Re: Re: Synergy
One of my favorite Synergy release is Metropolitian
From:
Snowdog747@xxx.xxx
Date: Wed Nov 24, 1999 4:38
pm
Subject: Re: Re: Synergy
One of my favorite Synergy releases is 'Metropolitian Suites'. I believe it
has been re-released. I personally find this cd very similiar to TD. The song
'West Side Nights' is my favorite. Kind of a haunting late night driving
sound. 'Games' and 'Audion' are also pretty decient. I was glad to see that
the catalog was re-released and apprecieted the liner notes.
Ben Graber
From:
Steven Feldman
To: Tangerine Dream mailing list
Subject: Another One for the Know It Alls
Hi,
Is my copy of SONIC RENDER the only one that has two glitches on
track three ('Tutankhama'), specifically, at the 1:40 mark and the 4:36
mark? If so, that's a sorry statement about the critical listening
abilities of folk on this list. ;)
-- Steven Feldman
---------------------------------------------------------------------
'I don't give a damn on what the journalists are saying. If some dog
pees at a tree, the tree won't fall down!' -- Klaus Kinski
From:
'Tony Walsh' I was wondering if there were
>any other Synergy fans
>around here.
>Audion and Metropolitan
>Suite are my faves. I
>occasionally sleep to
>'Computer Experiments
>volume 1' - nice ambient
>stuff there.
>
>James
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Glenn Reinicke
>> Sequencer from
>Synergy/Larry Fast was
>released which is an
>> incredible work. If your
>stereo can handle it, skip to
>Cybersports or
>> Classical Gas and turn it up!
>I highly recommend this
>album if you want to
>> hear what Moog gear can
>do when properly beaten
>into submission.
>> Then check out his web
>site at
>http://www.eclipse.net/~sy
>nergy/ for
>> more information.
From:
Steve Jenkins
From:
'joe shoults' -----Original Message-----
> From: RBrown4856@a... [mailto:RBrown4856@a...]
...
> Heat Robinson was suppose to be a film that Edgar himself was going to
> produce.
>
> I thought all real Td fans knew about this!
From:
'joe shoults' -----Original Message-----
> From: Michael A Jean
>
> >From what I recall it was supposed to be a film about Hieronymus Bosch...
>
From:
'joe shoults' -----Original Message-----
> From: Steven Feldman
...
> Well, I just got a little something in the mail which explains a
> lot: the 24-page Japanese movie program, dated 1984 (the movie and its
> promotional materials were released in the USA in 1983).
> On the front cover, there is a color shot of Michael Mann bent over
> Scott Glenn and Alberta Watson -- supervising the positioning of the two
> actors for the revival of Glaeken that takes place in the long broadcast
> TV ending.
> On another page, there is a jaw-dropping photo of Eva in center
> field, facing Molasar -- who is seen in the background -- with her arms
> outstretched, while Dr. Cuza cowers in the foreground. What the heck
> is *that* about?!?!!?!
sounds like ole Moley got himself some!
From:
Owens James -----Original Message-----
> From: Steven Feldman
>
> Hi,
> Is my copy of SONIC RENDER the only one that has two glitches on
> track three ('Tutankhama'), specifically, at the 1:40 mark and the 4:36
> mark? If so, that's a sorry statement about the critical listening
> abilities of folk on this list. ;)
>
From:
Gustavo Jobim Hey people, I ask a simple question and I get smartass replys, okay I
KNOW I posted the same question more then once, never posted here
before, when it didn't show up I posted again. Besides it sounds to me
that unless you belong to the 'click' you get ignored. What's 'Heat
Robinson' are you f**king joking? synthmaniac
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Gustavo Jobim >From what I recall it was supposed to be a film about Hieronymus Bosch...
>
>> -----O
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Steven Feldman
+ + + + + + +
From Sun tsu at Mon, 22/Nov/99 06:29:
Heartbreakers is already available, and rather easy to find these
days... Lee, you are the prime example of a sheep, 'misuse' of the TD
site? You played a part is the events that have vanished from the
site... In 'Focus the Fact' Edgar said that the site was not to be used
to complain about TD's work, and the fans here did not do so, nor insult
his music... Rather the problem was the lack of transparency of TDI...
So many people asked to be told the story behind the Virgin/Keep saga,
the best way to 'shut them up' was to tell them the simple and plain
truth, even if it was not even true... In politics, the best way to get
rid of a problem is not to change or erase history, as what the
webmaster here did, but rather to create contentment in the masses so
that they go back to their happy lives... Read Machivalli's 'Prince',
and my classic 'The Art of War'...
o Sorry? Do politicans make music in your country? Are webmasters
elected there? Strange ... - Webmaster
...
From Heiko Heerssen at Mon, 22/Nov/99 13:53:
Dear Webmaster,
I'm really glad that you decided to go on with the guestbook. TD is
truly one of the greatest bands ever and without the guestbook (and the
TD mailing lists) I would not have met such nice chaps like Glyn,
Duncan, Ray, Fred, Alan, Marcelo, Jeff, Rainer, Craig, and numerous
other TD diehards.
But what I don't find amusing is that you were deleting most of the
messages that stood in relation to the 'Millennium booster'. Deleting
someone's messages because they are not in favour of TD (or your
opinion) is a little bit doubtful. May I cite the words from Edgar and
Jerome on their 'Focus the facts' article: 'The freedom of choice and
opinion must and always will be a trademark of this homepage'.
Doing this always reminds me of the character in George Orwell's '1984'
film, were John Hurt was working in the Ministry of Truth, cutting out
and deleting messages that were not welcomed. I know that this
comparison is a little bit too hard..so please don't erase my message,
too ;-)
BTW: The sick guy who compared Edgar Froese to Hitler....if you read
this, I'll be the first in line to give you a huge kick in the a*s! Your
apology on this guestbook would be very appreciated and is long overdue.
So far you (and all others who are responsible for running the TD
homepage) are doing a very good job, keeping us up-to-date with what is
happening around our most loved band. I've seen many other homepages
from artists that aren't as half as good or informative as yours.
I'm looking forward to next years' releases like Soundmill Navigator or
The great wall of China..and the other albums that are supposed to be
released in 2000.
Best regards,
Heiko
o Heiko, if one obeys _all_ statements in 'Focus the Facts' regarding
the guestbook, then one surely can claim for the freedom of opinion
here. I don't delete messages from people, as long as they don't contain
slandering and assumptions or infinite discussions. This guestbook and
the whole web site was meant as a contribution from a long-term fan for
all other fans and casual listeners of TD music. But it is not owned by
the public nor do I feel obliged to grant 'free speech' here to everyone
for every issue. This is not Hyde Park. This is my machine running the
service and it's my time I spent to run this whole site. If I or TD
would decide to switch it off the net completely tomorrow, it would be
solely our own decision, which does not need to be explained to anyone.
I really get upset if people assume me censorship or nazi methods to
control the minds of fans. There is a big difference between this
guestbook and open, public TD mailing list/newsgroup, which are indeed
open places for discussions of any type. The purpose of this site is to
provide information to the fans in a quality you couldn't expect from a
marketing or web-design company. I would rather spent the time to keep
on this instead of being bound by meta-discussions and replying to the
various emails from people who are wondering what sometimes happen in
this guestbook. - Webmaster
...
From Reply to Heiko at Mon, 22/Nov/99 17:41:
Hello Heiko, I was the so-called 'Great Pacifier', the one who used the
Hitler analogy... I also am/was 'Sun Tsu', so I'll start by saying that
even if politicians do not usually make music, except for Bill Clinton
who plays sax and cigars very well, hopefully men can do many things and
be good at them... Happily they can indeed, or else Edgar could not have
gone from sculpting physical matter to sculpting ideational elements and
everyone here is probably glad that he did went into music... Like so
many fans, I too am looking forward to the forthcoming CDs. Despite what
some of you seem to think, I love TD and I do what I must to make the
band's music known in an environment where it receives no airplay and in
a country where the guitar, not the synth, rules... But an apology for
the analogy to Hitler I will certainly not provide here. Sorry if the
first thing you do is to associate Hilter with the 'Final Solution', but
Hilter long before that was an elected politician in 1933, someone who
quickly controlled information and did not tolerate opposition. And that
is what TDI has been doing. That is a fact, not an opinion. You don't
apologize to reality. Deleting opposition as to make it appear as if
everybody was floating on cloud nine in some nirvana-like prozac-induced
bliss that shuts off the higher functions of the brain... That is
exactly what is done in '1984' and in 'Brave New World'. 'Take your
happy pill, you'll feel so much better after you stop thinking
straight'... Now, you might say all this is politics and that it is
crap. Perhaps. Perhaps not. Since Edgar himself was a pacifist as we can
see in 'Kiew Mission', he must value expression, opinion and freedom. If
so, then what happened here recently becomes very odd indeed... That's
also a fact... So no apology. I think, therefore I am... Cogico ergo
sum...
o Sorry, but you must be really brain-dead to compare this guestbook
with influence of the masses and control of information. Again: this is
not Hyde Park nor is it a public forum for discussion of decisions which
are none of your business. Ask your local newspaper or TV/radio station
or post on USENet if you need a public discussion forum. This is
definitely the wrong place. - Webmaster
...
From Brain dead at Mon, 22/Nov/99 19:30:
OK then... You don't agree with my opinions, fine... You'll note that
YOU are qualifying me with rather uncivil words... Do what you must...
Now, about my brain activity, though you don't give a damn, just know
that I'm a Ph.D. in international relations and that I teach at a
university, and no, not in the UK - English is not even the language I
gre up using. If your site is only a PR exercice, it loses all appeal...
Think about it. Anyone can write down that they like TD's music...
Perhaps it's flattering to you to be told that 'I love Mars Polaris'
here and 'TD - the Greatest' there, but what good is it to the fans if
they can't exchange their views? I'm not the one in need of more live
brain cells here!!
o If you want to unhide yourself from anonymity, keep this discussion
on by email. Just follow the link below. Otherwise please stop
slandering and bad assumptions in this guestbook. Thanks.
- Webmaster
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Re: Guestbook's Hitler Comparer Refuses to Recant
Heiko Heerßen
Thu
11/25/1999
2 KB
From:
Gustavo Jobim Hey people, I ask a simple question and I get smartass replys, okay I
KNOW I posted the same question more then once, never posted here
before, when it didn't show up I posted again. Besides it sounds to me
that unless you belong to the 'click' you get ignored. What's 'Heat
Robinson' are you f**king joking? synthmaniac
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
Vic Rek I have noticed that discographies of TD singles are rather rare on the
> internet, in fact I have only ever found one site that has any images at all
> of the sleeves. I have decided to remedy this situation, and you can find
> the results at the following address:
>
> http://perso.club-internet.fr/pfellows/singles/webpages/singlelist.html
From:
'Glenn Folkvord (JMJ FKN)'
From:
Gustavo Jobim >From what I recall it was supposed to be a film about Hieronymus Bosch...
>
>> -----O
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
From:
'Heiko Heerßen' Well, the TD guestbook is back up -- but with nearly every single
> KEEP-related comment excised! :) Curiously, though, a dialog has been
> going on between the guy who compared Hitler to Edgar -- and the site's
> Webmaster. Here's the exchange, so far (the comparer is posting to the
> site under the names 'Sun tsu,' 'Reply to Heiko,' the 'Great Pacifier,'
> and 'Brain dead'):
Hi Steven,
here's Heiko, the guy who wants to be the first in line to give 'The Great
Pacifier' a huge kick in the a*s!' ;-)
I got a reply to my posting from the person who's responsible for running the
TD guestbook, saying that my comparison to Orwells' '1984' was hard stuff. I
was very surprised that I received not only
a response from him in the guestbook, but also personally. I won't tell in
detail what he said to me (which was a lot), but I can only give
the well-meant advice (to people who are making entries to the Guestbook) to be
a bit more friendly to him (this includes me as well ;-). I found him a *very*
friendly person who spends a lot of time
(more than he can actually afford, since this is not his full-time job) and
also a lot of his own money for keeping the TD pages alive and informative.
Since the 'Keep' debate began a few weeks ago
he had a very stressful time and it seems that my answer has cheered him up a
little bit (at least this is what he was saying to me). He was NOT responsible
for the high price of the Millennium
booster and I think it's the right time now to write about things that are more
positive.
From:
Mats Nordlinder Was the Keep originally a lot
> longer, but edited for the sake of the attention span of the audience?
>
> -Joe
From:
'tom george'
From:
'Alan Benson'
Subject: Re: Guestbook's Hitler Comparer Refuses to Recant
Heiko wrote:
> Steven Feldman wrote:
>
>> Well, the TD guestbook is back up -- but with nearly every single
>> KEEP-related comment excised! :) Curiously, though, a dialog
>> has been going on between the guy who compared Hitler to Edgar
>> -- and the site's Webmaster. Here's the exchange, so far (the
>> comparer is posting to the site under the names 'Sun tsu,' 'Reply
>> to Heiko,' the 'Great Pacifier,' and 'Brain dead'):
>
> Hi Steven,
>
> here's Heiko, the guy who wants to be the first in line to give 'The
> Great Pacifier' a huge kick in the a*s!' ;-) I got a reply to my posting
> from the person who's responsible for running the TD guestbook,
> saying that my comparison to Orwells' '1984' was hard stuff. I was
> very surprised that I received not only a response from him in the
> guestbook, but also personally. I won't tell in detail what he said to me
> (which was a lot), but I can only give the well-meant advice (to people
> who are making entries to the Guestbook) to be a bit more friendly to
> him (this includes me as well ;-). I found him a *very* friendly person
> who spends a lot of time (more than he can actually afford, since this
> is not his full-time job) and also a lot of his own money for keeping the
> TD pages alive and informative. Since the 'Keep' debate began a few
> weeks ago he had a very stressful time and it seems that my answer
> has cheered him up a little bit (at least this is what he was saying to
> me). He was NOT responsible for the high price of the Millennium
> booster and I think it's the right time now to write about things that
> are more positive.
___________________________________________________________________
PPS: To Simon, You leave 'Risky Business' alone - LOL
I remember like it was yesterday sitting in the 'sweet
spot', and saying to myself, 'I've got to get everything
these guys ever did!' Why, if it wasn't 'Risky Business'
then I wouldn't have written this:
Message: 8
Date: Fri, 9 Jul 1999 06:25:03 -0700
From: 'Alan Benson'
Subject: Re: NEW INTEREST.
(On July 09, 1999 / 'Carl the Preacher' wrote: // Tadream digest #137):
>> It would be interesting to know how many on the list have only been aware
>> of TD for say one year, and how many like myself have been listening to
>> them for ever.
>>
>> JUST A THOUGHT
>>
>> The Preacher.
> Hi Carl (and everyone else!),
>
> Being somewhat of a pack rat (an understatement), I somehow
> managed to keep all my old receipts for my first TD purchases (back
> in March of 1987). The first CD purchased was 'The Photographer'
> music by Philip Glass (still follow him to this day). However, this is
> the 'Tangerine Dream OneList Digest' and after purchasing TD's
> 'Risky Business' -- I simply went on an eternal quest to devour
> literally everything that I could lay my hands on. Now, some fourteen
> years later and with over 1,000 pieces of TD in my collection this is
> how I began (yes, I still have the original 3 x 5 index card listing the
> first seventeen CDs below):
>
> 1) 'Risky Business' (03/13/87) Tower Records.
> 2) 'Force Majeure' (03/15/87) Leopolds Records.
> 3) 'Underwater Sunlight' (04/20/87) Tower Records.
> 4) 'Stratosfear' (04/25/87) Tower Records.
> 5) 'Thief' (05/01/87) North Side Records.
> 6) 'Green Desert' (05/12/87) Tower Records.
> 7) 'The Collection' (05/21/87) Tower Records.
> 8) 'Le Parc' (06/05/87) Rasputin Records.
> 9) 'White Eagle' (06/05/87) Rasputin Records.
> 10) 'Dream Sequence' (06/06/87) Rasputin Records.
> 11) 'Logos Live' (06/11/87) Rasputin Records.
> 12) 'Hyperborea' (06/11/97) Rasputin Records.
> 13) 'Encore' (06/11/87)The Wherehouse.
> 14) 'Tangram' (06/13/87) Rasputin Records.
> 15) 'Phaedra' (06/13/87) Rasputin Records.
> 16) 'Ricochet' (06/13/87) Rasputin Records.
> 17) 'Rubycon' (06/13/87) The Wherehouse.
> 18) 'Exit' (07/03/87) Tower Records.
>
> with much more to follow... (he-he!).
>
> One last thing, the ICQ is a great little program. I've had the
> pleasure to talk with many of the subscribers of all the various
> TD list using this interface. As a matter of fact, Carl and I talk
> all the time! Many thanks to Simon Clarke (for getting me to
> download the program) and Jeff Stevenson (who took me through
> my first baby steps in setting up a chat module). There are some
> mornings that it just wouldn't be the same without a fresh 'Good
> Morning!' to and from our fearless leader: Joe Shoults.
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Alan Benson
> TD Diehard
> Berkeley, CA / USA
> ICQ# 38105655 (aka: Malthrope).
_________________________________________________________________
P.S. Made four tech corrections in the New Interest story:
1) Added a cap 'D' to make TD.
2) Added an 'r' to make the word: first.
3) Deleted an extra parenthesis.
4) Added one period (.).
_________________________________________________________________
Final postscripts this message:
OK -- back to my 'labor of love' of TD chores which are many...
To all (you know who you are) TD packages and follow-ups out
-- SOON! It seems that this holiday season is just going to be
a one big 'bah humbug' for me as the WCAB court date is now
postponed until January 2000. Thanks to all for your kind words
and sincere thoughts as always! :-)))
***************************************************************************
__________________________________________
NetZero - Defenders of the Free World
Get your FREE Internet Access and Email at
http://www.netzero.net/download/index.html
Replies
Name/Email
Yahoo! ID
Date
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19453
Re: New Title: Positive Remarks on the TDI Guestb
Gustavo Jobim
Sun
11/28/1999
1 KB
From:
Ken Beal
From:
'Jeffrey Au Yeung' From: Ken Beal
>
> Howdy...
>
> Hopefully someone out there can answer this one...
>
> I have a cassette by Hans-Joachim Roedelius. It is a Promo. Virgin
> Records America and the only number on it is 4-90652. There is no
> date printed anywhere. Does anyone know anything about this?
>
> The music is, from what I can tell, pleasant with piano and some
> horns. There are other instruments, but I don't know what they are.
>
> Track list:
> Side A
> I'm Frugtau
> Leicht Zu Fuss
> Anima Mundi
> Uber Den Wolken
>
> Side 2
> Aufgewacht
> Capriccio
> Guten Morgen
> Am Weiher
> Pas De Deux
>
> Anyway...if anyone can help...
>
> Thanks,
>
> Ken
> **********************************************
> The box said 'Requires Windows 95, or better.'
> So I bought a Macintosh.
> **********************************************
> To avoid disappointment, lower expectations.
>
> > Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing original
messages in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed from this list), send
a blank e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
> Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
>
>
From:
KMu9978842@xxx.xxx
Date: Fri Nov 26, 1999 7:29
am
Subject: Re: [ElectronicMusic] Hans-Joachim Roedelius
Hi Ken,
The album is 'momenti felici', from 1987.
Released by Virgin through their Venture label (VE 4).
All music by Roedelius, (A.Czjzek was saxaphone co-author on Anima Mundi,
guten Morgen and Pas de deux), recorded at home and at A.Czjzek`s studio in
Vienna.
Mixed and mastered at the Hit box studio in Vienna by E.Spitzer-Marlyn.
Kelvin Munson
From:
'Poulton, Larry'
About Hieronymous Bosch!?!?!?
Cool!
gfj.
>>From what I recall it was supposed to be a film about Hieronymus Bosch...
>
>> -----O
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing original
messages in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed from this list), send
a blank e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
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From:
'Michael A Jean' From: 'Poulton, Larry'
>
> Latecomer here.
>
> Are we talking about Heath Robinson - an English sculptor who made wierd
> sculpture contraptions out of metal. The term Heath Robinson is now
> synonymous with a mechanical contraption looking ugly and amaturish.
>
> Larry
From:
'Michael A Jean'
From:
'Michael A Jean'
From:
'Michael A Jean'
http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=208106309
I am just putting this up on ebay if anyone is interested...Another item
from THE CLOSET!
Regards,
Michael A. Jean
Community email addresses:
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From:
DJS
> From: 'Poulton, Larry'
>
> Latecomer here.
>
> Are we talking about Heath Robinson - an English sculptor who made wierd
> sculpture contraptions out of metal. The term Heath Robinson is now
> synonymous with a mechanical contraption looking ugly and amaturish.
What a coincidence. That describes TD's current output very well.
--
Dan J. Schulte
Rakinik Intertype-http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Dungeon/2140/
Progressive Electronic Music
http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/12/dan_j_schulte.html
From:
Alexander Bjelke
From:
Gustavo Jobim PHAEDRA VI 2010
Interesting fact, Phaedra was the tenth release from Virgin!
Gustavo Ferreira Jobim
gustavfj@m...
gustavfj@n...
Replies
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Date
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19420
Re: 'VI 2010' Re: 7 old VIRGIN LPs
TOMX01@xxx.xxx
Fri
11/26/1999
1 KB
From:
TOMX01@xxx.xxx
Date: Fri Nov 26, 1999 10:44
pm
Subject: Re: 'VI 2010' Re: 7 old VIRGIN LPs
Yes Phaedra was Virgins 10th release but only the 2nc to chart.
Tom (Melrose)
From:
'Lawry Simm'
From:
Steven Feldman Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 10:32:08 +0100
>Subject: Re: Alternate versions for the Keep (Re: [tadream]
> Know-it-All Fanboys: Legends in Their Own Minds)
>From: Tangerine Dream mailing list
>Really-From: Mats Nordlinder
>
>Try this !
>
>http://us.imdb.com/AlternateVersions?0085780
Wow! I hadn't seen the middle one before! Thanks!!!!!!
Okay, I'll share. Here it is:
o A strangely edited version that appeared on Channel 39 in Houston, TX
around 1989 had a scene where Glenn is telling Magda that it has been
so long that he couldn't remember what he looked like anymore. That
version ended with Glenn alive at the bottom of the gorge, wounded
after his battle with Molasar, crawling to the stream there and seeing
his reflection.
From:
Steven Feldman Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 10:43:30 +0100
>Subject: Re: [tadream] Guestbook's Hitler Comparer Refuses to Recant
>From: Tangerine Dream mailing list
>Really-From: 'Heiko Heer=DFen'
>
>I got a reply to my posting from the person who's responsible for
>running the TD guestbook, saying that my comparison to Orwells' '1984'
>was hard stuff. [. . .]
Hard yet, accurate, and totally appropriate.
>[. . .] Since the 'Keep' debate began a few weeks ago he had a very
>stressful time [. . .]
What, and you and/or he think(s) *we didn't*?!? Its *our* bundles
of $180.00, you know!
Seeing as the TD Guestbook's Webmaster didn't have the common
courtesy to tell anyone what the press run was and/or what the contents
of the pressing were, I would say that he himself contributed to much
of the angst and knashing of teeth re the new KEEP CD . . . and if it
was beyond his control because he himself didn't know -- fine -- I'll
blame it on Edgar.
Now that I know what the press run is and what the contents are,
I am entirely becalmed -- largely because I won't have to buy the
damned thing.
-- Steven Feldman
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
When you try to snort a book up your nose instead of actually reading it,
you get a mess like Mann's 'The Keep.' -- F. Paul Wilson, April 29, 1999
From:
'Lawry Simm'
Date: Sat Nov 27, 1999 9:31
am
Subject: Discussion Weeks Provisional Schedule (2nd draft)
Remember, I'm aiming at recording dates rather than release dates
wherever possible, so as to better represent the chronological
development of TD. However, in the case of modified releases (such as
Sohoman), they will appear by release date. Some soundtracks are based
on the release date of the film as recording dates are unspecified.
Most notably are 1983 -1985 where things were often released out of
recording order...
All dates taken from 'Mysterious Semblance - A Tangerine Dream
Chronology' by Scott Plumer.
- Week 12 - Cyclone (Studio)
- Week 13 - Force Majeure (Studio)
- Week 14 - Quichotte / Pergamon (Live)
- Week 15 - Tangram (Studio)
- Week 16 - Thief (Soundtrack)
- Week 17 - Exit (Studio)
- Week 18 - White Eagle (Studio)
- Week 19 - Logos (Live)
- Week 20 - Risky Business (Soundtrack) / Wavelength (Soundtrack)
- Week 21 - Hyperborea (Studio)
- Week 22 - Poland (Live)
- Week 23 - Firestarter (Soundtrack)
- Week 24 - Heartbreakers (Soundtrack) / Flashpoint (Soundtrack)
- Week 25 - Le Parc (Studio)
- Week 26 - The Park Is Mine (Soundtrack) / Legend (Soundtrack)
- Week 27 - Underwater Sunlight (Studio)
- Week 28 - Tyger (Studio)
- Week 29 - Deadly Care (Soundtrack) / Canyon Dreams (Soundtrack)
- Week 30 - Three O'clock High (Soundtrack) / Near Dark (Soundtrack)
- Week 31 - Shy People (Soundtrack) / Dead Solid Perfect (Soundtrack)
- Week 32 - Livemiles (Live)
- Week 33 - Optical Race (Studio)
- Week 34 - Miracle Mile (Soundtrack)
- Week 35 - Lily On The Beach (Studio)
- Week 36 - Catch Me If You Can (Soundtrack) / Destination Berlin
(Soundtrack) / The Man Inside (L'Affaire Walraff) (Soundtrack)
- Week 37 - Melrose (Studio)
- Week 38 - Rockoon (Studio)
- Week 39 - 220 Volt Live (Live)
- Week 40 - Turn Of The Tides (Studio)
- Week 41 - Tyranny Of Beauty (Studio)
- Week 42 - Tangents (Disc 5 Only) (Studio) / Rumpelstiltskin
(Soundtrack)
- Week 43 - The Dream Mixes (Studio)
- Week 44 - Zoning (Soundtrack)
- Week 45 - Goblin's Club (Studio)
- Week 46 - Oasis (Soundtrack)
- Week 47 - Tournado (Live)
- Week 48 - Timesquare (Dream Mixes II) (Studio)
- Week 49 - The Keep (Soundtrack)
- Week 50 - Ambient Monkeys (Studio)
- Week 51 - Dream Encores (Live)
- Week 52 - Hollywood Years (Vol. 1) (Studio) / Hollywood Years (Vol.
2) (Studio)
- Week 53 - Quinoa (Extended) (Studio)
- Week 54 - Transsiberia (Soundtrack)
- Week 55 - Valentine Wheels (Live)
- Week 56 - Sohoman (Live)
- Week 57 - What A Blast (Soundtrack)
- Week 58 - Mars Polaris (Studio)
- Week 59 - and subsequent... any released material between now and
then.
Due to combining certain soundtracks that were adjacent to each other
chronologically into one week, I have cut this schedule to be 10 weeks
shorter than before (still just over one years worth of discussions
though!)
Please study this list and post any comments or suggestions...
Thanks,
Lawry
lawrysimm@u...
ICQ # 23267226
Instant Messenger - lawrysimm
From:
'Lawry Simm'
From:
Derk
From:
Christian Villazón
Check out this really cool software at www.napster.com.....
It enables us to share our mp3 files really easily. Its absolutly great!
I'm downloading Electronic Orgy now......
Alexander
Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing original
messages in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed from this list), send
a blank e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
From:
'James Horecka, AIA'
From:
'Marcel Engels'
From:
Alexander Bjelke
> I've dowloaded napster and it is excellent, but I'd like to know where did
>you find Electronic Orgy? I'd like to know, Thanks.
Well, since you download from people who are online the mp3's are
constantly changing. Sometimes you're lucky and can download a whole lot from
other TD fans. When searching on TD you usually get a whole lot from a
single person,
or none at all. Hopefully more TD fans will use napster so that the fan
base can increase......
Happy downloading!
Alexander
From:
'Michael A Jean'
From:
'Michael A Jean'
From:
SCRIBE1964@xxx.xxx
Date: Sat Nov 27, 1999 6:52
pm
Subject: Re: The Keep movie
> Well, I got my VHS copy of 'The Keep' in the mail Wednesday, and watched it
> Friday. Picked it up at an ebay auction.
>
> Bleah. Must be one of the choppiest flicks I have ever seen. Others in the
> room watching walked out after the first 15 minutes, leaving just me to sit
> through it to the end.
Yeah, it's an awful movie. I saw it when it was first released theatrically.
I was a big fan of 'Thief,' so was dying to see this new movie directed by
Michael Mann and scored by TD. God, what a disappointment. I wonder if Mann
has ever commented on it in interviews. I've given the film a second and
third try, too. Just to see if there's something there I missed. But it
remains a mess IMHO.
--Scribe
From:
Rainer Rutka
From:
TOMX01@xxx.xxx
Date: Sat Nov 27, 1999 8:00
pm
Subject: D: Studio [Cyclone]
Cyclone 1978
1) Bent Cold Sidewalk
Opens with a vocoder style speech intro, revisited by Pink Floyd a year later
on the Animals album.
Then the main section .. well what can you say, the same three chords over
and over again with some very nebulous lyrics on top. One can certainly
understand the negative reaction to this album. I can't help but feel that if
they had put Madrigal Meridian on the A side of the record they would have
gone some way to getting away with it.
Anyway 4.20 things change, a more typical TD sequence is introduced, and for
those who didn't stop playing the record after two minutes in abject shock
over the opening lyrical section, may well be rewarded with quite a strong TD
track.
I also have to point out that at this time Virgin boss Richard Branson was
also trying to push his other instrumental artist, Mike Oldfield in the
direction of shorter tracks and songs also.
2) Rising Runner
I recently played this track to a friend of mine who is very into progressive
rock music such as Yes and Rush. He was very impressed. I guess even Edgar
and Chris on their 'off' days produced better music than most. When I first
had this CD in the late eighties I never used to play the first two tracks,
however recent reflection since buying the SBM version is rather more
positive. Defiantly a grower this track, at least give it a chance =)
3) Madrigal Meridian
The opening, a common TD phase shift effect, probably better done on Force
Majeure IMO. The almost toneless striking noise that slowly morphs into a
striking chord is interesting I think rather than just introducing a striking
chord as in Sequent C and such the like. I'm sure most are very familiar with
this track so I won't dwell too much on the piece.
Overall I would have to say that Cyclone has grown on me very much after
giving it a few plays over the last year. Maybe as Edgar put it, it is a
failed experiment, but like Phaedra was to Rubycon, this was an important
stepping stone to Force Majeure which I know is in manys top 3 TD releases.
But thats another story.
As far as I remember, Cyclone didn't sell much worse than the surrounding TD
releases, although this of course would have had a lot to do with the
extensive touring at the time. Cyclone, certainly not in my top 10 but I
think I could probably think of ten that I like less.
Best Regards To All
Tom (Melrose)
P.S. Roll on Force Majeure =)
Replies
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Date
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19463
D: Studio [Cyclone]
Simon Slator
Mon
11/29/1999
1 KB
19464
D: Studio [Cyclone]
Poulton, Larry
Mon
11/29/1999
2 KB
19466
D: Studio [Cyclone]
Synthhtnys@a...
Mon
11/29/1999
2 KB
19469
Re: D: Studio [Cyclone]
Heiko Heerßen
Mon
11/29/1999
2 KB
19470
Re: D: Studio [Cyclone]
Gustavo Jobim
Mon
11/29/1999
1 KB
19484
D: Studio [Cyclone]
Nigbur D
Tue
11/30/1999
4 KB
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Tue
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D: Studio [Cyclone]
Quarlie@xxx.xxx
Sat
12/4/1999
7 KB
From:
'Paul Fellows' De : 'Glenn Folkvord (JMJ FKN)'
>À :
>Objet : [tadream] Latest news?
>Date : Jeu 25 nov 1999 15:16
>
>From: 'Glenn Folkvord (JMJ FKN)'
>
>Hey,
>
>Can someone please tell me the next known concerts/projects/releases from
>TD, which will be commonly available? Or direct me to a good and up-to-date
>news site?
>
>I am compiling info for a new emusic website, so some in-depth info would
>be highly appreciated.
>
>all the best,
>glenn
>
>>Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing original
>messages in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed from this list), send
>a blank e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
>Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
>
From:
'Michael A Jean' -----Original Message-----
> From: SCRIBE1964@a... [mailto:SCRIBE1964@a...]
> Sent: Saturday, November 27, 1999 12:53 PM
> To: tadream@o...
> Subject: Re: [tadream] The Keep movie
>
>
> From: SCRIBE1964@a...
>
> > Well, I got my VHS copy of 'The Keep' in the mail Wednesday,
> and watched it
> > Friday. Picked it up at an ebay auction.
> >
> > Bleah. Must be one of the choppiest flicks I have ever seen.
> Others in the
> > room watching walked out after the first 15 minutes, leaving
> just me to sit
> > through it to the end.
>
> Yeah, it's an awful movie. I saw it when it was first released
> theatrically.
> I was a big fan of 'Thief,' so was dying to see this new movie
> directed by
> Michael Mann and scored by TD. God, what a disappointment. I
> wonder if Mann
> has ever commented on it in interviews. I've given the film a second and
> third try, too. Just to see if there's something there I missed. But it
> remains a mess IMHO.
>
> --Scribe
>
> > Please practice listserv etiquette by appropriately editing
> original messages in your replies. TO UNSUBSCRIBE (be removed
> from this list), send a blank e-mail to tadream-unsubscribe@o...
> Website: http://tadream.copfer.com
>
>
From:
Rainer Rutka
From:
Rainer Rutka
From:
Rainer Rutka
From:
Rainer Rutka
From:
Rainer Rutka
From:
'Glenn Folkvord (JMJ FKN)' Hi Glenn,
>
>This site has lots of information about all official Tangerine Dream and
>Edgar Froese albums and singles, and is updated regularly:
>
>http://perso.club-internet.fr/pfellows/webpages/index.html
>
>You can find details of future albums at the following address:
>
>http://perso.club-internet.fr/pfellows/catalogthumbs/cataloguepage_6.htm
>
>Cheers
>
>Paul
From:
Chris Richards >
Not quite. Animals was released in January 77.
Either way, it hardly matters as Kraftwerk had
used a vocoder before either of them, on Autobahn
(and probably even earlier).
I've been very lax about posting my thoughts on
these albums, but I will try and come up with
something in the coming days.
=====
May you never thirst!
The Scuba Diver Presently Known As Chris
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place.
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Replies
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Date
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19579
Cyclone
colin_anderson@xxxxx.xxx
Sun
12/5/1999
2 KB
23179
Re: Cyclone
Chris Richards
Thu
7/6/2000
3 KB
23180
Re: Cyclone
Brian Stewart
Thu
7/6/2000
2 KB
30152
Re: Cyclone
John Marchington
Sat
11/17/2001
3 KB
30158
Cyclone and Rising Runner (the meaning!) Re: [tad
Gustavo Jobim
Sat
11/17/2001
4 KB
30175
Re: Cyclone
rubyconist@y...
Mon
11/19/2001
3 KB
30154
Re: Cyclone
mengels@w...
Sat
11/17/2001
3 KB
31742
Cyclone
John Vertical
Tue
1/29/2002
3 KB
31758
Re: Cyclone
orangefunk_2000
Tue
1/29/2002
3 KB
From:
Klaus Beschorner Bleah. Must be one of the choppiest flicks I have ever seen. Others
>in the,room watching walked out after the first 15 minutes, leaving
>just me to sit,through it to the end.
--
Klaus.Beschorner........................work....+49-7033-45683
Drosselweg.6............................fax.....+49-7033-45631
D-71120.Grafenau........................Mobile.+49-171-7338969
Germany.................................home....+49-7033-45142
............................................http://www.caby.de
From:
Klaus Beschorner
From:
'Jens Peschke'
From:
Synthhtnys@xxx.xxx
Date: Sun Nov 28, 1999 11:34
am
Subject: D: studio ;-) ok, ok live.... whatever.... ENCORE!!!!!! ENCORE!!!!!!
Late posting, I know, I know, but hey,
the fricking holidays are on us........ as in avalanche.
Peter Baumann, Edgar Froese, and Chris..............Franke
otherwell known as ... TANGERINE DREAM!!!!
(otherwell?)
Encore is simply put my single favorite (official) live
TD album (Logos a very close second). It was the third
album I had bought from them. I got it the day it came out,
and I was still very much astounded at this new world I had
found in music. There was nothing like it. your mind could fly
anywhere with it unfettered of anything concrete, like lyrics
with a story, which tend to lead your mind to a certain place.
Peter Baumann named his label Private Music, which I have
always felt to be a good description of this type of music, as
it doesn't function in the same way most music functions.
It always struck me as a very personal experience. Even in
a live situation it's more about drawing you inward than some
pretentious posturing, hair-flinging-guitarist-as-athlete trying
to get from one end of the fretboard to the other as fast as
humanly possible show. (sorry, I just had a bad flashback
of '80's butt-rock) This was the swan-song of the Baumann
era, but what a song! I bought this in cassette format as I was
staying with my sister at the time, and had a small cassette
player with me. Some part of me revisits the kid playing this quietly
at night while his spirit flew off into unknown regions.
I was fascinated by the account someone posted a while back
where sections were found to be from other concerts than the
ones listed (Seattle Wa., Portland Or. USA) and some of it
was done in the studio. I'm not real surprised and I have to note
that this was very common practice for the music industry in the
'70's, in fact, MOST so-called live albums from the '70's were
fabricated in the studio with applause added later...
I won't go into too much detail on the songs, but do have to say
that Coldwater Canyon is my favorite piece, and it always seemed
to stand out to me as unique. I'm not aware of anything they've
done that resembles this piece, whereas the rest of the album
is on fairly familiar ground.
A very fiery moment in their recorded history.
I'm not the biggest fan of Froese's guitar playing, but this was
surely a peak moment....sublime!
Poly
From:
Rainer Rutka From: Klaus Beschorner